Why are or aren't you an NMLRA member?

[Black Hand]

IMO - The NMLRA is not a business, they make nothing, they offer many things/programs for the ML community, don't discriminate any type of ML and are a source of information for many. BS - might not have been the best response, so I apologize. It is a huge Volunteer organization - like many non-profit organizations (with a small office staff that manage some of the programs - I find them incredibly helpful). You don't see their Volunteers, field reps, etc. out asking for $$$ like many other non-profits, they just try to promote and educate people about ML. They really do a lot when you read some of the previous post and for the number of members for the amount of revenue.
All is good.

http://www.nonprofitfacts.com/IN/National-Muzzle-Loading-Rifle-Association.html
In 2013:
Assets - $2,311,459
Income - $1,696,412
Expenses - $1,574,785
Employees - 74
See link for more data.

To say they make nothing is just a little inaccurate....

 

[Gene L]

all of them were inlines. Not by design, but due to that is what he had left when he closed his retail shop.

Inline or traditional, they both shoot bp, load from the muzzle. A trigger pull is better than no trigger pull. Opportunities are where you find them.

Fleener

Which illustrates the difference between this site and the NMLRA. I know at least three people who own inlines, and they took up their version of ML merely to increase their season. No love for the tradition of the sport. How could you love an inline rifle? They're disposable and yet they're promoted by the NMLRA.

 

[Carbon 6]

I can't help but wonder if using a modern muzzleloader to introduce someone to muzzleloading isn't a bad idea. Considering that many people who have a deep love for muzzleloaders fall in love with their first muzzleloader.
I'm curious what the retention rate would be among such a group of young minds. Do they fall in love with muzzleloading and run out and buy an inline or traditional ?

 

[CTShooter]

Buck Buchanan
Field Rep - NC
What charter clubs are Connecticut? (FYI, the link from the web site for CT, isn't a working link)
Why don't field reps contact potential members when asked?
If the organization is about supporting and promoting muzzleloader, where are they?
I would be thrilled to have charter clubs and promotion in CT, I would be thrilled to be contacted by a local field rep.
None of those things have happened despite my repeated requests.
Maybe as a field rep, you should go back to the organization and let them and your fellow field reps know there are issues and do something about it.

 

[Black Hand]

Do they...run out and buy an inline or traditional ?

Depends upon whether (or not) they have a good mentor or are listening to the uninformed salesperson at the gun store...

 

[Carbon 6]

Depends upon whether (or not) they have a good mentor or are listening to the uninformed salesperson at the gun store...

Not to insult anyone, but I have a hard time envisioning a "good mentor" starting someone off with an inline and expecting them to regress to traditional. It just defies all logic to me.

 

[Black Hand]

Not to insult anyone, but I have a hard time envisioning a "good mentor" starting someone off with an inline and expecting them to regress to traditional. It just defies all logic to me.

I did not suggest that a good mentor starts them with an inline. In my opinion, a good mentor will teach the person what they best understand. Now, I wouldn't use an inline to get a kid into this hobby, but others may not have or understand there are other options. Ultimately, it is the underlying motivation (and knowledge) that determines direction...

 

[Carbon 6]

I know you weren't suggesting it. You were rationalizing it, and I'm having difficulty accepting any rationale involving the use of inlines to promote traditional muzzleloading.

 

[Black Hand]

I know you weren't suggesting it. You were rationalizing it, and I'm having difficulty accepting any rationale involving the use of inlines to promote traditional muzzleloading.

No - my point was that a good traditional mentor will steer their students toward historical guns while the gun store clerk will try to sell you the most expensive inline because their job is to make a profit for the store (and that many couldn't tell the difference anyway)...

 

[Carbon 6]

I agree, but would a "good traditional mentor" expose a group of young individuals to traditional muzzleloading using a modern inline ?

"Good" is both subjective and extremely rare.

 

[Black Hand]

I agree, but would a "good traditional mentor" expose a group of young individuals to traditional muzzleloading using a modern inline ?

"Good" is both subjective and extremely rare.

Traditional and modern are mutually exclusive, at least in this specific case. Good is subjective and rare indeed.
But, as to the donor of the inlines - I would accept the gift in the spirit in which it was given. The guns could be sold/traded for more traditional versions if desired.

For the event that I help organize, we used some of the profits from registration to purchase Lyman/TC rifles (don't remember which) that we use for the shooting. We strive to invest every $ of profit into the participants and paying the costs (food, "blue houses", shooting supplies, other). Are they the most traditional guns? No. But they do the job...

 

[Carbon 6]

I don't have a problem with the gift or the spirit. It was very generous. It's the use of the gift I question.

Certainly they could be used in training, but shouldn't shooters graduate to that level instead of starting there ?
Seems backwards to me.

I mean, If you take 100 newbies and introduce them to muzzleloading using inlines. How many will likely progress to traditional muzzleloaders ?
Think about the percentages and individual takeaways.

 

[Carbon 6]

For the novice, muzzleloaders can be intimidating. Starting someone off with a modern inline still leaves traditional muzzleloaders as intimidating. The gain was virtually zero.

 

[52Bore]

Blackhand - they have less than 10 employees, including maintenance of 2. Always been that way in 30 years I’ve attended. 74 shows the inaccuracy of the data.
The assets might be $2m with 500+ acres and buildings. They have 16k members, a few thou lifetime, so even at $40/year for all 16k = $640k.

 

[Black Hand]

Blackhand - they have less than 10 employees, including maintenance of 2. Always been that way in 30 years I’ve attended. 74 shows the inaccuracy of the data.
The assets might be $2m with 500+ acres and buildings. They have 16k members, a few thou lifetime, so even at $40/year for all 16k = $640k.

Even if they have only 10 employees, the profits & assets demonstrate they are in business to make money. Just because you are a non-profit doesn't mean you aren't making a profit....

 

[fleener]

I think some put to much importance on if it is an inline or not an inline. They are not evil. Do you look at your favorite .22 rifle with disdain?

When I started shooting it was not a ML. It was an old .22 rifle and .410 shotgun and I still have both of them. My first ML rifle was a Lyman deerstalker to be able to hunt in the extended ML season in Iowa. Picked that up when I was in my mid 20's.

I have highwall, lowwalls, lever actions, falling blocks, modern high powers, modern shotguns, semiauto's original ML's, contemporary traditional ML's, and inlines.

I bet that there are very few people on this forum that can say that they only have traditional ML's, no other more modern rifle, shotgun or pistol. Nothing wrong with that, just making a point.

I have helped several inline shooters covert over to a nice traditional style rifle. A good buddy of mine and a big inline shooter showed up to my rendezvous with his inline. I dont discriminate. The next year he came back with a flintlock. All you got to do is expose a shooter to a traditional ML. Gun nuts are gun nuts.

Some of you guys seem to think that once you have shot an inline that there is no hope of those people ever becoming a traditional ML shooter. The world must be flat.

I no longer belong to a public range, but when I did I would always load up my rifle and let those guys that showed in an interest in what I was shooting take a shot.

At Friendship I hang out at the long range rifle area. It is very common to have people hanging out and watching you hit the steel plate at 500 yards. I cant tell you how many times we take those people watching and let them try their hand at the 500 yard target. I know of 3 them that have become long range shooters now. You wont know if you dont try.

When I teach the ML portion of hunters ed to the kids and adults I get swamped with people at break wanting to play with my traditional rifles and shoguns that I bring for show and tell. No one is fighting to put their finger prints over the inline that I bring.

I shot deer this year with a flintlock for the first time, a original 12 bore ML rifle and a inline. If my old 38-55 lever rifle was legal, I would of used it as well.

Shooters like to shoot.

Fleener

 

[Black Hand]

If you want to shoot an inline, that is your business. I do have a problem when they are allowed during a "Traditional" firearms seasons just because they load from the muzzle....

 

[52Bore]

Blackhand: if 74 is way off and the main source of revinue is maybe $640k. Doubtful the published income and expenses are accurate from this source as well.

 

[Black Hand]

Blackhand: if 74 is way off and the main source of revinue is maybe $640k. Doubtful the published income and expenses are accurate from this source as well.

Non-profits are required to report their earnings and make them available to the public. Unless you are on the Board of Directors and see the earnings yourself, I'll accept the documents on file.

 

[Carbon 6]

Blackhand: if 74 is way off and the main source of revinue is maybe $640k. Doubtful the published income and expenses are accurate from this source as well.

Are you suggesting that they fudged the numbers ?
#follow the money.