• Friends, our 2nd Amendment rights are always under attack and the NRA has been a constant for decades in helping fight that fight.

    We have partnered with the NRA to offer you a discount on membership and Muzzleloading Forum gets a small percentage too of each membership, so you are supporting both the NRA and us.

    Use this link to sign up please; https://membership.nra.org/recruiters/join/XR045103

#4 buck, 40 @ 40yards.

Muzzleloading Forum

Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Joined
Feb 28, 2007
Messages
10,767
Reaction score
17,752
Location
England.
Here is the intro. After a bout of illness I get chance to try some buckshot.

Close up of the shot and improvised 2oz measure.
20210601_180344.jpg

OK We got the squirrel with around 2oz of airgun pellets, hey they were free so deal with it šŸ˜‰.
Shot 1.


20210601_181144.jpg

That's about 13 pellets out of 40, I don't think that's bad.
Shot 2.

Not so good on this shot but a smaller target! In fact roughly the size of a roe bucks chest it would indeed be dead. BUT NOT LEGAL EXCEPT FOR UNIQUE RARE CIRCUMSTANCES!
20210601_182227.jpg

Shot 3.

Just three pellets in the small target, but it would of killed a fox!
20210601_183616.jpg

I think that has ruined a fox's day!

So there you have it. Totally unscientific I know but it shows potential.
Wad column was a thin card, lube, leather wad. Brown paper ball, thin card, buckshot, thin card.
A lot of shot struck low in the dirt. Next time I think I will try 120gns.
 
IMHO, buckshot is a crippler in a modern shotgun. Unless the deer is 10 yards away, it has no place in a muzzleloader. YMMV.
Kind of agree.
My interest is just fox shooting and then in reality the same payload of #4-#1 bird shot would be better in reliability on fox.
Had these three shots with the buckshot been at actual foxes they would be dead now so.....
 
Awesome! Itā€™s like BPMS with a British accent! Except he doesnā€™t have a cool dog!šŸ˜

Seriously though, I enjoyed it. I think I need a 10 gauge. Well done!
 
In Tennessee, buck shot is not legal for any hunting. It is fun to plink with though.
 
With buckshot you have to know your guns capability, pattern, range and consistancy. just like you would pattern for ducks or turkeys you need to know what it takes to have good consistant patterns and at what range you can put all or most of the shot in the kill zone. JMHO you should never use smaller than 1/0 buck for deer, 2/0 or 3/0 much better. Allways remember shotguns are short range heavy cover guns. For fast shots at 25 yards or less, if your gun will hold a pattern at that range, nothing is deadlier.
 
My dad was a "lazy" hunter who thought that buckshot was better than a single projectile "in brush" for deer. I set up a target behind some "typical" deer brush we dealt with around 30 yards away. I put up a deer silhouette target and let him fly with 00buck and a slug. There were scattered 00 hits , none at least from a knock down standard. the slug plowed through and hit the kill zone.
 
That's pretty decent for that distance. Looks about like the pattern that I get with an ounce and a quarter of #4 buck out of a 12 gauge at 20 yards using tow as wadding. At 40 yards with that load it would be a joke. Enjoyed reading and watching as always. šŸ‘
 
It seems to me there is a huge number of hunters who simply can not wrap their head around where buckshot comes into play. That is no fault of the hunter, they simply have not experienced an environment that favors close and quick shots. The best way I can explain it, is to give stories and examples.

I hunt deer in central MN, which is mixed woods, fields, and swamp. Emphasis on the swamp. You could set up on a field, but you won't shoot a full grown buck that way, at least not without having access to a bunch of fields, and scouting day after day. You can certainly shoot a doe or small buck that way. A ton of hunters set up in the woods, which sometimes works, but it is more complex than you would think. Woods is not woods. Especially on public land, you can guarantee everyone and their brother has sat, and probably smoked in the big woods of any public land. The big problem I've found, both public, and private land, is that deer have figured this out. MN can range from gently rolling land to extremely hilly. Deer love to bed and travel on the high ridges. They know they can see and smell everything there. There is almost no way you can get in and set up without them seeing or smelling you. The swamps are a hidden gold mine that no one will exploit due to the physical difficulty it can be to hunt them. Deer know these areas are safe, and they love side cover which open woods do not afford. Big bucks don't wander into most agricultural fields in the day, and any that wander through the woods are killed on day one by bow hunters. The very best tactic I've developed for big bucks in MN is to hunt travel corridors, and that almost always involves the swamps. MN swamps are wet, full of 6 foot plus tall cattails, thorns, and dead/fallen trees. Deer don't just slowly meander through these areas, usually they are walking erratically (they don't like to be wet either), or trotting, but swamps do funnel them well.

The first example has happened to me time, after time, after time. We were not allowed buckshot in Minnesota, and I can count on a huge missed opportunity every year because of it. I set up in an area that I know is a heavily used deer trail, but the brush only allows a few narrow shooting windows. Inevitably, a deer comes trotting through, I pull up, and I can't get him to stop in the clearing, which is rarely more than a window wider than a deer length. Off trots the buck. Now lets take that same scenario, and use a shotgun with buckshot. You have a gun that is made to be used on moving targets, and you have ammo that is made for moving targets. I see a buck I like coming, pull up the shotgun, and bang, roll him in his tracks at 20 yards.

So some say why not just shoot a bullet? Look, I'm not an expert shooter. I'm better than the average shooter. I shoot shotgun on clays most of the year, thousands of rounds down range. I duck hunt all fall, and have plenty of practice by deer season. Do I feel confident taking a trotting deer at 20 yards with a slug, ball, or bullet? Probably, depending on the gun. If I were smart enough to go out with a well fitted shotgun with a ball or slug, then I probably would. Since I usually go for the rifle, it isn't as easy. And lets say it turns out to actually be 40 yards. Then no, I would not feel comfortable taking that shot with a single ball, but would definitely take it with buckshot as long as they were moving slow enough. Low brush adds a lot of shooting difficulty that big woods, or open field shooters can't understand.

The second example would be one I'm currently trying to work around. There is private land I've been hunting since I was a little kid. This particular spot is where I shot my first ever deer. It used to be that deer ran north and south on a main trail, and shots were close, but relatively open. About 10 years ago, someone built a house not too far away on that deer trail, cut down all the trees and everything. So now the deer move more N to SW, and do not go through the open any more. I've moved a stand to allow perfect 15 to 30 yard shots, but have not hunted it in years. The problem is there is now a house about 400 yards downrange. It is shooting into a hole, with a large hill for a backstop, but I still don't feel comfortable shooting a ball or slug that direction.

So some say why not move the stand? Well I could, and am contemplating it. This is near the property line, so options are limited. In the other spot, it would require a ton of clearing trees to cut shooting lanes, which would work, but unless I cut down half the woods, we are back in scenario #1, although in this instance deer usually only walk through, rather than trot. The other option is to bow hunt. I shoot bow from time to time, but I'll admit I find it real boring after a while. Crossbows are legal in the firearms season, but it doesn't seem right to buy something just to cheat. The ideal solution for me would be buckshot. Shooting in this spot downhill, with that large of a hill for a backstop, I would not be afraid of buckshot being a danger.

The last scenario seems to be controversial, and that is running deer. I had the unfortunate instance last year of having to make a split second decision to either make or break the season. I had hunted all season after one of a few bucks on private land, and I was down to about 4 days left in the muzzleloader season, our last season. I was sitting against a tree in a relatively open travel route for deer with my TC renegade rifle. A buck I was after came from straight behind me at a gallop on the trail only 20 yards or so from me. I raised the rifle and made a noise to stop him. Instead of stopping, he turned and went full speed. I was given a perfectly broadside 40 yard shot, and I took it. He ran full sprint for 50 yards, stumbled, made it 50-75 more yards and fell over dead. I had made a perfect double lung shot. There is a more sad outcome to that story, but that was no fault of the rifle, and that is for another day.

So some say, where's the problem? I made a perfect shot. Let me tell you, "nail biter" does not even begin to describe the pressure of trying to put a single ball in the exact spot you need to on a buck you've hunted all season, 4 solid days of the last week of the season in December, on a deer running full speed. If it had not been for a season of practice on moving targets, and an extremely cool head when I needed it, a lesser hunter may not be able to do it. We are talking about putting a single ball in about a 12" circle at 40 yards, on a deer moving something like 25 mph, also bounding up and down, while you are ice cold, and tired as can be. It's tough. I'm not saying buckshot would make it easy, but what it allows is again a gun that is made for such shooting, making it easier on you. On top of that, buckshot itself, provided you did homework, allows you to be off by even 24", and you will still put multiple pellets in a vital.

The other thing buckshot does, is it hits multiple things at once. The problem people can have with buckshot is they are relying on one golden ball to find a mark. That's wrong. Buckshot is shot, for shotguns. Treat it the same as you would shooting ducks or geese. If you choose the right load, you can have multiple pellets in the lungs, and some will probably find the shoulder, spine, neck, or other vital part of the deer too. Some dedicated buckshot hunters shoot deer at the base of the neck, because it is the least moving part of a deer, plus you are putting pellets in the most incapacitating area of a deer.

So there is at least 3 scenarios that I find myself in most years that buckshot no only would be the best tool for the job, it would mean success over failure. Buckshot is a specialized tool, for a very multi-purposed weapon. Would I use buckshot for deer hunting here in South Dakota? Heck no. Everything is so open, and shots can be long. Even the tree lines, or tiny patches of what I can barely call woods do not grow the low brush like in MN, grass dominates here. Would I load buckshot if I were to hunt over an open field or food plot? No, shots in those instances or so easy, why would you?

And that bit about buckshot being a crippler, that's nonsense. A person could definitely cripple a deer with it, but that's no fault of the ammo. Even 4 buck will fully penetrate large deer at reasonable ranges under 40ish yards. Nobody doubts the power of a shotgun slug or ball, do they? Well I grew up in slug only country, and guess what? Most of the wounded deer were with slugs. Go up north, and most of the wounded deer were with rifle bullets. Should I even mention the thousands of deer poorly shot with a bow and arrow every year? I guarantee more deer are poorly shot with arrows than any other hunting method. I may come across as heartless, but I really don't care. I do care about wounding deer myself, but I do not care what others do, that's for them to live with. I see reports online (key word) of all these deer running around with bullet holes. You know what though, in all my life, out of I couldn't even say how many deer, my family has shot ONE deer that was previously wounded by a bullet, one hole in the leg, and it probably would have lived without suffering, had my uncle not put another slug through both it's lungs. I did one time see a doe hobbling, that I suspect was shot above the spine, but never could confirm it. Other than that, by a HUGE margin, deer are wounded by cars, not bullets, arrow, or buckshot.
 
Last edited:
Here in Virginia,the section I live in is buckshot only door deer,have used 10ga for years,never no-4 buck though, either "0" up to triple "0", patterns like those, here would not be acceptable, leaving more crippled then killed,and putting you in dutch with the game wardens. But it's a nice begining,try a little corn meal or saw dust shifted into your shot load,of course that will require a premade. paper shot cup. Good luck on the testing
 
Shot cased in a brown paper bag tube holds a much better pattern. I make mine like a coin wrapper with a minimal glued seam overlap, and fold the ends like coin rolls, loaded over a 1/8" powder card and 1/2" fiber wad with one over shot card. At 25 yds, my 10ga Pedersoli double barrel will put 18, 00 buck pellets in a 18" circle. 30 yds would be my limit due to reduced killing power due to velocity loss. The pattern also opens up more after 30yds. I plan to load a ball in the cylinder bore barrel and 00buck in the improved choke barrel.
 
Iā€™d love to see a ā€˜sportsmanā€™ go down to the swamps of Louisiana and tell one of them old boys they shouldnā€™t use buckshot on deer. I used to hunt down there around Houma and the deer were always on the run and if you got a shot at all it was 7 yards away and you had to be fast on the trigger. Of course, those boys mostly logged or worked shrimp boats and if they missed the shrimp or the Mills werenā€™t taking lumber it was Possum in the pot, deer full of buckshot, or government cheese. Absolutes donā€™t work in a world that has more than one frame of reference.
 
I enjoyed the videos -- looks like nice country side there. When I lived in NJ my family hunted deer together and at that time you could only use buckshot then later they allowed slugs also. MANY deer were killed with buckshot also many deer ran away and were found later after a LONG tracking in HEAVY cover - some were never found.
 
I don't know how I forgot, but I meant to mention that for fox, I think you are limiting yourself with 4 buck. #2 shot or BB is kind of the usual zone. I think BB would be a perfect choice. I've been using F shot for coyote for years, but I'm starting to warm up to BB more and more for them too.
 
I don't know how I forgot, but I meant to mention that for fox, I think you are limiting yourself with 4 buck. #2 shot or BB is kind of the usual zone. I think BB would be a perfect choice. I've been using F shot for coyote for years, but I'm starting to warm up to BB more and more for them too.
I did mention the larger bird shot for fox is more reliable.
 
I did mention the larger bird shot for fox is more reliable.

I'm simply relaying my own experiences. It seems to me you are likely more experienced with fox than I am.

I did rewatched your videos, and noticed you mention your Pederosli 10 gauge shoots low. Mine did as well. Unfortunately I never did come up with a perfect solution for that. I had been shooting mine with a slip on cheek pad, but it felt weird shooting it and seeing so much of the top of the barrels.
 
Back
Top