Baker Rifle Options??

[jon math]

I have always liked the looks of the British Baker rifle. I understand that aside from originals and a couple of Indian exports the only options are expensive customs with long lead times. I’ve been lead to believe that Waterloo re-enacting is as popular in Europe as ACW is in the U.S. yet Pedersoli and the like have yet to do a reproduction, which is too bad. I guess the re-enactor is happy to have a blank go off and a boom come out the muzzle, I’d like to shoot the thing and I do not trust the Indian copies.

So does the Pedersoli Jaeger rifle handle about the same as a Baker? I’m a hunter so the lack of a bayonet lug is not a big deal and the sling mounting to the butt stock rather than the front of the trigger guard is not the end of the world for me. Not having the dual leaf rear sight pains me more than the other features.

 

[MountainRanger]

Don't know anything about the jaegers, but here is a place that sells shooting versions of the Baker. I also cannot speak to quality of this outfit, but on another board, I have seen the company discussed with good remarks...
http://www.loyalistarms.freeservers.com/bakerifle.html

 

[tenngun]

I think that one is a smooth bore, I don't know if any one does s rifled version of this.
A Jagar is a hunting gun. You can hunt with a military arm, lots do, the 1803 is a prime example. However the needs of hunting makes a hunters rifle more comfortable for many to carry afield.

 

[BrownBear]

Wish I'd taken some pics, because it might be the answer for your hunting wishes.

A guy who used to live here made up what he called a "Charlie" rifle because he couldn't get a Baker. He ignored details like correct lock and furniture while keeping proportions and dimensions and going with 69 caliber rifled.

What a treat to handle and shoot! I can't say I've handled many Jaegers, but I certainly preferred the fit and feel of his Charlie rifle to any Jaeger I've handled and shot.

BTW- His double leaf sights were regulated at 75 and 150 yards and he shot it often at a 150 yard gong (24" round). He never tried game shots at much more than 100 yards, but it was convincingly accurate for game at that range. Hit the gong so many times one of the chains popped free and he had to re-weld it, if that tells you about accuracy further out.

 

[satx78247]

As of less than 6n months ago, there was NO ready source for a RIFLED Baker, except having them custom-made. - A group of Mexican Army re-enactors from Laredo tried HARD to find some for re-enacting The Battle of San Antonio.
(The Mexican Regular Regiments had "selected marksmen", who were armed with Baker rifles during the TX Revolution & that were used "to good effect" at the Siege of The Alamo fortress. = Those Baker rifles were purchased "as War of 1812 surplus" from the UK.)

SORRY. I wish that the news was better.

yours, satx

 

[Cowboy]

I too was fascinated with the British 1806 Baker Rifle the very first time I seen it. By coincidence that rifle was featured on two different programs I watched on the same night! The first program was on the Military channel called Battlefield Detectives which was covering the battle of Waterloo. A little later that same night I was watching Mail Call with R.Lee Ermey. He did a segment on the War of 1812. Both programs featured the Baker Rifle. It was love at first sight!

Up until that point I had been strictly a Percussion shooter and at the time flinter's really didn't appeal to me. Grew up out west and half stock plains type rifles were all I ever shot and owned. That all changed when I saw the Baker! I knew that I some how had to get a reproduction of one.

I googled the web trying to locate one. Checked Pedersoli's sight. Checked TOW archives. Looked everywhere to no avail. Spent the rest of the night surfing the web.

I ended up starting a topic here on the forum about that rifle which created a lot of responses. I learned quite a bit more about it.

The end of my story is that I eventually came to the conclusion that I was not going to find a quality Baker reproduction unless I ordered parts from the Rifle Shop and had it custom built, or get an India made one that would be a smoothbore without a flash hole drilled. Was very concerned about the quality of an India made gun and was not thrilled about having to have the barrel rifled and flash hole drilled to make it operable!

I did eventually get a nice little custom made flinter that some what looks similar to a Baker. I since then fired several rocklocks and am hooked!

I am pretty excited to learn that someone is finally going to come out with a reproduction of the Baker! I like the looks of the prototype and the price seems to be very good too! I will have to sit back and wait to see how they turn out and reviews from other's who purchased the first one's.

Here is my topic on the Baker:

http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/298826/post/1545012/hl//fromsearch/1/

Here is also my flinter that I ended up buying.



Respectfully, Cowboy

 

[galamb]

Loyalist Arms (used to) offer the Baker with a barrel built by Colerain (as an option). Don't know if they still do or not.

And while their Baker looks "ok", it still lacks if you look real close.

As others have stated, if you really want one, you need to source the parts and build or have one built.

 

[Artificer]

Jon,

The Baker was pretty much a militarized Jaeger Rifle. Since the Jaegers were first and some used flip up sights, that may be at least part of where they got the idea for the Baker.

I don't know how tall the front sight is on the Pedersoli Jaeger to be sure this folding sight would work as a replacement rear sight. First thing would be to check to see if the base is large enough to fit the rear sight dovetail on the Pedersoli Barrel. A tall front sight might call for a taller rear sight folding leaf or cut down the front sight to work. If the flip up sight is too short, you could make a taller one. If the front "squiggly" finial is too long, you could cut it shorter and reshape to your taste:
https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/880/3/RS-JAEG-2

Bottom line, if you want a flip up rear sight for the Pedersoli Jaeger, there are options for it.
Gus

 

[jon math]

Thanks, all; I was hoping I was missing something else out there. The options are pretty limited for an off the shelf reproduction at this time.

I do think the Jaeger will be what I'll end up with, that dual leaf rear sight is very interesting and I do see one in my future. Thanks for pointing it out!!

While searching I did find something on the Pedesoli site that has me overjoyed”¦namely a side by side flint lock shotgun. Wow! It’s just in the blog section with no details, I hope it is a prototype of a future offering, it looks amazing.

 

[azmntman]

I too was fascinated with the British 1806 Baker Rifle the very first time I seen it. By coincidence that rifle was featured on two different programs I watched on the same night! The first program was on the Military channel called Battlefield Detectives which was covering the battle of Waterloo. A little later that same night I was watching Mail Call with R.Lee Ermey. He did a segment on the War of 1812. Both programs featured the Baker Rifle. It was love at first sight!

Up until that point I had been strictly a Percussion shooter and at the time flinter's really didn't appeal to me. Grew up out west and half stock plains type rifles were all I ever shot and owned. That all changed when I saw the Baker! I knew that I some how had to get a reproduction of one.

I googled the web trying to locate one. Checked Pedersoli's sight. Checked TOW archives. Looked everywhere to no avail. Spent the rest of the night surfing the web.

I ended up starting a topic here on the forum about that rifle which created a lot of responses. I learned quite a bit more about it.

The end of my story is that I eventually came to the conclusion that I was not going to find a quality Baker reproduction unless I ordered parts from the Rifle Shop and had it custom built, or get an India made one that would be a smoothbore without a flash hole drilled. Was very concerned about the quality of an India made gun and was not thrilled about having to have the barrel rifled and flash hole drilled to make it operable!

I did eventually get a nice little custom made flinter that some what looks similar to a Baker. I since then fired several rocklocks and am hooked!

I am pretty excited to learn that someone is finally going to come out with a reproduction of the Baker! I like the looks of the prototype and the price seems to be very good too! I will have to sit back and wait to see how they turn out and reviews from other's who purchased the first one's.

Here is my topic on the Baker:

http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/298826/post/1545012/hl//fromsearch/1/

Here is also my flinter that I ended up buying.



Respectfully, Cowboy

Nice rifle Cowboy! :hatsoff:

 

[dav-az]

May I suggest you take a look at Chamber's English Sporting Rifle. I have one that was built without any decoration at all and it is a sweetheart of a gun.

 

[RAEDWALD]

My choice would be a Rifle Shoppe Baker (or a Dyson if I came into a large legacy) but the Baker Rifle is, in it's design, a German 18th century Jaeger rifle and whose main difference in the slow twist which keeps it freer from fouling. After all, the previous British service rifle (the Pattern 1776) was a British made copy of the ones they were buying in from Germany.

In paper service carbine cartridge mode I can see no reason why an Indian Baker (with it's lock sorted) would be any worse than the real thing.

Here is Rob using a rifled Rifle Shoppe Baker at 100 yards with paper cartridges (ie in smooth bore rapid fire mode as used in the period): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2YldCG9iBo

 

[Gene L]

I've seen other videos of the Baker being fired by this guy. Quite accurate. As an aside, I noticed he loads from the flask.

 

[jon math]

They claim they are spark proof, but I don’t trust them, I’ve seen too many with broken springs.

 

[tenngun]

I can't say anything to the quality of loyalist arms, but a few things to think of.
1) as a smooth bore it's not hc, but it would be effective on any North American game.
2)smoothies are versitle
3) drilling a touch hole is no biggy, a 1/16 hole drilled at the sunset position you do not have to instal a liner. Very few guns used them then.
4) even a low quality barrel is going to handle safe normal loads. Large magnum chargers never improve the guns prefomance,

 

[jon math]

Good points!

I have wanted to add a smooth rifle to my collection, the Indian copy is for all intents just that.

 

[tenngun]

I think middlesex village arms sells that same gun ready to shoot.
Yes a man with a big bore rifle can go after bulwinkle and Bambi, a big smoothy gets em too, but also rocky and thumper. You want ham and turkey for thanksgiving? A smoothy buys you both :wink:

 

[Cowboy]

If you want an India made one there is one on GB right now. It already has the flash hole drilled and ready to shoot. I shot the seller a question asking about if the flash hole had been already drilled, who made it and if it was rifled. It's a SB too!

Noticed it yesterday. A number of bids had already been placed and it was up to around $500 then. Don't know what it is now? It seemed to be in very nice shape.

If you want a Baker SB and don't mind an India made gun, there you go!

Respectfully, Cowboy

 

[Cowboy]

Ok, went back to GB. Here's what I found.
1. 12 bids placed and is now at $412 ( no reserve )
2. Factory New
3. Ready to shoot
4. Ends in 1 day, 3 hours
5. Item no. 567260307

Respectfully, Cowboy

 

[nwtradegun]

if you go with and auction house you will have to pay them a premium and fees. you might try track of the wolf. they have handled hi dollar guns.