1842 hardware on an 1816 conversion?

[Asher]

More pictures... sorry it took me a while!

Note the "US" clearly discernable in spite of the pitting, along with the somewhat less descernable "1844" date above it...

Hard to tell from the picture, but once I saw an example of the "L. Pomeroy" manufacturer, and it was the first one I'd seen that had the US and date on the rear part of the lock plate, I was able to make out the "L. Pomeroy".

Gap between the inlet and lock plate when tightly screwed in. This has me perplexed... unless I'm just not fitting it in right.

 

[Asher]

Yes, I think I will try to remove that paint, if I can do it without causing more damage. Sadly, whoever painted the metal appears to have done so without removing it from the stock, as there is silver paint run-off inside the barrel channel and under the areas normally covered by the metal.

Any clues as far as those inspector stamps? Are they consistent with an L. Pomeroy 1835/40, or is there still the possibility the stock is a later replacement?

 

[Va.Manuf.06]

I don't think that there is any doubt about it, the gun is original as you received it. It was in a climate that was "wood friendly" but damp and/or caustic enough to damage metal - severely. It was ignored for a long time and the metal is deeply pitted. Too bad, Pomeroy made M1840s are not often seen, as a matter of fact, any M1840 musket is harder to find than an 1816 or '42, the production was small and short lived.

With the M1840, they were caught in the period when the transition from flint to percussion was taking place and most M1840 muskets were armory converted before issue so spent their working life as percussion rather than flint.

 

[steved]

You should be able to remove the silver paint from the metal parts with chemical strip without affecting the metal underneath. Last week I used chemical strip to remove old varnish off the brass trigger guard from a Pottsdam musket and the varish came off and the brass patina underneath was not disturbed. Should work the same on steel parts.

 

[Tumblernotch]

I can't make out the letters very well in the pictures. I'll have to dig around and see if I have the name of the man who inspected Pomeroy's muskets.

 

[Asher]

I tried to contact S&S Firearms in New York, but they said they didn't have any parts for the '35/40. Any ideas? I'd like to complete it, but don't exactly have the skills to take investment cast parts and finish them out.

 

[varsity07840]

The Rifle Shoppe

Duane

 

[Billnpatti]

Whoa!! I smell a rat. There are a LOT of fakes out there and you may have stumbled onto one. Before you shell out good money for this gun, have it examined by someone who knows a good bit about muzzleloading rifles. With the metal in that rough of a condition, the wood would be expected to have rotted away. The wood on this rifle just looks too good for it to be a real battlefield find. CAUTION! CAUTION! CAUTION!

 

[Billnpatti]

If you find that the gun is worth the expense, you can contact one of the abrasive blasting companies and ask if they do CO2 blasting. The CO2 blasting will remove the paint without touching the metal finish underneath. It is a process in which dry ice pellets are used instead of sand to remove paint or other surface coatings without damaging the surface under it. It is amazing and worth looking into but I have no idea what it costs.

 

[59sharps]

yea! and again thanks for all your w/ this podstam restoration.would never look as good as it does w/o your help.
It now has to be one of my favorit! Just can't wait to see how we do in Va. with it. will let you know on the 21st.

 

[Asher]

Well, I would have thought it to be a fake, but as it wasn't being sold exclusively as a "battlefield pickup" musket, and seeing as how a better condition one would be worth a lot more than a relic, I can't see someone faking the wear and tear on it. And I didn't pay any more than I should have for a poor condition musket without any history, I don't think. It's just a beater that I'd like to fix up just to have an example.

On the Rifle Shoppe, do you know if they sell finished parts? I thought their site said they only sell incomplete cast parts for you to finish and fit.

 

[Asher]

And thanks for the tip on the CO2 blasting, I'll have to ask about that.

 

[Va.Manuf.06]

I understand Billnpatti's concern but I do not think this musket is a fake, nor do I think it is being claimed as a "battlefield pick up" though it could be. The battlefield gleanings continued through the 1880s and into the 1890s. I once owned a US M1842 that was picked up from the trenches around Petersburg in the 1870s by the grandfather of a local man (western Va.) who had been working as a contractor on the State Penitentiary in Richmond. On his days off, he would walk the battlefields and pick up items as souvenirs. 5 to 10 years after the War, many of the iron objects were beginning to show heavy pitting but the wood was in reasonably good condition, at least mine was - and it was still loaded..... Anyway, that may be what we see here. Never say never.....

 

[varsity07840]

Well, I would have thought it to be a fake, but as it wasn't being sold exclusively as a "battlefield pickup" musket, and seeing as how a better condition one would be worth a lot more than a relic, I can't see someone faking the wear and tear on it. And I didn't pay any more than I should have for a poor condition musket without any history, I don't think. It's just a beater that I'd like to fix up just to have an example.

On the Rifle Shoppe, do you know if they sell finished parts? I thought their site said they only sell incomplete cast parts for you to finish and fit.

My understanding is that the Rifle Shoppe sells cast parts, but they will also build a complete lock. Maybe you could send the plate to them for a rebuild. I've never bought anything from them but I've heard a number of times that their lead time for parts can be very long.

Duane

 

[varsity07840]

Check out Gunbroker 341148166.

Duane

 

[Va.Manuf.06]

On the Rifle Shoppe, do you know if they sell finished parts? I thought their site said they only sell incomplete cast parts for you to finish and fit.

TRS sells as-cast parts and, depending on what you want, there can be a wait. They might rebuild a lock for you but that will be quite a wait. If I were you, I would buy the parts needed then contact the work out to an experienced lock maker. And I do mean experienced - all internal parts will need to be cleaned up, polished and fitted then hardened and tempered. Knowledgeable lock makers being few and far between, that will also require standing in line for quite a while.....

Here is a link to the page you need in TRS's catalog:
http://www.therifleshoppe.com/catalog_pages/us_arms/(663).htm

 

[Asher]

Huh, that's really a nice one, Duane. Half-decent starting price too.

I tried calling TRS, and they quoted me around $250 to rebuild the lock. And as y'all have mentioned, a very long wait time. For what I'm using this for, it hardly seems worth it. Do y'all know if the 1842 parts are close enough to fit to this lock? I'm starting to think I should just find the cheapest 1842 parts I can and fit them myself.

 

[Asher]

On the latter topic, does anyone know where I could get an inexpensive parts set (finished parts, not cast) for the 1842?

 

[varsity07840]

On the latter topic, does anyone know where I could get an inexpensive parts set (finished parts, not cast) for the 1842?

Try Lodgewood Mfg. www.lodgewood.com

My guess is that a complete set of internals is going to run you over $200.00 with most if not all
being reproductions. They can tell if '42 parts will work.

Duane

 

[Asher]

Looks like they're gonna be out for a week or so. I've got an event coming up, so I was hoping to get this underway soon... plus, it look slike their '42 parts, assuming they'll work, are quite a bit more expensive. If I'm going to have to tweak/modify parts to fit, I was hoping to find something more along the lines of a set from ArmiSport/Chiappa or something. I got a screw that works as a hammer screw to hold on the hammer, so at least it looks complete externally. I'd just like to get it functioning.