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2.5 oz of shot

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Horner30

32 Cal.
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Has anyone ever loaded up 2 1/2oz of shot or more, in their 12ga smooth bore?

I thinking about making mine into a serious turkey smacker, but I want to be safe about it.

Right now I am shooting 70gr of FF and just over 1oz of #6 shot. As you can see I am wanting to ramp that up a bit.
 
What you will "RAMP UP" is the recoil, on both your shoulder, and to the gun parts. Neither needs that.

Work on your patterns. Most MLing Shotguns are "30 yd." guns, because they are Cylinder bore guns. They simply can't throw tight patterns much further, and at black Powder velocities, you simply can't get round balls to travel further with any retained energy much beyond 40 yds. Even choked Mlers don't retain the energy because the starting velocities are so low( under the speed of sound). Adding more shot rarely Improves the patterns. In many cases, it actually HURTS the patterns.

If you are looking to tighten patterns for hunting turkeys, Read This post by Makesumsmoke.
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/...d/245826/post/847484/hl//fromsearch/1/#847484

You will see much better improvement, without putting the stress on your stock, and barrels that using your suggest load of shot will provide.

Yes, I have tried 2.5 oz of shot in my 12 gauge, and was shocked to find how badly it patterned. And, I have fired as much as 4 oz. of shot out of an 8 bore mler. You know when the gun goes off. Yes, I hit the clay target I was pointing, but I would have broken the same target with just 1 oz. of shot, and perhaps even less. :surrender: :thumbsup:

Depending on the distance you expect to shoot a turkey, you "ramp up" a load by increasing the size of the shot pellets you shot- going from the #6 you now have, to #5, or even #4 shot. An oz. and 1/4 of #5 shot should work well out to 40 yds, and give you a similar pellet count to your current load of #6 shot. If you use #4 shot, a load of 1 1/2 oz. of #4 will be needed to give you the same approx. pellet count. The retained energy of #4 pellets at and beyond 40 yards is sustantial, but you pattern begins to get pretty thin at that distance. Better to pick your shots, and take the birds inside the 40 yard markers.
 
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Horner30 said:
Has anyone ever loaded up 2 1/2oz of shot or more, in their 12ga smooth bore?
Don't have a 12 ga., but have fired 2 oz. #6 and 80 gr. 3F in my 20 ga. fowler. That was in the early stages of working up a turkey load. Hunted with it a little, took one bird, but further patterning showed that 1 5/8 oz. worked better, so that's what I settled on.

Spence
 
:thumbsup: I guess I just need to get out a patterning board and do some shooting. Thanks for the advice, I will report back.
 
Closest I ever came was when I was a kid in high school and I learned by accident that a charge bar for 1 7/8 oz of #2 shot actually drops a little over 2 1/8 oz of #8 shot. Trying to build some "super" 12 gauge 3" shells for dove hunting. They worked, but lord only knows what pressure I was generating. Course, kinda hard firing another shot the next day with your arm in a sling. :rotf:
 
Now you guys have down right scarred me!!! :surrender:

I will build the shot amount slowly, last thing I need is a snapped or dislocated arm.
 
Recoil will depend a lot on stock design, gun weight and your tolerance. I worry more about pressure, and in worst case, stock cracks.

I'm not home now to help you by turning pages myself, but if you can locate one of the older Lyman black powder manuals I recall that there are some pretty stout loads for 12 gauge in there.

I've shot 1 5/8 oz of shot on top of 100 grains of 2f from my Bess (11 gauge) and didn't find the recoil all that objectionable. But it's about as much as I'd want to shoot from that particular gun.

It's an adjustment process including pattern development, but the bottom line is keeping loads safe for you and the gun.
 
The only time I shot that much shot was when I had both hammers of my older origional SxS at full cock and they both fired when I set off the right barrel. (I immediately did some reworking on the left lock and now never cock both hammers at the same time.)The recoil was not nice! :idunno:
 
I am like Ohio Ramrod. I too had a gun double on me once. That 14ga. was sending a total of 2 1/4 oz. of #6's down range and sending me into recoil shock. In a nut shell, I don't like magnum loads and I am also afraid of the gun stocks that have been demanded to take this abuse. With just a little time at the range, you will find a very good load that is effective on turkey and not punish you or the gun.
 
My brother in law fired both barrels of my 12 gauge double about 10 years ago. I had 1 & 1/4 oz. of shot and 80 gr. of FF in each barrel. He still reminds me to never let him do something that dumb again.
That same load is my turkey load in that gun, but I only fire ONE barrel at a time. Leon
 
I let both barrels go at a tree full of starlings when I was a kid. I hadn't intended for both to go at the same time...but fate intervened to teach me a lesson.

27 starlings never took off again...but I didn't see them fall as I was trying to determine who broke my nose!

Dan
 
Only once ,by accident did I shoot 21/4 oz out of my Beretta O/U . That was while dove shooting I double charged one barrel while the dove were flying fast and furious and not wanting to miss out on the flight I did what human nature does.. It held up but man I would not want to do it with my 1847 Manton twelve ..

I don’t know if anyone has mentioned , that unless you load equal volumes of shot and powder you velocities will suffer if you kept your powder charge what was intended for an 1 ¼ of shot to where now you are doubling the shot charge. I suspect you will drop down in velocity by at least 3-400 fps.. The normal speed for an 1 1/4 equal volumes load is around 1050 fps to start with. I see nothing gained by upping the load charge..
Twice.
 
Rather than overloading the gun try some
"Johns Patent Automatic Sporting Schrapnel Shells"

"These shells are guaranteed to give a closer pattern and greater penetration at 110 yards than any shotgun in the world at 30 yards"

See "The American Arms Collector" January 1958.
Honestly they are not something a person could make but its an interesting concept.

The British had a wire "cage" that let the shot escape at a slower rate and increased the range of ML guns, a drawing of this can be found in Greener's "The Gun & Its Developement".
I would try a paper shot cup, maybe 2 wraps of printer paper glued into a tube closed a the bottom that fit the bore fairly tight and see if it was possible to tighten the patterns by experimenting with this before shooting 8 to 6 bore loads though a 12 bore gun.
2.5 ounces is almost 1100 grains of lead alone.

Dan
 
BrownBear said:
Recoil will depend a lot on stock design, gun weight and your tolerance. I worry more about pressure, and in worst case, stock cracks.

I'm not home now to help you by turning pages myself, but if you can locate one of the older Lyman black powder manuals I recall that there are some pretty stout loads for 12 gauge in there.

I've shot 1 5/8 oz of shot on top of 100 grains of 2f from my Bess (11 gauge) and didn't find the recoil all that objectionable. But it's about as much as I'd want to shoot from that particular gun.

It's an adjustment process including pattern development, but the bottom line is keeping loads safe for you and the gun.

I will see if I can't find that Lyman book you are talking about......Hope Mr. Google can help with that.
I have seen a bunch of info all over the net, but not very many recipes.
 
Also wanted to say, I got this idea from people loading up modern shotgun shells with a bunch of shot...... However, I know that there is most likely a big difference in pressure from black powder to smokeless.

I am not very educated on the reloading thing so hence me posting this. I just don't want to do something dumb.
 
Horner30 said:
I am not very educated on the reloading thing so hence me posting this. I just don't want to do something dumb.

Always good to ask first. That's the right track for all of us on new ground.

I've never really explored "magnum" type loading with muzzleloaders. I've just worked to get closer shots within the range of what I was using. There's lots on the site about jug choking, and that has my attention if I really want to tighten patterns and extend range. It might be something to watch for as you do your load work.
 
. There's lots on the site about jug choking said:
Jug choking will get you a tighter spread. But isn't Jug choking an old gun along the same principle as modern day inline bp shooting. Not to start an argument or anything like that. Just asking. :v
Twice.
 
I don't know where you're coming from. Read around the site and check out the stickie on jug choking. Lots of answers there, so you might find one to fit your question.
 
i shoot 2.5 oz over 110grn 1.5 swiss out of a 46" 10ga. the recoil is hard, but not unmanagable. I should note however, that i shoot hard recoiling guns all the time and i am very used to it. On the other hand, it's a turkey load and you only have to shoot it once.

i would think out of a 12 bore you wouldn't want to load any heavier than maybe 2 oz.
 
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