Barrel underlug screw up!!!

[AeroE]

I think I would use it on a 21 1/2 inch barreled rifle; a man that lives in Eldon, Missouri has a similar rifle he's hunted with since the 60's. Very easy to carry and shoot, and doesn't look strange after just a little while.

 

[Zonie]

Here's where I can really stir the pot! ::

If the barrel is 20 1/2 inches long you could make a Canoe gun!
Yes!! That (according to some people) mythical gun that was made to be carried in a canoe.
Short (about 20 inch) barrel, slightly shortened length of pull but still something that can be shot from the shoulder.

Light weight and simple because you wouldn't want to throw a fully carved rifle with a lot of inlays into the bottom of the canoe.

Uh Oh...I see the PC police comming....gotta go! ::

If you do build something like that, remember, the front sight will have to be fairly high due to the swamp of the barrel. :front:

 

[Pork Chop]

Here is a thought. Instead of building something that you will put in the gun safe and always have a bit of frustration over as you will see it as a source of failure, why not build a down scale gun and give it to a kid to get them into the sport? You can use someone's cast off stock, a lock off of a spanish gun, and keep it plain and simple. Yes, it may look like a Red Ryder that grew up a little, but it could spark the fire for the next generation. (if one kid gets a gun, the others will bug mom and dad for one too - just like Tommy's down the street...)

Just a comment from the peanut gallery...

 

[Geoff Jones]

All great ideas....thanks guys. Old Army also contacted me to use the barrel for a pistol project he's contemplating...

Whatever happens to it...I'll be sure to post pictures of the creation. There's this Bucks county rifle to complete and two blanks for two fowlers in the workshop....so it may be awhile!

 

[3 stinky dogs]

This is why I am scared to death of thin barrel walls.

1/16" is too deep. You need to be only about 1/32" or so. I fit my tenons tight and then solder them in also...not period correct, I suppose, but you ain't gonna knock them suckers out!!! You'd be surprised how THIN the dovetails can be on old guns.

Actually, on one that is really thin like this, the best way to do it is to simply set the tenon on the bottom of the barrel and solder it on (lead or tin), then you never have to worry about whether or not you're too deep. I've done this once or twice.

the thaught of cutting Tennons and sight dove tails as well as other things has put me off the idea of building my own gun.Thanks for that suggestion

 

the thaught of cutting Tennons and sight dove tails as well as other things has put me off the idea of building my own gun.Thanks for that suggestion

Don't let that stop you... most kit providers will cut them for you before they ship you the kit for a modest fee, then you don't have to worry about that part. :redthumb:

 

[brubincam]

how far apart are the lugs? maybe the pieces between can be used for small or short pistols,,, :front:

 

[Darkhorse]

3 Stinky Dogs,
Everybody needs to learn how to cut dovetails. You start on the bottom of the barrel on the thick ends first. That way by the time you get to the waist lug or the sights you should have learned from your mistakes.
2 big problems most folks have is not getting a real sharp edge when you grind the safe edge on your file.
And not being able to file flat. I've been filing metal for nearly 40 years and still can't file flat. What I do is file a little from one side then switch sides and bring the other down to the same level. If I try to do it all from one side, no matter how careful I am, it still won't be flat.

 

[Stophel]

Buy one of the dovetail files from Brownell's. First thing you need to do is grind off the angle opposite the cutting surface....since as it comes that sucker is SHARP and will cut the crap out of you!!! These are extremely well made files, and even though I am very rough with tools, mine has lasted several YEARS.

 

[Mike Brooks]

the thaught of cutting Tennons and sight dove tails as well as other things has put me off the idea of building my own gun.Thanks for that suggestion

Cutting dove tails properly is no big deal, I even cut them for the lugs on fowler barrels.

 

[Darkhorse]

OK Mike. You can cut dovetails on a fowler.
But can you dance yet? :crackup:

Sorry. I couldn't resist.

 

[Mike Brooks]

OK Mike. You can cut dovetails on a fowler.
But can you dance yet? :crackup:

Sorry. I couldn't resist.

I'm 100% PC (Politically Correct) now, the kinder, gentler Mike Brooks. I'm pure milk toast. :bull:

 

[Birddog6]

I'm 100% PC (Politically Correct) now, the kinder, gentler Mike Brooks. I'm pure milk toast. :bull:

Yeah Mike...... so am I.... til someone Really ticks me off ! ha ha ha ! :crackup:

 

[BLAHMAN]

So, let me get this straight: if you cut the barrel in half, you could have two potential creations right?

Is that a 42 inch barrel? Each half would be 21 inches? You could make twins!

I wonder if the muzzle end has enough wall thickness to hold a breechplug?

Twins!

Think of it, you could have twins!

 

[Geoff Jones]

So, let me get this straight: if you cut the barrel in half, you could have two potential creations right?

Is that a 42 inch barrel? Each half would be 21 inches? You could make twins!

I wonder if the muzzle end has enough wall thickness to hold a breechplug?

Twins!

Think of it, you could have twins!

Blahman,

38" barrel...wouldn't be identical twins...just twins. Muzzle is 15/16ths I think on a B profile barrel. That woud be cutting it close with .50cal.......
geoff

 

[LSU TIGER]

I'd contact Scott Keller at Colerain and see what he has to say before chucking out another $200 on a barrel. I don't have the number at my fingertips, but a call to Track will work. I really don't think the barrel is ruined, just needs some TLC from the right person. :m2c:

 

[Flintandsteel]

Schimmelsmith,
Welcome to the club. I did exactly the same thing a number of years ago with the same barrel.
It seems I forgot about the swamp. Measured for my dovetails at the closest one to the breech, and mad all the rest of them the same. Obviously, the one at the waist is WAY too deep. Now I have a 29" tapered .50 cal barrel, and a 15" tapered .50 cal barrel.
The only thing to do with good conscience, is buy a new barrel, and chalk this one up to experience.
By the photos, the dovetail is VERY deep and really not necessary. Could be less than half that depth and still work great..or soldered in place at the waist.
One member on this board uses an old addage "measure twice, cut once". Now I measure 3 or 4 times, still make mistakes.
If you do the math however, you'll see that there really isn't room for a 1/16" deep dove tail on the waist of this barrel.
I just got mine out, and it mic's out at .730
If you subtract from that the bore size .50 plus the depth of rifling, twice you'll get .530 approximately.
.730-.530=.200 Divide that by 2 to get just one side and you've got a flat thickness of .100 if you sink a 1/16" dove tail you've got .100-.0625=.0375. If everything is perfect, you've got a barrel wall of less that .040" thick.
SCARY!!!
Didn't mean to get so involved with that, but if you're like me, sometimes it just takes putting things into practical terms to really see what's happening.
I really didn't see it, till I cut that barrel apart where I sawed into the rifling. The barrel walls are really THIN in that area, even with out a dovetail.
A costly mistake, but I for one, will never make that mistake again.
Good Luck my friend.
:: :curse: :redface:

 

[MSW]

Well, dubble bummer ... i like Zonie's idea about the 'blanket gun ... perhaps an odd- looking pistol ... anyway, i've been thinking about the staple system for a build using a 40 cal "A" profile. Am i about to get myself in a similar fix?

Thanks for any advice, words of wisdom, encouragement, etc.

MSW

 

[Zonie]

"i've been thinking about the staple system for a build using a 40 cal "A" profile. Am i about to get myself in a similar fix?"

Yup. The A barrel has a waist around .660.
.400 caliber + 2 X .010 groove depth = .420
.660-.420 = .240
.240/2 = .120 wall (if there is a rifleing groove in that area)

If you want a underlug in that area, it would be best to solder it in place rather than cut a dovetail or drill staple holes.

If you solder it, use one of the solders which has silver in it for the added strength silver gives.

 

[Geoff Jones]

Cut the barrel in half with a hack saw, it is scrap. After you cut it in half see if the barrel is bored off center. If it is Obviously bored off center & it caused you to get into the bore, call Scott Keller at Colerain & tell him you have a barrel that was bored off center & you got into the bore because of this. He will want to see it & most likely he will send you a new replacement barrel if they are ar fault.

Not to dredge up an old thread....but...bought a new barrel as suggested, used the old as a template...all is well.

Cut the old barrel in half at the dovetail...imagine my surprise...bore is offcenter (thinnest on dovetail side). I'm not in any way saying that my dovetail wasn't too deep...but I wonder if it would have dented if the bore was centered? Hope it shows up in the picture....seems pretty evident as I hold it...
Thoughts? anybody got Colerains phone number?