Blackpowder for Defense?

[floyd1350]

as i understand it and if i recall correctly an antique replica is not classed as a firearm UNTIL you commit a crime with one. then it is a firearm! mr liddy is not in a gray area as far as i'm concerned. if he is a felon he is in violation of the law by the possession of said weapon if it is true. just how i see it and i hope i'm not in violation of board rules by the response.

 

[GBG]

If you're considering a cap and ball revolver(s) for home defense, may I suggest purchasing a lot of spare cylinders to keep loaded. Then practice (with empties) changing them out in total darkness until the process is comitted to muscle memory. JMO.

 

[tom deinek]

I also have found myslef at my deer camp in northern Michigan's lower peninsula without a modern handgun. I didn't care.

"He who would speak convincingly of peace does not go about armed" -- Kwai Chiang Caine as 'Kung Fu'

 

[Matt85]

ive kept a loaded pietta 1858 as a home defence gun. ive never had it fail to fire even after being loaded for months at a time. the onley change i do from a normal load make sure it will fire is i use unlubed wool wads with lube over the top of the balls. this means the onley thing touching the powder is the ball.

i should mention before loading for long term i also clean out each chamber with alchohol and wipe dry to assure no oils or contaminates could hurt the powder charge.

-matt

 

[Stumpkiller]

A black powder arm would beat a sharp stick and probably even a bow. But for home defense there would be many options I would enlist before I chose any of my blackpowder arms. Even my non-muzzleloading percussion revolver.

Too much smoke for indoors and too little stopping power vs. a modern pistol.

But a Colt Navy .36 beats foul language for killing an intruder. No question.

 

[M. De Land]

I can't imagine changing a ROA cylinder in the dark.
A 58 Rem would not be a problem.
I couldn't get the wedge out of an open frame gun without a tool.
I'll stick to my other means!
Here in Alaska we have open carry so most conservative minded folks are heeled when not in a federal building.
The trouble with the big bore wheel gun conicals for bears is over penetration on humans and this would be a plus with round ball use not as prone to.
In a mad bear encounter I guess they would be better than a spear/sharp stick but not by much I think. MD

 

[J.D.]

The first rule of gunfighting is always have a gun.

The second rule of gunfighting is, he who has the most rounds usually wins.

I kept an original 1860 army Colt for home defense, back in the day, when that was all I had. I graduated to a modern revolver in the 70's. A 1911 in the 80s and 90s. I now carry a high cap semi auto for serious use.

Remember a 36 cal percussion revolver is roughly equivalent to the old underpowered 38 S&W. the Army 44 is roughly equivalent to a low powered 44 special and I wouldn't trust either one of those rounds to save my life or the lives of my wife, children, and grand children.

IMHO, the slow operation of a single action revolver can't compete with a punk armed with anything modern. Nor can one change cylinders in the dark, under intense pressure of a lethal force situation as quickly as a punk can swap a modern mag in a modern bottom feeder.

Not to mention that replacement cylinders need to be timed to the action of the pawl and cylinder lock to work properly to align each chamber with the barrel.

The real question is one of parity? Equality of weapons of offense and personal defense, if you will? IMHO, a single action percussion revolver just can't stack up to even a double action revolver, antique or otherwise. Nor can a BP revolver stack up to anything more modern where speed, accuracy, ease of use, and reliability are paramount to saving ones life, not to mention the lives of loved ones.

Then there is the question of multiple attackers?
Can you keep BP revolvers operating well enough to fend off two, three, or more attackers in a dark home, under intense pressure?

Zonie, I apologize for mentioning modern alternatives for self protection. However this topic cannot be discussed without mention of modern alternatives.

God bless
J.D.

 

[swathdiver]

How many rounds are fired by each side during an encounter with a would be robber?

I would gather that in most cases only a round or two are fired before one side becomes incapacitated.

Therefore, a 5-shot revolver should be sufficient, the manufacturers have been making them for over 150 years now.

As to the modern day comparisons, I wouldn't want to get shot by any caliber! Those comparables have put plenty of bad guys in boot hill.

 

[swathdiver]

If you're considering a cap and ball revolver(s) for home defense, may I suggest purchasing a lot of spare cylinders to keep loaded. Then practice (with empties) changing them out in total darkness until the process is comitted to muscle memory. JMO.

Just how many rounds does it take to hit and incapacitate a would be robber?

One or two in the boiler room and within seconds all the steam has run out. I figure it'd be quicker to grab another gun than to switch out a cylinder.

 

[Matt85]

if the 6 shots i got in a revolver aint enough then im probably done for regardless.

-matt

 

[GBG]

Just how many rounds does it take...

Guess that depends on the number of bad guys .

 

[cynthialee]

if the 6 shots i got in a revolver aint enough then im probably done for regardless.

-matt

My sentiments exactly.


To be honest folks....I would rather face off with my revolver against a punk with a glock than any one of the members here with a single shot BP pistol.
Punks are known to indescriminatly spray bullets. Everyone on this forum knows the importance of shot placement and patience.

 

[poordevil]

Many years ago in Santee CA , a suburb of San Diego the police raided the wrong house and the owner of said house, hearing the commotion, grabbed a replica Walker .44. He was shot and paralyzed.

 

[nkbj]

About '76 or '77 I responded to a burglary with a Navy Arms 1861 loaded with conicals molded with a Lee 9mm round nose mold hogged out with a 3/8" drill bit. Being very acquainted with it I didn't feel one bit under gunned. And the looks on the HPD officers faces were priceless.

 

[Claude Mathis]

if the 6 shots i got in a revolver aint enough then im probably done for regardless.

Maybe not. I've seen video of two guys emptying their pistols at each other, as close as 15 feet, and nobody got hit.

If everyone was as good a shot as they think they are, they'd only need one bullet per bad guy. :wink:

 

[cynthialee]

I've seen Matt shoot. 6 bullets is probably plenty.

 

[mingo]

Been shooting BP revolvers 50 years.
Spent most of 18 months on the Cambodian border with civilian irregulars.
Been in a shootout or two.

The idea of staking my life or my families lives on my beloved smokewagons is beyond comprehension.

Surviving is not a game or a dumb quotation.
Dead is real ugly and often painful.

A human can take a lot of punishment and still kill you. If you actually find yourself in a life or death situation the only option is put him down hard and fast. Get real.

 

A black powder arm would beat a sharp stick and probably even a bow. But for home defense there would be many options I would enlist before I chose any of my blackpowder arms. Even my non-muzzleloading percussion revolver.

Too much smoke for indoors and too little stopping power vs. a modern pistol.

But a Colt Navy .36 beats foul language for killing an intruder. No question.

Actually Stumpy, if you have a house full of kin folk or visiting friends, one is better off with less penetration. Don't want it passing through drywall and putting holes in friends and/or family.

I wonder what would happen if I cut loose with a .69 caliber or better handgonne. Smoke, for sure. But they'd probably keel over with a heart attack, or at least leave a slimy brown trail for the law to track them.

 

[Claude Mathis]

Just a somewhat tongue in cheek comment about self defense”¦

Would it be wise for a pro football team to play without shoes?
How about a major league baseball team not using gloves?
Entering a motorcycle race riding a bicycle?
And, the old standby - Bringing a knife to a gunfight?

I want to be better equipped than my opponent - especially if lives depend open it. I encourage everyone to use whatever modern, state-of-the-art, technology they have at their disposal. We aren't in the movies and there aren't any "do overs".

 

The first rule of gunfighting is always have a gun.

The second rule of gunfighting is, he who has the most rounds usually wins.

First rule of street fighting, never bring a knife to a gunfight.

Second rule of street fighting, the best shot under pressure wins. Spray all the rounds you like, but when a gun is dry, you are dead.

I kept an original 1860 army Colt for home defense, back in the day, when that was all I had. I graduated to a modern revolver in the 70's. A 1911 in the 80s and 90s. I now carry a high cap semi auto for serious use.

Remember a 36 cal percussion revolver is roughly equivalent to the old underpowered 38 S&W. the Army 44 is roughly equivalent to a low powered 44 special and I wouldn't trust either one of those rounds to save my life or the lives of my wife, children, and grand children.

The more rounds you throw around, the more likely someone is catching "Friendly Fire."

IMHO, the slow operation of a single action revolver can't compete with a punk armed with anything modern. Nor can one change cylinders in the dark, under intense pressure of a lethal force situation as quickly as a punk can swap a modern mag in a modern bottom feeder.

A punk, hyped up on drugs and/or adrenaline, is a lousy shot. Personally, I would hold my fire till that punk has to swap mags.

Not to mention that replacement cylinders need to be timed to the action of the pawl and cylinder lock to work properly to align each chamber with the barrel.

Personally, I don't believe in swapping cylinders

The real question is one of parity? Equality of weapons of offense and personal defense, if you will? IMHO, a single action percussion revolver just can't stack up to even a double action revolver, antique or otherwise. Nor can a BP revolver stack up to anything more modern where speed, accuracy, ease of use, and reliability are paramount to saving ones life, not to mention the lives of loved ones.

And with a spray and pray attitude, the more likely one's loved ones will fall victim to "Friendly Fire."

Then there is the question of multiple attackers?
Can you keep BP revolvers operating well enough to fend off two, three, or more attackers in a dark home, under intense pressure?

Of the thousands of reports that I have read, concerning home invasions, when one invader is hit, the group as a whole retreat. This isn't the wild west.

Zonie, I apologize for mentioning modern alternatives for self protection. However this topic cannot be discussed without mention of modern alternatives.

And I, respectfully, disagree