Anybody here try this? Looks interesting...

[Skychief]

In the Spring 1998 issue of Blackpowder Hunting magazine is an article about paper "catridges" for cylinder bore muzzleloader use. Simply put, A slightly underbore sized dowel is used to properly roll heavy paper into a cylinder. Then, a bottom is fashioned to include a felt wad. Then a measured shot charge is placed into the "cartrige" (in the article, buffering of some sort was added as well). Then, the top of the paper is folded with a hole in its center and an overshot card placed on top. This paper cartridge nearly doubled the amount of hits on a turkey head/neck target at 30 yards using otherwise identical loads out of the same gun! I am planning to turkey hunt with an original civil war musket bored smooth to 17 1/2 gauge. Hence, the idea presented by the autor (Ross Seyfried) really peaked my interest. Has anybody tried this or something similar to increase pattern densities? Thanks for any and all thoughts and experiences! Skychief.

 

[jethro224]

Yep. I use post-it notes instead of "heavy paper" in a .62 smoothbore Renegade, otherwise, yep, exactly. Never read the article or heard of the guy.

Learned about the post-it shot cups here on the forum. Came up with the felt wad inside on my own. I use 4 overSHOT cards over the powder, then the post-it shot cup with the felt wad and shot inside, then 2 overshot cards. I use a jag with a lubed patch over it to seat the load.:thumbsup:

 

[Skychief]

Thanks for the reply Jethro! Can you tell me how much improvement your post-its made in your patterns? Hopefully others will chime in that have tried something like this too. In the meantime I will try to perform a search. Skychief.


Also, have you tried to buffer your shot with any materials?

 

[paulvallandigham]

The secret of builidng the shot cups the way the article and Jethro describe is that the use of the felt wad in the bottom of the shotcup allows the cup to be light enough to separate reasonable quickly from the shot. The post-it note, if wrapped twice around the mandrill, will provide sufficient protection for the shot to keep the outer pellets from rubbing flats on them. The use of a filler, like Puf-Lon, to fill the gaps in the shotcup in and around the pellets keeps them from being deformed on first firing, when the gases have to overcome the inertia of the shot to move it down the barrel. The " kick " to the cup often will deform the back or bottom 3-4 rows of pellets in a shotcup. Using a soft felt wad helps to prevent this happening. The more pellets that reach the target in tact, the better your chance of making a kill. To reach the target, pellets have to be round when they leave the muzzle. Greasing the bore ahead of the shot cup allows the cup to slide over the bore, and reduces friction that can burn through a paper cup and even does so in some modern shotguns, using plastic cups. Those " Burn through" holes will then expose the outer lead pellets to rubbing against the steel barrel, almost assuring that they will have flats when they leave the barrel, and all the pellets with flats will leave the pattern to hit the ground before reaching the target. You might not have put those pellets in the gun for all the good they do you.

Because different guns handle loads differently, you may want to try cutting 1/2" long slits in the mouth of the paper shotcups, to create " petals" similar to the ones seen on modern plastic shotcups. These petals will fold back when they leave the barrel, and become " air brakes" which helps to separate the cup from the shot. Depending on how much shot you shoot, and how deep the cuts are, you can adjust the density of your pattern somewhat. ( The shorter the petals, the longer the shot stays in the cup before being affected by the air. )

 

[jethro224]

Skychief, I can't tell you any number or percentage counts, just that the pattern was very noticeably better on paper targets.

I have not yet tried any buffers, but I do intend to try some cream of wheat or maybe corn meal.

My post-it shot cups shred and drop to the ground about 6 or 8 feet ahead or my muzzle. I don't perforate or slit them in any way. I have heard of cups that fail to shred and hit the target like a "slug". Have not seen it myself.

In addition to the benefits of a lubed bore that Paul mentioned, Loading with a greased patch makes it much easier to load and to clean.

Go check out the smoothbore forum section. Do a search there for the shot cups. Should turn up some good stuff.

 

[Skychief]

Great information guys! I greatly appreciate all the help. Hey Paul....I have read your theories about using thin cards only over the powder. You write that they should have holes in them and not lined up. All this makes sense to me. My question is ...what size holes should a guy put in the cards? Just a pin-prick or larger like bb-sized or something else? Thanks a bunch. I haven't been this intrigued with BP since getting my first Hawken many, many moons ago! Skychief.

 

[paulvallandigham]

A hole the size of a shirt pin should be wide enough to let air pass through to separate the cards. Remember the purpose of the hole is this ONLY function( although it helps putting cards down the barrel if the hole is present to prevent " dieseling " of the cards on top of the shot.)

I have an awl that is at least twice the diameter of that shirt pin, and the larger hole does not seem to have any negative effect. I think you could use the smallest size hole in a leather hole punch for this purpose.

Only if you are using the smallest shot sizes, such as #8, #9, or #12 shot, should you be concerned about a larger sized hole.

The main thing is to keep the hole off-center, but far enough from the edge so that you don't weaken the edge. The better intact the edges are on any card, the better the gas seal you get.

That is why, if you are shooting a barrel with traditional muzzle oriented choke( either choke tubes or a barrel that was choked at the factory)you bend(not Crease) the card slightly to push it through the choke, so you do the least damage to the edges.

When you use multiple cards, You bend one card oriented N/S( 12/6 o'clock), and the next oriented E/W( 3/9 o'clock). If an edge is turned in the loading process, the next card's edge on that side of the circumference is in tact, and provides the necessary seal.

 

[Skychief]

Well, I did some experimenting with these shot "cartridges". Details later as I have an appointment. Skychief.