Why only one?

[Cliffdweller]

A very interesting discussion, and I don't know what we are allowed to do in Montana during our special nine-day muzzleloader season. The country that I hunt at this time has also a few bears and many mountain lions, and when I archery hunt during archery season I am allowed to carry a pistol for protection, and most everyone knows you can't finish off and archery wounded big-game animal with your pistol. There is some fish and wildlife meetings coming up in Montana and I will bring this question up about carrying a pistol during muzzleloader season.
Squint

Yes sir, same here, we CAN carry a pistol during archery season as well and of course you can't dispatch a deer with it but I can definitely nock an arrow WAY faster than I can reload a muzzleloader (and I don't think am too slow at that either) We do have bears and bobcats ,granted I haven't come across one yet but I have seen plenty of tracks and have a friend who traps them in the area where I hunt. Plus Ive had huge coyotes come 20 ft from me while hunting, just saying you never know when there may be a rabid animal even. And for those who think they ONLY NEED ONE SHOT (all the time) well then next rifle season don't load 6 in your bolt action (or whatever you hunt with) To think that every shot you take wether at game or at the range is "perfect" is living in fantasy land ,not that we don't strive for our best shooting. ........But anyways thats my point if you can carry a pistol during archery season (which has NOTHING to do with a 'firearm') then why not the muzzleloading season?

 

[mkabe]

Sorry , these are Vermont State reg's. Ya know the state that hardly has any gun laws hahaha. No permit to carry concealed or open. So Kansas does not limit you to one muzzleloading gun in the hunting season?

Right, no limit that I can find. I specifically ask about a pistol carried along with a rifle and he said fine as long as if used to dispatch a deer it met the same requirements as all muzzleloaders.

 

[Cliffdweller]

Right, no limit that I can find. I specifically ask about a pistol carried along with a rifle and he said fine as long as if used to dispatch a deer it met the same requirements as all muzzleloaders.

See THAT makes sense to me and that sounds fine. I just think I should be able to have a ML pistol while hunting with a rifle. Not like I want to carry something with a 10 round mag etc etc just another single shot for what ever reason. The reason is irrelevant. So it sounds like Kansas got it right

 

[mkabe]

See THAT makes sense to me and that sounds fine. I just think I should be able to have a ML pistol while hunting with a rifle. Not like I want to carry something with a 10 round mag etc etc just another single shot for what ever reason. The reason is irrelevant. So it sounds like Kansas got it right

Kansas hunters can carry a modern cartridge handgun but they better not use it to hunt or dispatch a deer.

 

[beardedhorse]

Although there have been early breech loading black powder guns (Lorenzoni, Puckle, Hall, Fergusson) they certainly have not been around since the inception of muzzle loaders. They're in most states not legal to use during a ml big game season. Hunters worked very hard to introduce and legalize a ml big game season in Colorado. We fought against having in lines accepted but lost due to a threatened lawsuit from an out of state in line maker. I applaud those states that have since outlawed the use of in line muzzle loaders. If one feels they have to have a "security blanket" back up, let them carry a second rifle. Maybe works in a tree stand or blind you can drive or take a short hike to. Would get heavy and old real quick.

Party hunting is illegal here but if your hunting partner /s had a valid license for big game why couldn't one borrow his/her/their loaded ml for the second shot to anchor a wounded animal? If I were mentoring a young beginning hunter who wounded an animal, I would offer him/her
my rifle to finish it off. Otherwise if there was time, let him or her reload and track.

You're suppose to carry your own rifle and not have a gun bearer tote an extra for you. During ml big game season you must have a valid license to carry a big game caliber rifle or smoothbore. I had several close encounters of the moose kind during rut in ml season and would have felt more secure with a second quick shot. I did not have a moose tag, would not have shot it but would feel pretty foolish standing 15 - 2- yards from a bull moose with an empty gun after firing into the air to frighten it away. Could not carry my Dirty Harry for back up. Most bull moose don't frighten easily. Same with cows with calves.
If you disagree and don't like the laws in your state, try to get them changed. If the laws are so restrictive and stupid, think about moving to another one with better regulations. Or be pro active in safe guarding your hunting privileges and rights. "You don't always get want you want but if you settle for anything less than what you need, you deserve what you get." - I said that

 

[Two Elks]

But do you see a reason to not?

Try to ask your state DNR. One phone call should get you the offical state reason. Makes no sense to me also.

 

[Cliffdweller]

There's no room in my day pack. That grease gun takes up a lot of space.

I did and I got a response but not an answer, the response was : years ago when getting a ML season they had to limit it to one to get it to pass. Huh?!?! That didn’t tell me why! That just told me that they don’t know either! Followed by a copy and paste of the ML reg’s. I know the reg’s, I DO know how to read!! B.S.

 

[Jay Templin]

Here in Virginia it’s illegal to carry an unmentionable firearm during the archery or muzzleloader seasons EXCEPT that those of us with CHPs can carry an unmentionable handgun as long as we don’t use it for hunting.
Jay

 

[Elzay]

In Wyoming the muzzleloader season is also handgun season but only for pronghorn. No muzzleloader season for any other species.

 

[mkabe]

Here in Virginia it’s illegal to carry an unmentionable firearm during the archery or muzzleloader seasons EXCEPT that those of us with CHPs can carry an unmentionable handgun as long as we don’t use it for hunting.
Jay

Same in Kansas. Except here we don’t need the concealed handgun permit, just can’t use it to hunt or dispatch a wounded animal.

 

[BillRob]

I think it has little to do with ethics, the important thing is that they can tell you what you can and can't do. I've lived in several different states and have never met a game and fish warden that I liked and that was easy to deal with.

I live in Washington state, and I have frequently bemoaned the rules and regulations. That said, I have been checked in the field a number of times while hunting and fishing, and I have not yet met an unprofessional - or even unpleasant Fish and Wildlife Officer.

 

[BillRob]

But that statement is idealistic, instead lets be realistic. Even the best of hunters and marksmen can have situations arise where the animal is hit and goes down but doesn't die quickly or even after a prolonged wait. And that can happen with most of us that aren't perfect. Then a finishing shot is human.
I once shot a nice fat whitetail doe in south-central Kansas, last deer I've shot or even went hunting. I was using my TC Gray Hawk 50 cal. and came on this doe with a yearling spike buck at close range, maybe 30/35 yards at most. Surprised us both! Just as I dropped to a knee to steady and almost simultaneously make my face-on shot she saw my movement and quickly lowered her head under a cedar bow to see me just as the ML fired. My 245 gr. Buffalo Ball-et hit her approx. 12 inches behind her skull and severed her spine. She dropped like flipping off a light switch. After a few seconds of absolutely no movement I walked up and she was breathing and eyes going wild even looking straight at me, no blood except for a small staining around the entrance hole. I reloaded my rifle as quickly as I could (slow) with a half load and instantly stopped her fear.
If I'd had my Lyman's Plains Pistol that torturous time for both of us while I gathered powder, patch, ball and cap could have flowed much much faster.
There are good reasons to carry a second firearm both while hunting and for self defense. What if that harmless doe was a mad boar hog and I missed the spine? A second firearm can save your hide!
But I understand and am sympathetic with your argument statement.

I say this respectfully - and as a fellow hunter: I think you made a mistake by walking up on that deer before reloading your gun. You just can't be certain when a followup shot will be needed, either to put down an animal that tries to run off, or to dispatch an animal that is mortally wounded but not expired. A hunter should always reload - no matter the weapon, before approaching a downed big-game animal.

 

[SOLANCO]

I think it has little to do with ethics, the important thing is that they can tell you what you can and can't do. I've lived in several different states and have never met a game and fish warden that I liked and that was easy to deal with.

State regs tell you what you can or can not do. The warden is an leo charged with enforcing the game regs. A police officer dealing with you on the street deals with the possibility that you may be armed. The game warden deals with the certainty that you are. Likely to make him a tad testy, but the ones I have encountered were polite and professional. YMMV

 

[Cliffdweller]

I live in Washington state, and I have frequently bemoaned the rules and regulations. That said, I have been checked in the field a number of times while hunting and fishing, and I have not yet met an unprofessional - or even unpleasant Fish and Wildlife Officer.

Nor have I.....

 

[mkabe]

I say this respectfully - and as a fellow hunter: I think you made a mistake by walking up on that deer before reloading your gun. You just can't be certain when a followup shot will be needed, either to put down an animal that tries to run off, or to dispatch an animal that is mortally wounded but not expired. A hunter should always reload - no matter the weapon, before approaching a downed big-game animal.

I respectfully agree. Yet after waiting several minutes and k n o w i n g the doe absolutely could n o t move I felt safe. Also, I was done for the day except for field dressing and did not want a Pyrodex fouled but loaded gun. She had a yearling spike buck with her and he eventually ran off, she’d have followed if she could get up. The animal was paralized.
If I ever go again I’ll be carrying my Lyman Plains Pistol.

 

[Cliffdweller]

For the same reason you can’t carry 2 long guns, 2 pistols or a double barreled rifle. It’s supposed to be a single shot game.
In the 30ish years since the VT muzzleloader season was created I’ve never heard a single person complain about only being able to carry one gun.
Until now.
It’s very easy to petition the board and they are required to address your petition at a board meeting.

Also if it's supposed to be a "single shot game" Then why don't we have a single shot season (trapdoor's, rolling blocks etc etc)? It's not called single shot season ,it's ML season and that makes it single shot by default because its a Muzzleloader. Of course theres the rare ones that use superimpossed chambers........

 

[mkabe]

Also if it's supposed to be a "single shot game" Then why don't we have a single shot season (trapdoor's, rolling blocks etc etc)? It's not called single shot season ,it's ML season and that makes it single shot by default because its a Muzzleloader. Of course theres the rare ones that use superimpossed chambers........

Kansas does have a “single shot season” for traydoors, rolling blocks, etc., it’s called firearms season.

 

[Cliffdweller]

Kansas foes have a “single shot season” for traydoors, rolling blocks, etc., it’s called firearms season.

Ha ha Exactly!!!!!!!

 

[user 31257]

Also if it's supposed to be a "single shot game" Then why don't we have a single shot season (trapdoor's, rolling blocks etc etc)? It's not called single shot season ,it's ML season and that makes it single shot by default because its a Muzzleloader. Of course theres the rare ones that use superimpossed chambers........

Because it’s for single shot muzzleloaders. Why are you wasting your time arguing here? Petition the Fish & Wildlife board. Call your counties board member.

 

[FishDFly]

Makes perfect sense.