Black Powder fouling in 54

[johnraleksa]

I am very knew to this and had read that 60 to 80 grains was typical. Not sure how your 350gr bullet compares to a patched round ball . I assume this is a conical bullet. I am hoping my biggest problem is that my store bought lubed patches are too dry. I ordered unlubed patches to try again.

round ball are smaller you should start with 40gr. and go up till you get what you want. grouping or killing power. being able to go though 3to 4 in of card board or 1to 2 in. wood will kill. try all different lubes I like bore butter but that is me.

 

[Siringo]

Kibler Colonial kit in 54 caliber. Yesterday was the first time out at the gun range. i think the barrel is from green Mountain ?

I too have a Kibler 54. Mine is a Rice Barrel (1 year old). I use 90 grains of Old Enysford 2F with a 0.020 patch (October country daisy patch with bumblin bear grease). For accuracy I want a tight ball/patch combination. But I am I the habit of a wetted patch after each shot. That takes just seconds. I also coned my muzzle.

I have been experimenting with GOOP WATERLESS HAND CLEANER. I shot 20
Consecutive shots with no wiping saturating my patches (0.020) with this. For general
Shooting it works great. It does not freeze in cold weather (I put the can in my freezer to test), but for hunting I used the bear grease stuff from OC.

IF I used wonderlube or natural lube patches, wiping is mandatory with a tight combination.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Lots of good advice. I'll emphasize, the use of commercial pre-lubed patches is asking for trouble. Find a good lube and do your own. Swabbing between shots is not a sin. Good idea, in fact. This game requires some dialing in by experimenting with loads, ball sizes, different patches, different lubes and how you hold your mouth when shooting. Stick with it.

 

[J. Paul]

I am very knew to this and had read that 60 to 80 grains was typical. Not sure how your 350gr bullet compares to a patched round ball . I assume this is a conical bullet. I am hoping my biggest problem is that my store bought lubed patches are too dry. I ordered unlubed patches to try again.

You can so add lube to those stores bought patches.
I use a beeswax/olive oil lube and make my own "borebutter" when I get one that loads excessively hard, I add a bit more lube to the patch.
My preferred patch is .016 washed pillow ticking from fabric store. I prelude a sheet about 6" x 18" then place edge past bore, ball on top, short starter so ball is flush in muzzle then cut off all excess with patch knife. It also works to cut a strip 1.5 to 2" wide the width of the fabric. This can fit in a 35mm film canister with snap on lid and be prelubed as well. I know at least one that rolls it up then pours olive oil on to the roll in the canister.
Point is, the prelubed patch shouldn't be dry feeling. I don't like the taste of patches in my mouth so I quit using spit patch. (My homemade lube also makes a decent leather treatment)

 

[SOLANCO]

50 to 80 gr of 2F, .015 spit patch and a .53 ball have been working well for me. Swab every couple or 3 shots.

 

[oldhunter1954]

I have shot a flint .54 for years. It's a Getz barrel with round bottom rifling. I did have the barrel coned. I shoot a .526 ball with a .012 spit patch. At 25 yards I use 55 grains of Goex 3F for any distance beyond 25 yards I shoot 75 grains. At 25 yards both charges hit in the same spot. With this load I can expect to get up to 20 shots off without having to clean depending on the humidity. IMHO your load is too tight and you are working too hard.

Thanks. In my green mountain barrel a .530 ball will fit without pushing. I assume it would roll down the barrel and roll back out. The smallest part of the barrel is approx 0.533. I assumed I needed to add a patch that would push into the grooves?

 

[45man]

Yes, Scotchbrite works but you still need a good lube. Young country lets me shoot over 200 shots with out wiping. When it starts to get a little hard I add more to the next patch. By the way I use a .535" ball and as thick as .022" denim in my H&H barrel.

 

[oldhunter1954]

Lots of good advice. I'll emphasize, the use of commercial pre-lubed patches is asking for trouble. Find a good lube and do your own. Swabbing between shots is not a sin. Good idea, in fact. This game requires some dialing in by experimenting with loads, ball sizes, different patches, different lubes and how you hold your mouth when shooting. Stick with it.

Good info. And I had a big Cigar in my mouth while shooting. Hope that's not the problem. lol

 

[Fly103]

I too am a new flintlock shooter, bought a pedersoli pennsylvania rifle 2 months ago. First time on the range, i dry pattched the barrel to remove any manufacturing oils, loaded a .490 ball/ .010 patch and fired. On the next reload i couldnt hardle get the ball down so i began swabbing between shots. This kept it going til shot number 8 where the ball stuck 5" from the muzzle while loading. Tried to pull it with a ball puller only to snap it off, ended up having to grease gun the ball out.

I noticed after getting it cleanbthat the barrel appeared to have patches of anticorrosive or some such in it that try as i might i couldnt scrub out. Now with about 50 shots through it, all the factory anticorrosive has been shot out leaving a bright shiny bore that loads easily shot after shot. I am currently running .480" balls with .020" patching on top of 65gr of 3f goex. Getting 2"-3" 5 shot groups offhand at 25 yards.

Chris

 

[simonbeans]

You can load all day with Hoppes #9 B/P solvent and patch lube, each patch cleans the bore for the next shot.

Some say it is not a good idea to leave a gun loaded for an extended period of time with this patch lube because you might get a rust ring.

I have been using the Hoppes #9 B/P since I shot my first muzzleloader in early 1970s. Never had to wipe bore as Eric says “all day”. From .36 to .75 last shot loads as easy as #1. I get nice groups with close to bore caliber loads (.58=58 grains, etc.) with fffg. I use the same cotton pillow ticking for all guns 0.017 and ball size 0.010 less than bore (.340 in 36, ,440 in .45, .610 in .62, etc). But then, your results may vary.

 

[harleynut]

Had same issue with my tc .54 what fixed my issue was deleteing the bore butter coated patches and mixing rubbing Alcohol and Ballistol togetjer let sit so Alcohol evaporates it leaves a light film behind works awesome !!

 

[brazosland]

Better lube first.
A slightly thinner patch second.
Try 3F third.

I find 3F gives a cleaner burn than 2F. I use it all the way up to my .62 bores, rifled and smooth.

 

[Mountain Mike]

I have a 54 caliber and need to swab the barrel between every shot. Most of the time it takes 2 cleaning patches. I am using 80 grains of GOEX 2F with .530 round ball and 0.018 lubed ticking patch. The time that I did not swap the barrel the ball got stuck about 5 inches in and I had to use a ball puller to get it out. One of the guys at the range yesterday told me that Swiss 2F does not foul the barrel at all ?

One of my other many hobbies is beekeeping. You ask ten beekeepers their opinion and you get ten different answers. At the end of the day you do what's best for your bees and your given situation. Same for shooting. Try different things and don't give up.

 

[Mountain Mike]

I have a 54 caliber and need to swab the barrel between every shot. Most of the time it takes 2 cleaning patches. I am using 80 grains of GOEX 2F with .530 round ball and 0.018 lubed ticking patch. The time that I did not swap the barrel the ball got stuck about 5 inches in and I had to use a ball puller to get it out. One of the guys at the range yesterday told me that Swiss 2F does not foul the barrel at all ?

One of my other many hobbies is beekeeping. You ask ten beekeepers their opinion and you get ten different answers. At the end of the day you do what's best for your bees and your given situation. Same for shooting. Try different things and don't give up.

 

[flntlokr]

I have a 54 caliber and need to swab the barrel between every shot. Most of the time it takes 2 cleaning patches. I am using 80 grains of GOEX 2F with .530 round ball and 0.018 lubed ticking patch. The time that I did not swap the barrel the ball got stuck about 5 inches in and I had to use a ball puller to get it out. One of the guys at the range yesterday told me that Swiss 2F does not foul the barrel at all ?

Lose the pre-lubes except perhaps for those rare occasions where your gun may remain loaded for days. I punch mine in stacks (fold up your fabric into about 20 layers, and bash the punch through) and loosely stack them in a pill bottle, Run a liberal amount of dish detergent down beside the stack, and fill the bottle with water. Squish the stack a few times to get air out, and fill with water again, so the patches get thoroughly soaked with soapy water (or watery soap) When it's time to shoot, remove a half inch or so of the stack, and squeeze as much waater out as you can with your fingers. Peel the patches off one at a time to load. Keep your ready patches in an old cap can or something handy. There should be enough moisture to swab your barrel with each load. If you find after a number of shots, that it is fouling a bit, wet the next couple of patches a bit more to cut the fouling out. You can swab the barrel with a wet cleaning patch after your ball is set also if you need to; the patched ball will prevent your powder from getting wet. Enjoy!

 

[gustrolland]

I have a 54 caliber and need to swab the barrel between every shot. Most of the time it takes 2 cleaning patches. I am using 80 grains of GOEX 2F with .530 round ball and 0.018 lubed ticking patch. The time that I did not swap the barrel the ball got stuck about 5 inches in and I had to use a ball puller to get it out. One of the guys at the range yesterday told me that Swiss 2F does not foul the barrel at all ?

Try using natural lubes, or moose milk. I've noticed that moose milk makes my patches act looser than with bore butter while using the same thickness of patch. And some times you just need to fire several dozen rounds to just help smooth out the barrel. Have a rifle totally built for scratch that took about 200 rounds to smooth out, and it shoots groups that if you didn't see me shoot you'd say I lied.

 

[jimairwin]

I have a 54 caliber and need to swab the barrel between every shot. Most of the time it takes 2 cleaning patches. I am using 80 grains of GOEX 2F with .530 round ball and 0.018 lubed ticking patch. The time that I did not swap the barrel the ball got stuck about 5 inches in and I had to use a ball puller to get it out. One of the guys at the range yesterday told me that Swiss 2F does not foul the barrel at all ?

What lube are you using? I use moose milk almost dripping. Should load down bore with modest effort to seat firmly on the powder. 2fG is proper/best to my mind and experience. 3fg will work fine, too, esp with the modest 80 gn charge.

I use 535 balls with 18 thou patch & shoot a match b4 cleaning. GR Douglas or Wm Large barrels. Import barrels can be tighter, tho'. I have done very well with this combo!

 

[appalichian hunter]

I shoot a mountain rifle .54 cal use a .530 ball,15 thousands patch, lube with my home made lube of bees wax, Crisco and a bit of olive oil over 80gr. goex 3f easy loading and swab about every 5th shot with a spit patch at the range, hunting deer the first shot is all that's needed but I load the second shot straight from the pouch just in case, never had a problem.very accurate load and has put the wammy on a few deer. As mentioned loose the bore butter to much hype and not enough performance

 

[starman]

I am not familiar with what “coning a muzzle” means. Can someone provide an explanation? Thanks!

 

[chessiehokie]

I am new to the hobby as well, so don't have much to offer... but considering your initial post, I have used both Goex 2F and Swiss 2F in my .50 cal. Pedersoli Blue Ridge. Shooting .490 Hornady roundballs with Cabela's pre-lubed .10 patches and experimenting with 50, 60, and 70 grain powder charges with the only variable being Goex 2F vs Swiss 2F, I am quite surprised with how chunky the Goex fouling is, particularly in comparison to the Swiss. With a new barrel I'm swabbing between every shot right now and the patch comes out with literally chunks of fouling resembling crushed charcoal when using Goex. The exact same load using Swiss results in nothing more than a dirty swabbing patch afterwards, with no chunks at all. It appears to me that the Goex isn't combusting completely, while the Swiss apparently is.