Bill Large Plains Rifle

[mushka]

l shoot everything that I have. I'm into functionality, not appearance. My shooters don't look beat up, just well used. A pretty gun is an invitation to shoot and get a little burnished.

 

[OldSmoky1967]

This is an interesting plains Rifle with a Bill Large barrel. I do not have in hand just yet. Has a 33" .54 caliber barrel. What I think is cleaver is the builder used a repurposed Whitney US musket lock dated 1848. What I consider to be a good representation of a frrontier lock replacement. Thoughts?View attachment 183351View attachment 183352View attachment 183353

Hello, I have found we bid against each other for the same items, occasionally. Great purchase!

 

[kipcarter]

Congratulations. Looks like an awesome rifle with a Large barrel. And the lock is an interesting addition.

I remember during the early to mid 1970's Bill was the only true "custom" barrel maker. I seem to recall there was a year's wait even back then. The only commercial barrels then were from Numrich and Douglas. With Dixie coming a bit latter with their 6 groove barrels from Japan. There were only a couple of custom lock/trigger makers then. Bob Roller's locks and triggers were much sought after for the Hawken rifle craze during the 1970's. The name of the other lock maker escapes me for the moment.

Rick

I seem to remember that Turner Kirkland at Dixie was having barrels made in Belgium in 1964/65. He called it a "slim jim" I think.

 

[52Bore]

I wonder if the builder of the OP rifle with Bill Large barrel used an original lock from 1848 to build a Hawken?
The iron mounting and trigger guard certainly look the Hawken part - as does the 1848 date.
Love the rifle.

 

[Rawhide67]

You must like looking at it. I have guns like that but they are originals. Then again I’m not in the habit of buying contemporary guns but if I had a beauty I might feel the same. I bet it would sell easily.

I’ve thought about selling it so someone could shoot it, but it wouldn’t be easily replaced. So it remains on the wall, as a display piece.

 

[OldSmoky1967]

I came across two Bill Large guns in a gun shop in Santa Fe a couple of years ago. At least they were attributed to him. Very chunky, blocky - looked like half the wood could have come off that stock to find a nice rifle underneath. OP's is purty.

David
NM

Did it look like this one?

 

[BigSkyRambler]

Did it look like this one?

That's a beefy looking trigger guard.

 

[OldSmoky1967]

That's a beefy looking trigger guard.

It is really thick and un-refined But the markings indicate this one pre-dates the advent of production kits. Most of Large's guns at time were "chunk" guns. This fits that bill Not sure if he put the whole gun together. Would like to see some pics of his early builds...

 

[Notchy Bob]

That's a beefy looking trigger guard.

It is really thick and un-refined But the markings indicate this one pre-dates the advent of production kits. Most of Large's guns at time were "chunk" guns. This fits that bill Not sure if he put the whole gun together. Would like to see some pics of his early builds...

I remember in the 1960's, Dixie Gun Works had a few "Hawken" parts, including a triggerguard which I believe was cast iron. Not steel... cast iron, like your old black skillet. I recall they had a warning or disclaimer that these guards could not be bent. You just had to use the shape as it was, although I suppose it could be ground or maybe filed a bit. I wonder if the guard on @OldSmoky1967 's rifle might be one of those. The presumed timeframe would be about right.

That is a sturdy, hefty-looking rifle, but for all that, it looks pretty well put together, especially considering the parts and resources that were available at the time it was probably built. It looks very shootable, and as has been repeated so many times, barrels by Bill Large were excellent. I think we sometimes take the information, parts, and general knowledge we have now for granted. People knew about and appreciated Hawken rifles sixty years ago, but there was a time when the only information most people could find about Hawken rifles was in a few magazine articles and passing mention in a couple of books. John Barsotti's two-part article, "Mountain Men and Mountain Rifles," in the 1954 and 1955 editions of Gun Digest, and a couple of pieces by James Serven in Guns magazine, probably provided the best photographs and written information most people could get, if they were interested in building a Hawken-inspired rifle.

I would agree, that is a beefy-looking trigger guard. It's a pretty cool rifle, though.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob

 

[OldSmoky1967]

I remember in the 1960's, Dixie Gun Works had a few "Hawken" parts, including a triggerguard which I believe was cast iron. Not steel... cast iron, like your old black skillet. I recall they had a warning or disclaimer that these guards could not be bent. You just had to use the shape as it was, although I suppose it could be ground or maybe filed a bit. I wonder if the guard on @OldSmoky1967 's rifle might be one of those. The presumed timeframe would be about right.

That is a sturdy, hefty-looking rifle, but for all that, it looks pretty well put together, especially considering the parts and resources that were available at the time it was probably built. It looks very shootable, and as has been repeated so many times, barrels by Bill Large were excellent. I think we sometimes take the information, parts, and general knowledge we have now for granted. People knew about and appreciated Hawken rifles sixty years ago, but there was a time when the only information most people could find about Hawken rifles was in a few magazine articles and passing mention in a couple of books. John Barsotti's two-part article, "Mountain Men and Mountain Rifles," in the 1954 and 1955 editions of Gun Digest, and a couple of pieces by James Serven in Guns magazine, probably provided the best photographs and written information most people could get, if they were interested in building a Hawken-inspired rifle.

I would agree, that is a beefy-looking trigger guard. It's a pretty cool rifle, though.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob

Hi Notchy! It shoots like a HOSS! 1 ragged hole at 100 yds. .54 caliber. .530 ball ..015 patch 70 grains 2F. I was quite impressed. It is a heavy gun, so not much recoil, either. Just a very tight load!

 

[Notchy Bob]

Hi Notchy! It shoots like a HOSS! 1 ragged hole at 100 yds. .54 caliber. .530 ball ..015 patch 70 grains 2F. I was quite impressed. It is a heavy gun, so not much recoil, either. Just a very tight load!

Now, that's what I'm talking about! A real shooter!

Like they said about old Jake Hawken's originals, they "...always shoot plumb centre."

Good for you, brother! Enjoy that rifle!

Notchy Bob

 

[rich pierce]

It is really thick and un-refined But the markings indicate this one pre-dates the advent of production kits. Most of Large's guns at time were "chunk" guns. This fits that bill Not sure if he put the whole gun together. Would like to see some pics of his early builds...

Sorry, he built few guns. The Bill Large marking on a barrel means he made the barrel. That’s all. Not the gun.

 

[Rawhide67]

Does anyone know if Large ever even build complete guns? And if so, how many.

 

[rich pierce]

Does anyone know if Large ever even build complete guns? And if so, how many.

Bob Roller knows.

 

[Rawhide67]

Bob Roller knows all. That man is an encyclopedia.

 

[OldSmoky1967]

Sorry, he built few guns. The Bill Large marking on a barrel means he made the barrel. That’s all. Not the gun.

I know.

 

[rich pierce]

I asked for first hand information on Bill Large, regarding whether he built many guns.
“The few he made were not flashy but totally useful and there were still a
few heavy bench rifles in the house when his daughter had to move in with her sister in Kentucky.
NONE are high art guns…….”

 

[William Sublette]

 

[3 trees]

One of my BL is a 36 that I inherited by default in the 70s, I was in high school and my brother in laws grand father died and nobody wanted the old muzzleloader!! One of my luckiest days. I stick it in the corner and didn’t mess with it for 10 years, it came with a ramrod and possibles/range box that was well built…BUT the gun was very plain, it shoot it and it shoot better then any rifle I owned. I assume that my brother in laws father had made it, but looking at your pics I am not so sure! Lot of similarities! But we will never know as I have it to my son and helped him restock it in curly wood from Hawaii, now it looks as good as it shootszz

 

[3 trees]

One of my BL is a 36 that I inherited by default in the 70s, I was in high school and my brother in laws grand father died and nobody wanted the old muzzleloader!! One of my luckiest days. I stick it in the corner and didn’t mess with it for 10 years, it came with a ramrod and possibles/range box that was well built…BUT the gun was very plain, it shoot it and it shoot better then any rifle I owned. I assume that my brother in laws father had made it, but looking at your pics I am not so sure! Lot of similarities! But we will never know as I have it to my son and helped him restock it in curly wood from Hawaii, now it looks as good as it shootszz

Forgot to say that the gun came from the clarksburg area of WV, not far from Charleston where Bill built 1000s of barrels!