1851 Navy repro (Uberti) locks up when I lowerthe hammer onto a safety pin. How to fix?

[ExMachina]

My Uberti1851 Navy repro completely locks up when I lower the hammer onto a safety pin (any safety pin). The only way I can then remedy the locked up gun is to remove the wedge and let the cylinder move forward a tiny bit.

I'm hoping this problem can be permanently fixed by removing a tiny bit of metal from somewhere...question is WHERE?

Any gunsmiths here?

Thanks for any help

 

[45D]

My Uberti1851 Navy repro completely locks up when I lower the hammer onto a safety pin (any safety pin). The only way I can then remedy the locked up gun is to remove the wedge and let the cylinder move forward a tiny bit.

I'm hoping this problem can be permanently fixed by removing a tiny bit of metal from somewhere...question is WHERE?

Any gunsmiths here?

Thanks for any help

Your bolt isn't "resetting" soon enough. When the hammer falls, the left bolt arm will be pushed aside by the cam so that it can snap over onto the top of the cam. On a cap gun, I always set the reset to happen as the hammer face breaks the plane of the recoil shield. Yours probably resets just as the hammer face reaches the nipple. It may lock up when the hammer is down on a capped nipple.
This is what it should look like with hammer down on a nipple.
( the bolt arm is the pointed looking finger just above the circular cam). Notice there is some space between the two.

This is what yours looks like with the hammer down on the safety pin. The arm hasn't reset so the cam can't unlock the cyl but the hand has already selected the next ratchet tooth . . . Thus, it is locked up.

Mike

 

[M. De Land]

Your bolt isn't "resetting" soon enough. When the hammer falls, the left bolt arm will be pushed aside by the cam so that it can snap over onto the top of the cam. On a cap gun, I always set the reset to happen as the hammer face breaks the plane of the recoil shield. Yours probably resets just as the hammer face reaches the nipple. It may lock up when the hammer is down on a capped nipple.
This is what it should look like with hammer down on a nipple.
( the bolt arm is the pointed looking finger just above the circular cam). Notice there is some space between the two.
View attachment 252107

This is what yours looks like with the hammer down on the safety pin. The arm hasn't reset so the cam can't unlock the cyl but the hand has already selected the next ratchet tooth . . . Thus, it is locked up.
View attachment 252108

Mike

Good diagnosis Mike I completely agree !

 

[Trinidad Bill]

Wow, great photos of the issue. Uberti Colts seem to have issues, at least mine did/does. I am hoping the Piettas are better (so i have heard). No personal experience yet but I do have a Pietta on the way.

 

[fishmusic]

Wow, great photos of the issue. Uberti Colts seem to have issues, at least mine did/does. I am hoping the Piettas are better (so i have heard). No personal experience yet but I do have a Pietta on the way.

I had the same issue with my Pietta 1851 reproduction. Corrected it by judiciously grinding the bolt arm that contacts the cam on the inside curve. Grind and fit, grind and fit until it works correctly. Be sure not to let it get hot and deburr between fittings.

 

[M. De Land]

My Uberti1851 Navy repro completely locks up when I lower the hammer onto a safety pin (any safety pin). The only way I can then remedy the locked up gun is to remove the wedge and let the cylinder move forward a tiny bit.

I'm hoping this problem can be permanently fixed by removing a tiny bit of metal from somewhere...question is WHERE?

Any gunsmiths here?

Thanks for any help

Your thread got me to thinking on safety pins so I went looking for some on the new Walker........................ ain't nuttin there and yet the hammer face is slotted. What am I missing here ?

 

[45D]

Your thread got me to thinking on safety pins so I went looking for some on the new Walker........................ ain't nuttin there and yet the hammer face is slotted. What am I missing here ?

Pins!!!

But seriously folks . . . the new Walker I just finished didn't have a pin either. Maybe all the talk about "historically correct" has "kicked in" . . . which means you don't get safety pins until the 2nd M. Dragoon. I believe the Walkers from Uberti just have one pin . . . either way I'd drill a hole and install a pin.

Mike

 

[CaptainVane]

My 1848 .31 (uberti) without loading lever only has one pin, so maybe Mike is right about early versions being historically accurate.

 

[M. De Land]

Pins!!!

But seriously folks . . . the new Walker I just finished didn't have a pin either. Maybe all the talk about "historically correct" has "kicked in" . . . which means you don't get safety pins until the 2nd M. Dragoon. I believe the Walkers from Uberti just have one pin . . . either way I'd drill a hole and install a pin.

Mike

Thanks Mike, I did find one pin this morning after reading your post and taking the cylinder off. The slot in the hammer threw me a curve as I didn't happen to hit on the one pin when lowering the hammer between chambers and feeling for them .
It sure is hard to see and find with the gun assembled.

 

[45D]

Thanks Mike, I did find one pin this morning after reading your post and taking the cylinder off. The slot in the hammer threw me a curve as I didn't happen to hit on the one pin when lowering the hammer between chambers and feeling for them .
It sure is hard to see and find with the gun assembled.

Yessir, the originals had none but Uberti gives you 1. I still have to add one to this new (2022) one I'm done with.

Mike

 

[Pete453]

Cool pictures, Mike, do you have a cutaway revolver?

 

[45D]

Cool pictures, Mike, do you have a cutaway revolver?

Hey buddy!! Yessir, this is a working
cutaway revolver I got in a trade from Mr. Walt Kirst. It's great for showing "how it works" !!! I've decided to make it a "light weight" '51 Navy 45C conversion (since it's so holy) !! It has the original 7 3/8" barrel which I made the loading lever handle a spent case "poker" ( like a "Man with know name" revolver). It's got a 4 3/4" snubby barrel for "carrying" duties!! (not really). The hammer is a "lite weight" hammer project that I decided to test and this may be a perfect platform to test it on!!
Here's some pics :

Mike

 

[Bunk]

Wow, great photos of the issue. Uberti Colts seem to have issues, at least mine did/does. I am hoping the Piettas are better (so i have heard). No personal experience yet but I do have a Pietta on the way.

I do have a number of both and all work well.
Having said that all have been tuned by knowledgeable smiths.
The rammer on Uberti guns has the proper shape for bullets or ball.
The rammer on Pietta is shaped only for ball.
the simple fix is shoot bullets or ball in Uberti and ball only in Pietta.
The important thing is keep shooting
Hold Center
Make Smoke
Bunk

 

[CyrusP]

Pins!!!

But seriously folks . . . the new Walker I just finished didn't have a pin either. Maybe all the talk about "historically correct" has "kicked in" . . . which means you don't get safety pins until the 2nd M. Dragoon. I believe the Walkers from Uberti just have one pin . . . either way I'd drill a hole and install a pin.

Mike

New Walker you just finished?

 

[Trinidad Bill]

I noticed that the .36 Pietta 1861 Navy Sheriff does not have pins… the .44 Pietta 1860 Sheriff does have pins…

 

[45D]

New Walker you just finished?

Yap, this one -

Mike

 

[CyrusP]

Very nice.

 

[wiscoaster]

Great series of closeups (and explanation). Well done.

 

[Dusty_Traveler]

@45D what if the pistol locks up as the OP stated, but with the bolt completely removed from the gun?

 

[Smokerr]

The rammer on Pietta is shaped only for ball.

The NMA I got was more ball oriented but it was a bad shape for a ball or a conical. Ball wise it mashed them as well though not as bad as a conical. I reshaped it so it does both without mashing them.