zouave muskets

[Pete G]

I hate being "that guy" so if people mean well I just let it be.

"Musket" is just a blanket term a lot of people use.

I knew guy who called them all "Musket Loaders"

 

[springfield art]

Actually, Zouave is a made up fictitious name with no real historical context, other than some troops that were called Zuoaves after the French originals may have been issued these rifles at some point, and if so it was likely after the war.

The term Zuoave was coined by Val Forgett of Navy Arms when he commissioned the reproduction of the Remington Model 1863 Contract Rifle. He initially was going to call them Remingtons, and indeed the first locks said Remington on them, but "Big Green" took exception to his using their name and told him to cease and desist, so he came up with the catchy Zuoave moniker, which, seemingly has as much or more flair than Remington, especially these days.

As far as projectiles, these arms were designed to use Minies and in historically correct context that is what they fired for the most part (in actuality the Remington 1863 saw little or no use in the War of Northern Aggression) That being so 99% of the time I am using a Lee .578, 478 grain home cast Minie in mine

You're right on the money!

 

[sawyer04]

I just read an old article in the old Home Guide Muzzle Loaders book that stated the Zouaves armed many union troops, but yet I have read it didn't see issuance in many articles..
I don't know, I wasn't there.

 

[TNGhost]

I just read an old article in the old Home Guide Muzzle Loaders book that stated the Zouaves armed many union troops, but yet I have read it didn't see issuance in many articles..
I don't know, I wasn't there.

Most of the Remington 1863 Contract Rifles sat in warehouses at the end of the war and there is very little evidence of any being actually issued to U.S. troops. They were sold as surplus some time after the war, to Bannerman's and to European countries in need of extra arms.

Most were/are in relatively good condition compared to the Springfields and Enfields that saw much hard use in the war. It is likely because of their being more easily obtainable in finer condition and their availability in Europe, that Val Forgett chose the Remington to be the first rifle he commissioned for reproduction in Italy rather than the more ubiquitous Springfield or Enfield.

 

[Stantheman86]

It's also a good looking rifle in a barrel length that appeals to more people, and it has that standard "military musket" look that even people who don't care about history will think is cool. Brass front barrel band, a patchbox, it just appeals to people.

Which I'm sure factored heavily into Val Forgett picking the "Zouave". I get more people interested in my Mississippi rifle than any other because it's a "pretty musket".

 

[tenngun]

Most of the Remington 1863 Contract Rifles sat in warehouses at the end of the war and there is very little evidence of any being actually issued to U.S. troops. They were sold as surplus some time after the war, to Bannerman's and to European countries in need of extra arms.

Most were/are in relatively good condition compared to the Springfields and Enfields that saw much hard use in the war. It is likely because of their being more easily obtainable in finer condition and their availability in Europe, that Val Forgett chose the Remington to be the first rifle he commissioned for reproduction in Italy rather than the more ubiquitous Springfield or Enfield.

I wonder if connivence didn’t play a roll. Folks getting in to the centennial of the WBTS were of the generation of WW2 and Korean War vets. By this time guns with barrels in the thirty inch range was the norm. And here is a war rifle with that size. To a man that shot an m1 or most of the hunting rifles the Remington didn’t look clumsy.
just like when TC produced their guns.Again a shorter barrel to appeal to a crowd used to shorter arms.

 

[Stantheman86]

The 33" barrel Muzzleloading Rifles are always the most popular, you're right. They're also usually the most accurate.
My 33" Mississippi feels the most "right" to me with that heavy barrel and it comes to the shoulder nicely. I love my mile long 40" and 43" rifles and muskets too but honestly, it's just easier to load and clean the mid-length rifles.

 

[tenngun]

Well back when the Zouaves came over reinactos were often happy with blue or gray khakis and a Disney land kepis. So here was an ‘authentic’ gun that handled as easy as a modern hunting gun.... and the brass butt trap made for a cute gun.
the Mississippi had that too but no one made it.

 

[RjSixgun]

big fan of the 1841 Mississippi too, I did a Harpers Ferry conversion to mine a long range rear sight 1-800 yards like the 1855 1st model rifle, re marked the lock with 1851 Harpers Ferry markings, changed to the front band to the harpers ferry type and added a bayonet lug, heck I even had the stock cartouche with the correct marks for Harpers Ferry.
one day I'll pick up an 1863 Remington to go with my 1855 Rifle and Mississippi

 

[Gopher0]

Minie Ball is the only way to go, excellent for hunting and target shooting

From Cottageville SC You close by ?

 

[RjSixgun]

about 3 hours north of you

 

[Gopher0]

Mine is a wischo-kg Bought at the post Sports shop in 82, It shoots well . other than that ?

 

[RjSixgun]

Mine was a originally a Euroarms 1841, now the only thing Euroarms left is the stock

 

[Stantheman86]

I have a Euroarms .54 1841 that a reenactor did up like a Civil War refurb with the Armory Bright barrel and lock, and long range rear sight. I saw an original in the same configuration on an Auction site that was left in .54, so at least I know my repro actually could have existed.

Super accurate with .533 Minies.

 

[RjSixgun]

Thats the best thing about the 1841s, they can be modified into models that most people have never seen or heard of.
there were so many different carbines, muskets, rifles, and rifled-muskets used during the ACW, its a shame that nobody reproduces them. Like a Whiteney Militia Rifle! parts 1841,1855, and CS Richmond all rolled into 1 rifle!!! Or a Georgia Armory rifle, Springfield 1857 Cadet musket or 1847 musketoon!!!
years ago there were repro colts, 1841s 1855s, 1863s, 1864s, heck a walk threw Sutlers Row you could buy almost anything repro or original.......now its all dried up and all you see is repro 1861s and Enfields

 

[muzzle man]

Need advice... I have the option to buy an Armi zouave in good condition older Or a Chiappa new excellent. Chiappa is a bit more. Trying to figure out what's the better option??

 

[Stantheman86]

Need advice... I have the option to buy an Armi zouave in good condition older Or a Chiappa new excellent. Chiappa is a bit more. Trying to figure out what's the better option??

What is Armi? ArmiSport?

 

[springfield art]

Thats the best thing about the 1841s, they can be modified into models that most people have never seen or heard of.
there were so many different carbines, muskets, rifles, and rifled-muskets used during the ACW, its a shame that nobody reproduces them. Like a Whiteney Militia Rifle! parts 1841,1855, and CS Richmond all rolled into 1 rifle!!! Or a Georgia Armory rifle, Springfield 1857 Cadet musket or 1847 musketoon!!!
years ago there were repro colts, 1841s 1855s, 1863s, 1864s, heck a walk threw Sutlers Row you could buy almost anything repro or original.......now its all dried up and all you see is repro 1861s and Enfields

The limited, specialist market for these interesting but limited-use muskets kind of keeps a market from developing. Many of us older guys that recall or "were in" the Civil War Centennial are aging out now, and there simply is not the large pool of young guys itching to get into re-enacting. This is where small shops and de-farbers can fill the demand, but the days that you recall above are gone for good! It was indeed a magical time.

 

[smoothshooter]

It was made for the minnie. And made for man incapacitating. It doesn’t matter to an army of the other guy is dead or wounded. On a WTBS battlefield wounded out numbered dead anywhere from three to one to five to one.
You don’t want that hunting. You want clean quick kills. That means minnie or ball get close. Around a hundred yards max range.
I shot mine with ball. Because I like ball.
I got better accuracy with an eighty grain charge and patched ball then the sixty grain service charge and minnie.
The boys that shoot these for smallest groups often shoot lighter charges, forty grain range. They do that for a reason that visible on their targets.
But you go all the way to sixty or sixty five, and a fat WTBS minnie or even one of the heaviest.58 you get deer dropping accuracy at a hundred yards. Lots better then round ball in my smoothie
Shoot them both see what you like better. Both will serve you well.....
of course real men shoot ball, from flint guns and real men spend a lot more time ‘round the fire talking then shooting.... well let’s not go there

The military also liked the Minnie bullets because they penetrated wooden fortifications better, and were more effective at killing horses.

 

[Stantheman86]

The 1863 "Zouaves " are probably some of the best looking military muzzleloaders ever made

The 33" "mid length" rifle was already starting to become the norm by 1865, as the nature of combat evolved away from needing 40" barrel rifles for firing in ranks, 1000m + volleys and bayonet fighting

However, muzzleloaders were obsolete to the US Ordnance Dept so the idea of the 33" rifle-musket for general issue was dead after the Civil War so the 1863 Remington rifle was obsolete pretty much as soon as it was delivered.