winged dragon on Rigby rifle

[Wes/Tex]

Similar but still different than the R.W.F. Theirs was like this... http://www.topstitches-uk.com/prodimages/RWF.jpg

Their predominant symbol was, and is, the Prince Of Wales feathers...
http://www.rwfia.org/Ich_Dien_cbt.gif

 

[fleener]

Pep

Welcome, I see this is your first post?

I do see a strong resemblance to their dragon and perhaps you are right. I will write to Rigby and see if that will help shed any light on it.

Does this mean I have to dress up like them when I shoot the rifle?

thanks

Fleener

 

[Wes/Tex]

Does this mean I have to dress up like them when I shoot the rifle?
thanks
Fleener

Yes!
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com...FR_sYKeB1t_TKAiR17dzNy7xGueXzskOza3KN24VZwTCQ

:rotf:

 

[fleener]

looking like an old goat will be easy for me. Not a problem.

Fleener

 

[TFoley]

looking like an old goat will be easy for me. Not a problem.

Fleener

I thought I'd get in before David Minshall - try this...............

http://www.researchpress.co.uk/longrange/backposition.htm

Mind you, you need the special heel-of-the-butt-mounted sight.

tac

 

[azmntman]

I MUST start practicing this position, no more missed deer while napping (they always see me trying to get my ol bones up and get to the gun) :rotf:

But the sling?? is it HC or not? :stir:

 

[TFoley]

I MUST start practicing this position, no more missed deer while napping (they always see me trying to get my ol bones up and get to the gun) :rotf:

But the sling?? is it HC or not? :stir:

Well, it seems that slings were not used in the back position, but were prefectly acceptable in the usual prone shooting position adopted by us humans. Shooters in the MLAGB shoots here in UK certainly use slings - I know that I did with my Whitworth, although a wrist-rest is also permissable.

I think that provided you shot from a position where you did not have either one or the other of your elbows in your ears, you'd be just fine.

tac

 

[azmntman]

The picture below is from Ezekial Baker's "Remarks on Rifle Guns" (1823). Note that the sling is looped around the foot and it is this that takes the recoil. There is no support of the butt from the body and the head also remains unsupported.

Looks like they had slings! I wonder if this will work with hiking boots?? :rotf: :idunno: :blah:

 

[Wes/Tex]

The picture below is from Ezekial Baker's "Remarks on Rifle Guns" (1823). Note that the sling is looped around the foot and it is this that takes the recoil. There is no support of the butt from the body and the head also remains unsupported.

This is also very similar, though not quite identical to the position used by rifleman Tom Plunket to make his remarkable shot at General Auguste de Colbert at Cacabelos in 1809. Plunket made a head shot on Colbert from 300 yards, reloaded and did the same to Colbert's orderly trumpeter who'd rushed up when the general pitched from his saddle. Plunket had assumed the layout position, shot Colbert, reloaded and shot the orderly as he tried to attend the general.
http://www.napoleon-series.org/images/research/biographies/plunkett.jpg

 

[RedFeather]

Looks a good bit like a Griffin, also winged. And they are often shown with talons extended. Either way, that's truly a wonderful work of art. Congratulations.

 

[Rick Boylan]

Seeing that you're a fellow Iowan, I would like to say nice rifle. Congratulations.

I'm interested in the gunsmith you speak of. I have an old original S&W pocket breaktop pistol that could use a little TLC from such a smith. It seems that the hammer needs some of the cocking notches redone so it cocks the pistol as it used to. That would make this gun a shooter. I would love to know if he would be interested in working on my gun.

Any info on the fellow would be greatly appreciated.

 

[TFoley]

Looks a good bit like a Griffin, also winged. And they are often shown with talons extended. Either way, that's truly a wonderful work of art. Congratulations.

I agree, it looks a lot more like a griffon/griffin/gryphon.

tac

 

[fleener]

griffon/griffin/gryphon

what does a iowa farm boy know about any of these things.....?

Thanks for all the help.

Iowa Farm Boy.

 

[fleener]

This is what I got back from Rigby today.
Fleener

Robert S. Greenhill (of High Street)
8 June 1864
Best Match Rifle with aperture sights
£ 25/4/0
52 bore
37-inch barrel

 

[ResearchPress]

That's an early full match rifle.

What form is the rifling? I have notes of 5, 6 and 8 grooves used on Rigby rifles at that period. Captain Heaton's 1864 "Notes on Rifle Shooting" describes Rigby rifling as 1 in 18 and octagonal in shape. There was much experimentation at the time though. The shallow groove rifling didn't appear until around 1867.

I have some NRA(GB) Annual Reports, I couldn't find Greenhill as a member in 1863, but he is listed as an annual subscriber in 1870.

David

 

[ResearchPress]

R.Greenhill was a member of the Dublin Shooting Club, and a member of the first Irish Team to enter the Elcho Shield match in 1865 at Wimbledon. I have the full records of the Elcho Shield in the 19th century so should be able to research this further.

Greenhill also travelled to the US as part of the Irish 'squad' for the Centennial match in 1876. He didn't make the final team selection though.

His name appears in quite a few newspaper reports of competitions in Ireland.

The rifle appears to have been in good hands!

David

 

[TFoley]

R.Greenhill was a member of the Dublin Shooting Club, and a member of the first Irish Team to enter the Elcho Shield match in 1865 at Wimbledon. I have the full records of the Elcho Shield in the 19th century so should be able to research this further.

Greenhill also travelled to the US as part of the Irish 'squad' for the Centennial match in 1876. He didn't make the final team selection though.

His name appears in quite a few newspaper reports of competitions in Ireland.

The rifle appears to have been in good hands!

David

That's very interesting to know, Mr Minshall. With my other hat on, I thank you for that, and I'll pass it on to the guys on www.vcrai.com.

Of course, although the rifle REALLY belongs back in Ireland, it cannot be used there as the citizens of the Republic of Ireland are not allowed to shoot live ammunition from any kind of a black powder-propelled firearm.

That's because they are not permitted to have BP unless it is for an item of public display like the 12 o'clock cannon at Spike Island.

After an incident last year in which a display re-enactor inadvertantly 'launched' his ram-rod, the firing of BP small-arms in public has been banned.

tac

 

[fleener]

David

Thank you very much for that information. It really means a lot to me to lean more about this rifle. I will buy you a pint or two, next time I see you....

I need to look again to be sure, but I think it has 6 grooves. The twist best I can tell is 18. The rifling is in great shape.

I hope he did not make the team from his lack of ability, not the rifles.

Fleener

 

[Loyalist Dave]

It's tough to tell even when the phot is enlarged, but from I can see folks the wings are wrong for a dragon...


And if they are wrong then that's a Griffin, not a dragon (imho) and it may also be sajent erect (sitting, talons raised), and could belong to many houses. If it is rampant, the Griffin rampant is very much part of the coat of arms of Pomerania (Nothern Germany and Poliand along the Baltic Sea), so may have belonged to a member of a house from that region.

LD

 

[ResearchPress]

I'll see what else I can glean about R.S. Greenhill and get back to you.

I believe he also came over to the US in 1877 as part of the Staff accompanying Sir Henry Halford's Great Britain team.

I'd be keen to see a photo of the muzzle and any details of the rifling.

David