.62 rifle range results

[pamtnman]

The .62 rifle was finally shot and sighted in. Thank you for all the excellent advice on loads.
It was not harsh or painful to fire…but it’s no shrinking violet, either. It’s quite a roar. Mark Wheland did an outstanding job fitting that unusual butt plate to my shoulder, along with lining up my cheek on the cheek rest. Everything locks in tight, so the detonation is not at all jarring or heavy. It’s just a good shove.
Here below is the target used to sight in the .62 rifle. Four shots total. Good job on the windage, Wheland! He had that right on “dead nuts.” No drifting sights was needed.
Going on gut instinct and the advice of a number of online personalities here, I started and finished at 105 grains of Swiss FFG. With a standard blue and white pillow ticking patch at 0.013” thickness and lubricated with bear oil, and a 335-grain .605” soft lead ball, the charge was easy enough to load in the .615” bore. The only things requiring adjustment were my anti-flinch mechanism (shot 1), and the rear sight (shots 2-3). I’ll shoot it at 100 yards next, and it may require the rear sight to be pushed all the way back. It may not, too, because as can be seen, the ball hits exactly at point of aim at 70 yards, and is likely to maintain this trajectory another 30 yards.
I am very happy with the Colerain barrel that Scott cut to order, too. The long, slow twist and shallow grooves make this an accurate rifle that is also easy to clean.

 

[deermanok]

Nice looking rifle, shoots good too.

 

[pamtnman]

Nice looking rifle, shoots good too.

Thank you! It’s really accurate at 70 yards, and I hope it’s the same out to 100 yards, or more. More shooting will reveal its true capability. But for now, it’s right on at 75 yards.

 

[Stony Broke]

Hard for me to imagine that large of a load in a .62. I have owned one for years, and never shot over 70 grains in it with a prb. It drops deer with no problem using that load. If I were loading for accuracy, I'd probably be using lighter loads yet.....

 

[excess650]

Hard for me to imagine that large of a load in a .62. I have owned one for years, and never shot over 70 grains in it with a prb. It drops deer with no problem using that load. If I were loading for accuracy, I'd probably be using lighter loads yet.....

That isn't a heavy charge by any stretch of the imagination. I'm running 60gr ffg in my .45, and 80gr fffg in my .50 because that is what they want as evidenced by the targets. My .54 percussion liked 85gr fffg, and my rifled .62 likes 100-120gr fffg, or 120-140gr ffg.

Pamtnman's load of 105gr Swiss ffg is in line with my Goex loads.

 

[pamtnman]

Hard for me to imagine that large of a load in a .62. I have owned one for years, and never shot over 70 grains in it with a prb. It drops deer with no problem using that load. If I were loading for accuracy, I'd probably be using lighter loads yet.....

When the research on the caliber was done and the subsequent discussion was under way with Colerain Barrels and gunmaker Mark Wheland about possible rifling twist and type, and groove depth, it was generally recognized that this barrel might require powder charges from 110 to 140 grains to get the trajectory needed for a 100-yard rifle. Right now it’s doing fabulous at 75 yards with 105 grains. But if I start shooting at 100 yards and IF the ball is low…it’s going to take another 5-10 grains of Swiss FFG to get that 335-grain ball back up into the bullseye. Which is right in the range the experts originally calculated it to be. And that hands-on shooters like Excess routinely shoot out of necessity.
I know it sounds like an unnecessary charge, but it is a big bore after all. Thanks for the interest! You should break out your old .62 and let ‘er rip with 100 grains and see how she does.

 

[Stony Broke]

The last match I shot in, I managed 4 possibles out of 4 targets....using 40 grains of 3f out of a 45 barrel. I'm sorry, but hitting things is more important to me than just using large loads of powder. To each his own I guess.....best of luck...

 

[pamtnman]

The last match I shot in, I managed 4 possibles out of 4 targets....using 40 grains of 3f out of a 45 barrel. I'm sorry, but hitting things is more important to me than just using large loads of powder. To each his own I guess.....best of luck...

Seriously?
You think a .45 is the same as a .62? And you are shooting in matches? Right?
If you look at the target posted above, that 105 grain charge is the bare minimum needed to have the 335-grain lead ball “hit things.”
This is a pure hunting rifle for killing different big game, not just deer. It is not a match rifle. It takes raw power to achieve this big game killing goal. I don’t understand why you would judge this as some aberration, or judge it at all. Do you hunt big game with muzzleloaders? If yes, what charges work for you? What black powder load would you use for elk, black bear, caribou, mule deer?
Sir Samuel Baker used a double .577 BPE for elk, and used his one ounce round ball rifle for most other big game. I think he knew how to hunt well

 

[Stony Broke]

I do a little hunting now and then, but none of the real big stuff like elk, etc..... I do shoot whitetails on a regular basis. I never meant my comment to be figured as an aberration, just a comment. I just don't really consider huge loads of black powder necessary for a lot of things. If I were to try for something like a water buffalo, then I would want a larger load, but I do okay with nothing over about the 70 gr. range. Like I said....to each his own.....no offense meant.

 

[pamtnman]

Cool pictures!
We can at least agree that a pickup truck bed is supposed to be actually used. I think yours beats mine, though. It’s a badge of honor.
The amount of powder people use in large bore hunting rifles isn’t much of a personal choice. It’s what works vs what won’t work. If you are hunting up close, and your gun will deliver the accuracy and terminal results you need with a reduced charge, then that’s fantastic. Why not do it?!
Like other big bore rifles, this .62 has to be a 100-yard gun, which requires significant powder. It’s a pretty linear relationship that is the heart of the black powder firearm.
Got a big lead missile you gotta get up and move? Want more death ray result? Then pour in a lot more powder!

 

[R.J.Bruce]

pamtnman

What rate of twist, and groove depth did Scott cut for you in this barrel?

I loved my .62 caliber Getz barrel with its 1:48" twist in the iron-mounted, Lancaster-style, Siler flintlock longrifle that I owned for a short time in the 90's. It was a tack driver at 100 yards. Could keep 5 shots under a silver dollar.

I'm sure you will enjoy this rifle as much as I did mine. I can feel it from the context of your posts. ENJOY!!!!!!!

I shot 75 grains of fffg Goex, and I never found the recoil objectionable.

 

[Britsmoothy]

Cool pictures!
We can at least agree that a pickup truck bed is supposed to be actually used. I think yours beats mine, though. It’s a badge of honor.
The amount of powder people use in large bore hunting rifles isn’t much of a personal choice. It’s what works vs what won’t work. If you are hunting up close, and your gun will deliver the accuracy and terminal results you need with a reduced charge, then that’s fantastic. Why not do it?!
Like other big bore rifles, this .62 has to be a 100-yard gun, which requires significant powder. It’s a pretty linear relationship that is the heart of the black powder firearm.
Got a big lead missile you gotta get up and move? Want more death ray result? Then pour in a lot more powder!

Kind of agree but not totally.
The only real advantage in upping the charge is to flatten the trajectory.
With a lead ball, especially large ones on large game one starts to get diminishing returns. Performance is certainly not linear!
What is most likely to happen is the ball will flatten itself earlier in the animal. That's fine, just as long as it tracks a true course through the animal!
Oh and if the rifle was mine, I probably would of dumped 150gn down there from the get go.

All that said, awesome .

 

[pamtnman]

pamtman

What rate of twist, and groove depth did Scott cut for you in this barrel?

I loved my .62 caliber Getz barrel with its 1:48" twist in the iron-mounted, Lancaster-style, Siler flintlock longrifle that I owned for a short time in the 90's. It was a tack driver at 100 yards. Could keep 5 shots under a silver dollar.

I'm sure you will enjoy this rifle as much as I did mine. I can feel it from the context of your posts. ENJOY!!!!!!!

Nice note, RJ, thank you!
You read my posts well. I am excited. This project has been a long time in the works.
The twist rate is 1:72, and I don’t recall the groove depth. But it is quite shallow. We looked at a twist of 1:90-1:96, but that would have required even larger powder charges. I felt intimidated by that, and would only shoot that amount if I were after water buffalo or true dangerous game. Which I’m not.
The bore groove diameter is .615”, not a true .62. But the shallow grooves allow a large .605” round ball and relatively thin patch. That’s what using a big bore rifle is all about. Thanks again for your nice note.
Why did you sell your tack driving Getz barreled rifle?

 

[pamtnman]

Kind of agree but not totally.
The only real advantage in upping the charge is to flatten the trajectory.
With a lead ball, especially large ones on large game one starts to get diminishing returns. Performance is certainly not linear!
What is most likely to happen is the ball will flatten itself earlier in the animal. That's fine, just as long as it tracks a true course through the animal!
Oh and if the rifle was mine, I probably would of dumped 150gn down there from the get go.

All that said, awesome .

150 grains from the get-go?! You probably like big block 1960s muscle cars, too
Hey, if the rifle doesn’t print point-of-aim at 100 yards with 105 grains, then I will up the charge until it does what I want. It may very well end up at 150 grains of FFG. Remains to be seen. You are probably on to something

 

[R.J.Bruce]

Nice note, RJ, thank you!
You read my posts well. I am excited. This project has been a long time in the works.
The twist rate is 1:72, and I don’t recall the groove depth. But it is quite shallow. We looked at a twist of 1:90-1:96, but that would have required even larger powder charges. I felt intimidated by that, and would only shoot that amount if I were after water buffalo or true dangerous game. Which I’m not.
The bore groove diameter is .615”, not a true .62. But the shallow grooves allow a large .605” round ball and relatively thin patch. That’s what using a big bore rifle is all about. Thanks again for your nice note.
Why did you sell your tack driving Getz barreled rifle?

Life showed up, and all my weapons were sold. No regrets.

 

[Terry Lightle]

Beautiful rifle,use ever how much powder it takes to get it where you want it and have fun.

 

[Notchy Bob]

Nice note, RJ, thank you!
You read my posts well. I am excited. This project has been a long time in the works.
The twist rate is 1:72, and I don’t recall the groove depth. But it is quite shallow. We looked at a twist of 1:90-1:96, but that would have required even larger powder charges. I felt intimidated by that, and would only shoot that amount if I were after water buffalo or true dangerous game. Which I’m not.
The bore groove diameter is .615”, not a true .62. But the shallow grooves allow a large .605” round ball and relatively thin patch. That’s what using a big bore rifle is all about. Thanks again for your nice note.
Why did you sell your tack driving Getz barreled rifle?

Relatively shallow grooves with a very slow twist and a large bore, requiring substantial powder charges for flat trajectory and downrange energy retention is practically the definition of the Forsyth system.

I don't read every post here on the forum, and if there was a prior discussion of the OP's rifle, I missed it. I would like to know more about it, and see more pictures.

In any event, I think @pamtnman put a lot of careful thought into his rifle and came up with a winning combination. It would be very informative to see the results of shooting this rifle over a chronograph.

I also want to commend all of the contributors to this thread for maintaining a civil and gentlemanly discussion. Differences of opinion were managed cordially, and efforts were made to establish "common ground."

Good discussion!

Notchy Bob

 

[kemart17]

I do a little hunting now and then, but none of the real big stuff like elk, etc..... I do shoot whitetails on a regular basis. I never meant my comment to be figured as an aberration, just a comment. I just don't really consider huge loads of black powder necessary for a lot of things. If I were to try for something like a water buffalo, then I would want a larger load, but I do okay with nothing over about the 70 gr. range. Like I said....to each his own.....no offense meant.

nice pic with hog and handgun, and to weigh in on this. shot placement is way more important then horsepower. just saying

 

[excess650]

I would hope that your flinch was just in anticipation of the first shot from the new rifle. I would have been apprehensive as well with that buttplate! Now that you know it isn't going to hurt, maybe a better defined aiming point and some range time will build some confidence.

As for powder charge, shoot what the gun likes and yields a suitable trajectory. I TRY to limit my shots to 100 yards or less knowing that roundballs lose velocity pretty quickly. That said, with a self imposed limit of 100 yards, its nice to have enough remaining velocity to get the job done. In Pennylvania, big game means WT deer and black bear, but elk permits can be drawn via lottery. The black bears in Pa can be huge, and it took more than 600# to make the top 10 in 2020.

https://www.media.pa.gov/pages/game-commission-details.aspx?newsid=448

 

[R.J.Bruce]

With all the posts/threads lately about big bore hunting rifles I am sorely tempted to ask Colerain to make me a .62 caliber barrel with the following attributes

1. 37" long** swamped** octagon-round rifle barrel** w/a double-tapered flared muzzle
2. Modified & shortened, Honaker, S.W. Virginia profile, Wythe & Pulaski Counties (Rice M-L)
3. 4140CM steel construction
4. Barrel Dimensions
1.500" A.t.F. octagon × 0" = Breech
1.356" A t.F. octagon × 6"
Transition from octagon to round × 14.8"
0.900" × 18" = Beginning/Waist
0.900" × 30" = Ending/Waist
0.960" × 35" = Start/Flared Muzzle
1.080" × 37" = Muzzle
5. 3/4"-16 × 0.500" deep threads for the breech plug
6. 60° crown, later modified to radius crown
7. 2:1 ratio, gain twist rifling
8. 1:168" rate of twist at the breech
9. 1:84" rate of twist at the muzzle
10. .62 caliber
11. 0.620" bore diameter
12. 0.632" groove diameter
13. 0.006" deep square bottom grooves
14. 8-groove Forsyth rifling
15. 4:1 ratio, of groove width, to land width
16. Circumference equals Pi times Diameter
17. C = πd
18. C = 3.14 × 0.620" bore diameter
19. C = 1.9468"
20. 1.9468 ÷ 8 grooves/lands = 0.24335"
21. 0.24335" ÷ 5 (4:1 ratio, groove width, to land width) = 0.04867"
22. 0.04867" = the width of the 8 lands
23. 0.04867" × 4 = 0.19468"
23. 0.19468' = the width of the 8 grooves
24. Flint, 2-pc, fowler-style, hooked breech plug & tang set
25. 6" long beavertail tang w/an integral, 1.500", across the flats octagon × 5/16" thick, recoil shoulder face plate
26. Plate pierced, fitted, and tightly mated to the rear face of the barrel/breech plug & the hook
27. 0.500" long thread journal w/integral hook
28. Integral to the top flat of the rear 6" of the octagonal breech**Talley**scope ring**dovetail bases w/recoil shoulders**machined directly into the top flat of the barrel**by Dove's Custom Guns**325 Ingleside Rd.**Princeton, WV 24739** 1-304-425-2023 **www.doveguns.com ** [email protected]

This type of barrel would have all the attributes of a regular Forsyth barrel, but with Colerain's gain twist rifling. Which, if it works anything like it does with a patched ball with deep grooves, then it would possibly allow for a gentler transition after ignition from the very slow, 1:168" twist at the breech, to the slow, 1:84" twist at the muzzle.

Edit:
Instead of a flintlock, I would have several, custom fabricated, 4140CM steel percussion drums machined on a lathe. They would be 7/16" in diameter, and the ends would be machined with a 3/16" hex nut shape that would accept a socket wrench. Drilled and tapped for 1/4"-28 nipple seat threads. If I could find one I would use a Bob Roller Hawken percussion lock (hammer spur bent outwards), along with a set of Bob Roller Hawken double set triggers. Set in a nice piece of Ron Scott English walnut fashioned into an English Sporting Rifle, halfstock profile w/Alexander Henry forearm. Kick-eez Magnum recoil pad installed at 13" L.O.P. Hand-forged, English, rear scroll triggerguard with an X-L bow that will accept a winter-gloved trigger finger. Steel underrib, screwed, or copper pinned to the barrel, with 2 forward 3/8" ramrod pipes silver soldered to the underrib. Talley, Signature Series, steel scope rings, pair, 30mm, low, matte, Q-D lever. If I could find one in good condition, a used, fixed power, Zeiss, 4 × 40mm riflescope.