All of this misinformation is really getting old

[N.Y. Yankee]

Speaking with one of my customers the other day about black powder hunting and told him I just picked up a .54 Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Hawken. He starts in with "why a 54? You only need a 45!" and then goes into "make sure you season the bore, you can't use any oils in the bore, use boiling hot water to clean it, that gun will kick like a mule", on and on. Every time I tried to explain why that is all myths and old wives tales, he gets very defensive and tells me he has been shooting black powder over 20 years. I told him I have been shooting BP since I was 16, I'm 54 now and have learned very much about it. He seemed to calm down. Then he tells me "your best load will be to put the ball in your palm and cover it with powder. Whatever that weight of powder is, just keep shooting that weight". I almost laughed in his face. I asked him if he ever heard of working up a load for a gun. He says "Oh yah, I do it all the time!". I said "OK, I need to go to lunch now." I've never seen so much misunderstanding in any topic. Yes, it's probably inexperienced shooters but the sayings get passed around so much they become convoluted. It's hard to take when they want to argue the point because they believe it so much.

 

[excess650]

Is his name Cliche?

 

[SDSmlf]

Offer to meet them at the range so they can demonstrate their knowledge and you can learn. Usually that will shut them up.

 

[SamTex1949]

it sounds like in his own mind he has shot for 20 years, maybe an alternate reality ??

 

[springfield art]

Speaking with one of my customers the other day about black powder hunting and told him I just picked up a .54 Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Hawken. He starts in with "why a 54? You only need a 45!" and then goes into "make sure you season the bore, you can't use any oils in the bore, use boiling hot water to clean it, that gun will kick like a mule", on and on. Every time I tried to explain why that is all myths and old wives tales, he gets very defensive and tells me he has been shooting black powder over 20 years. I told him I have been shooting BP since I was 16, I'm 54 now and have learned very much about it. He seemed to calm down. Then he tells me "your best load will be to put the ball in your palm and cover it with powder. Whatever that weight of powder is, just keep shooting that weight". I almost laughed in his face. I asked him if he ever heard of working up a load for a gun. He says "Oh yah, I do it all the time!". I said "OK, I need to go to lunch now." I've never seen so much misunderstanding in any topic. Yes, it's probably inexperienced shooters but the sayings get passed around so much they become convoluted. It's hard to take when they want to argue the point because they believe it so much.

Every field has it's "cranks", but ML has more than it's share!

 

[Grenadier1758]

... Then he tells me "your best load will be to put the ball in your palm and cover it with powder. Whatever that weight of powder is, just keep shooting that weight"....

Of all the relatively debatable statements, this is one of the least totally bogus. While not necessarily the most optimum load, the powder over the ball in your palm will be a usable load.

It is also interesting in that most of those statements do not address the conditions and purpose for which the rifle is to be used.

Boiling hot water will clean the black powder fouling, but so will tepid tap water with a squirt of dish washing detergent.

"Seasoning" the bore is totally useless.

Avoiding petroleum based oils is another myth. We use WD40, Rem oil, Ballistol, Barricade, EEZOX, RIG and a host of other oils. I get the same crusty ring with Ballistol and water for a patch lube as I get with bee's wax and olive oil.

How much powder one loads with and ball or conical will determine how hard the rifle kicks.

Hearing tales such as your customer is spouting can be quite humorous and falls into the out of context thread.

 

[bang]

Best to use dead end statements to people like that or just excuse yourself form participation.

 

[Phil Coffins]

I hear these people often and all I can say is “You’ll get used to it.”

 

[Whitworth]

"Better to remain silent and thought the fool than to speak and remove all doubt" or words to that effect. I love to listen to the crap you overhear at gun shows

 

[Eutycus]

I would like to hear more about that "it'll kick like a mule" part.

 

[Old Hawkeye]

I believe it was Mark Twain that said, "Never argue with an idiot, he will wear you down with experience & beat you in the end"!!

 

[mushka]

It's really difficult to educate a closed mind. It's easier to not try.

 

[Terry Lightle]

Lots of those people out there,I choose to keep my mouth shut and just listen so as to not look lika a....... well you know what I am saying

 

[kje54]

All my barrels come pre-seasoned..........

 

[renegadehunter]

There's a ton of people out there like that for sure.
The main one believed as gospel around here is that 3f should never be used in something over .50 cal.
I get some very earnest and concerned replies from people when I tell them that I use a 3f load for PRB in my .54.

 

[George]

I've heard every one of those statements on this and other ML boards hundreds of times over many years. I'll guarantee you there are a lot of people on this one right now that believe those and may others.

Spence

 

[Britsmoothy]

Actually using mineral oils is wrong.
Wrong in as much it could be argued it is not historically accurate.
Wrong in as much it will not absorb salts like animal and vet able can. So while you can indeed shoot on it it will not protect a found bore for an extended period of time. Over time the salts separate from mineral based oils and often separate the oil from the steel.
Due to my practice of duplicating what the early users of muzzleloaders used I can and do keep a fouled gun for weeks if I desire with no ill effect and no panic.

Possibly the thing about a seasoned bore stems from a fouled barrel but is thus protected by utilising the correct type of animal or vegetable fat. An early mountain man and others would of known that with animal fat no harm would really come from a fouled bore.

So in essence you can keep your wd40 and your rem oil carp.

 

[Britsmoothy]

One aspect is getting out of date but not without its uses!
Using boiling water was very useful way back when all percussion caps were extremely corrosive.
So from that angle it is out of date.

It has however never lost its ability to dry a cleaned barrel! Which when folk didn't have compressors or an endless supply of alcohol was good.
And it didn't freeze on the gun if you were out in sub zero temperature.

I still use it and it soothes me

 

[Grenadier1758]

And way back when one didn't have the grease cutting dish washer soap.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

I have a specific file on my phone where I store photos of many of the deer I have taken with my muzzleloader over the years. When folks see my flinter and say something like, "You can't take a deer with that unless you're [very close/very lucky] ", I smile, and nod, and after a few minutes I show them the photos, one at a time. I'm not a prolific deer harvester by any means, but after about half a dozen photos and still going, they shut up....

LD