Blowing down the barrel?

[Voyageur]

So what was the final decision on this Runner? Was the discharge of the cannon from hot embers or was it due to ramming too hard on the class A explosive?

 

[Mike Brooks]

So what was the final decision on this Runner? Was the discharge of the cannon from hot embers or was it due to ramming too hard on the class A explosive?

I've never been able to discharge my muzzleloaders no matter how hard I rammed the class A explosive. Didn't the Bevel Bros. debunk the "ramming theory" a couple years ago?
Anybody ever notice how those two boobs on "MYTH BUSTERS" on the Discovery channel ripped off the Bevel Bros.? Heck, they even ripped off the Bevel Bros. "Look". The red headed myth buster looks just like Bevel down. I told them they should prosecute....heck, one of them is even a lawyer... :hmm:

 

personally, I blow down the barrel after every shot. Do I understand the concerns voiced by those who don't? yes. However, my concern about it is that it is the same logic applied by the anti-gun people to try to have our rights to own firearms revoked. That being, to remove ALL chances of an injury due to percieved missuse or accident, the obvious answer is to ban the practice all together regardless of how remote the possibilities are. I'm sure many that think blowing should be banned are thinking "there's a BIG difference between swabbing rather than blowing and having our guns confiscated", however, to the person that thinks guns are inherantly dangerous and would never own one, banning guns and replacing them with golf clubs should be no big deal. I've been involved in ml-ing for about 25 years. I've been following ml related i-net forums for about 5 years. I've listened to more ml enthusiasts than I could possibly count over the years and I've yet to hear of a single documented case of blowing causing injury or death. Does this mean it can't happen?, no. What it does mean, to me, is that the likelyhood is so remote that, while we obviously need to be aware of it, we can't let paranoia rule our lives. People slip and fall and are killed in the shower every year but we don't go around stinkin' because it's the safer alternative, or at least i don't. I have no problem with someone choosing not to blow for safety reasons just like i have no problem with people chooseing not to own guns for safety reasons. I also don't have a problem with people giving their views on why they choose what they do. Especially when they are asked. Provided the views are presented as information on what and why someone does something rather than what and why someone ELSE should do something, if you know what I mean. For a topic with such deep personal feelings on both sides, i'm impressed at how civil it has been. I, for one, and I'm sure most/all others appreciate it.


Cody

 

[Voyageur]

I appreciate the info Mike... I hadn't heard about not being able to detonate Class A by ramming or impact. Another attempt at trying to limit possession I reckon.

I sort grew up with grade B movies and they had no trouble at all throwing substances and getting them to explode. Oddly enough I never went to a theatre to see a grade B movie, they just threw it in with the cartoon and previews along with the main feature. I suppose that is a major source for the 'myths' that get started... and perpetuated.

What seems to get your attention with blackpowder is the way it acts compared to smokeless. At one of the rendezvous back in the 70s, Dick Kopp donated a 5 lb tin of blackpowder to break up the the 'dam' we had contructed on Indian Creek for a swimming hole. It was impressive and I know smokeless wouldn't have produced the same result. A fella gets to thinking that maybe it's more sensitive than it really is... if you know what I mean.

 

[Voyageur]

I'm hearing ya Cody. Sounds like pretty good reasoning to me.

One of the most common traits we all share is the instinctive looking down the barrel of just about every firearm we own. Looking to see if it's clean, looking to see if it's 'bleeding' or, in some cases, looking to see about leading if Minnies are being used. And it just seems to me that looking down the barrel is getting your head in front of the bore the same as trying to breathe moisture into the fouling.

At the range I have a bottle of blackpowder bore solvent that I use but when I'm hunting ground squirrels I simply cannot be encumbered with the solvent. I have a neat little Poor Boy .32 that I use and small bores seem to be less forgiving than the larger bores.

 

flinch, Cooner54, TexiKan, tg, Cody, et. al...

Thanks guys, I'm simply trying to nail down the source. I am quite taken aback at how extreme the reactions are when this topic is asked to justify itself.

I've read of the numerous accidents when folks try to pull their loaded firearms out of wherever they've stored them. I've seen it stated that this was the most common form of firearms accident when pioneers were crossing the plains.

I have a recorded a journal entry of one fella doing this on a trade expedition around 1810 and, believe it or not, two years ago a fella did it locally with a highpower rifle.

Like I said before... I've been next to fellas twice when they discharged flintlocks which were loaded but had no priming in the pan.

I think it was in old Buckskin Report where I read a confession of one gent who set off a powder horn while loading his firearm. I've never had it happen myself although, like you all, I use a powder measure.

The unique thing about this particular thread is that so many are made to think that it is a totally unsafe procedure which many of us have practiced for years (in my case 40). I'm just as willing as the next to admit I was wrong and that I need to change... if someone will demonstrate that this is a problem that has plagued the ML users.

In the many historical journals I've read in the course of historical research, I just don't recall anyone bringing up this issue. The practice cannot be a recent practice since they've had breathing tubes for Scheutzen matches since before the turn of the century. The practice of using a tube appears to have been due to the long delay between shots when 50 & 100 shot strings took most of the day. When the delay was long enough, they seemed to have used a special 'brush' which included rubber washers to push the fouling out.

So the concept of keeping the fouling soft was not unknown but I can find no reference as to when EXACTLY the concept of 'hardened fouling' affecting the loading process was first addressed.

I think the first time I really noticed it was in using 'spit patches' in a shoot. Maybe the chemical makeup of saliva just hardens fouling faster when the chemical change takes place at the time of ignition. I sure wouldn't mind seeing the results of someone doing a professional study on it.

Good post. I was drawn especially to the comment about the horn blowing up when poured directly down the muzzle. Why do we use powder measures? Because their may be an ember in the barrel from the previous shot. If we dump a load and ram a ball down on top of that charge without blowing down the bore first, we run the real risk of losing fingers or a hand. The same fellows who argue against blowing down the bore before reloading would not recommend loading from a full horn, I assume. I see no difference. There is a chance of an ember in there or there is not, you can't have it both ways. :hmm:
Don

 

[Voyageur]

You know... come to think on it... I seem to recall a lot of writing years ago about covering the ball with powder in your hand to determine 'correct load'. I wonder did hunters ever just use the hand instead of a measure?

I used to have a number of books on hunting in Africa. (Traded them off to Gerald Pettinger for a handgun.) I recall that one of the fellas (Pondero or J.A. Hunter maybe) used an old muzzleloader and carried a leather pouch full of 'trade powder'. I don't recall him ever saying that he used a powder measure.

Personally, I use very small hunting horns as I figure they isn't any deer, except the occassional village idiot, going to hang around for a 'shot string'. A dozen loads is all I prefer to carry. I do use a horn measure and feel pretty good about what might happen if that powder measure load should cook off from an ember. It's never happened to me but then again I blow down the barrel.

 

[Stumpkiller]

Because their may be an ember in the barrel from the previous shot. If we dump a load and ram a ball down on top of that charge without blowing down the bore first, we run the real risk of losing fingers or a hand.

I've sent out feelers for the names and dates on injuries and fatalities, let you know if any arrive. I can't name anyone who ever drowned in the ocean so I guess that might be a mythical occurance, too. :haha: Well, OK, Nataie Wood. But she might have been pushed. :hmm:

About the burning ember thought. I blow on an ember to get it to burn hotter when striking a light. Air is required for combustion. You're removing the carbon monoxide of the burnt powder smoke lingering in the barrel and intoducing fresh air for combustion by blowing in. Then you're pouring powder on top of a fresh, hot ember. :winking:

I use turkey bone powder measures. If I get a back-flash I'll singe my piddies for sure, but the shrapnel will be minimal from a thin, wood-plugged bone measure. More likely it will rocket away in the blast and not fragment. I always tip the muzzle away from my face when pouring.

I've also wondered how much air you can move out of a 1/16" hole at the breech of a barrel by puffing away at the muzzle, anyway. Seems dizzying to get much through that little hole.

Hey, if it works for you keep at it. I used to drive happily on retred tires and never had a problem until I had one give out.

I'm with Mkie B. on this one. It works for almost every one who does, as does pouring into a non-blown barrel. It just looks like unsafe and needlessly risky gun handling to other shooters.

 

[Maestro]

I tried blowing down my barrel when starting out with my flintlock 'cause I read that's what some folks do... and it just didn't "feel" right - pointing the muzzle of a gun in my mouth. Hey - call me a sissy but it just doesn't sit right for me to violate the first rule of gun safety. I've got youngun's and I'd rather they didn't see that & think it's okay to do. Put me down for a vote on the "swab between shots" side of the aisle.
Just my 2 pence (FWIW) & as always, YMMV! :hatsoff:

 

Stumpkiller, what happens when you blow on a little tiny ember until it quits smoking? That, to me, means it has burned itself out. I do appreciate the logic though.
Maestro, got your vote tallied on the otherside. :grin:
Don

 

[Voyageur]

I can't name anyone who ever drowned in the ocean so I guess that might be a mythical occurance, too. :haha: Well, OK, Nataie Wood. But she might have been pushed. :hmm:

C'mon Stumpkiller... no fair feeding me straight lines. You know Claude isn't going to think too much of me if I 'copy' and 'paste' the names of everyone off the Titanic. :haha:

As a matter of fact the only ones off that little boat that come to mind are Leonardo DiCaprio and Clifton Webb.

You know, an interesting fact that came up the other night when I was watching one of the endless documentaries about WW II, was that the program claimed that the merchant marine had more casulties than the U.S. Navy during that war.

 

Hi, my name is Bill, and it's been 5 days since I've blown down the barrel of a smoke pole. :rotf: Bill of Smoke Blowers Anonymous

The Titanic never sank. It was a conspiracy, and the underwater pics are fakes, as were the ones of the astronauts on the Moon, all fakes, all conspiracy by one or more of the alphabet organizations of the government. :blah:

 

[Huntinfool]

Well I have to agree with Roundball and others who don't blow. It's hard for me to tell dozens of youngsters and/or newcomers to the sport never to point any gun at anything you don't want to destroy. And also to treat all guns as if they are loaded and then point a 50 cal. at my brain!

So I never blow down the barrel and I always wipe between shots at least once. I've never had any problems! :grin:

Chuck

 

[Zonie]

To the readers of this post:

I for one, don't care who blew their head off by blowing down the barrel.
If it really did happen, I guess the answer is "The dead guy."
That said, I will post my usual responce to the question.

If folks want to blow down their own barrel while they are out in the woods or in their own back yard that's fine with me.

When they are at a public shooting range, or anywhere else where there is a possibility of children being present I must side with the "DON'T BLOW DOWN YOUR BARREL" crowd.

In my many years of shooting I have noticed that kids have a fascination with muzzleloading guns. I don't know if it is just because muzzleloaders are different, or because of all of the steps we go thru to load and shoot them.
Kids do watch every move!

When they see someone sticking a gun barrel into their mouths it becomes obvious to the kids that this is an accepted thing to do.

Now, this is of course just a hypothesis, but it doesn't take much imagination to see a kid who has seen this activity showing his friend several days later just how this process is done. A potential problem with this is there is a possibility that they are using your loaded 9mm pistol or your loaded home defence shotgun for the demonstration.
Assuming you do not keep your defence weapon loaded, then I will point out that your kids friends parents may not be as safety conscious as you.

 

[Pork Chop]

Zonie,

That is the best, most pragmatic solution to this quandry. I wholeheartedly agree! :thumbsup:

 

[Slamfire]

Considerin' my handle, I think I'll stick to a blow tube. :hmm:

 

[coehornboy]

:hmm: mebbe this will settle a few bets..I have a civil war letter, written by one of my ancestors, Rufus Kent (44th Regiment, Ohio Volunteer Infantry, Co. G). The letter is dated August 13, 1862, and written at Meadow Bluffs, VA. Here is a link to a scan of the original letter:

Link

Here is a cropped scan of the text:

The text reads: "There was a man met with a fatal accident yesterday evening. He was Handling a Belgian Rifle and and went to examine it to Se if it was loaded and Set his foot on the Cock of the gun and Blowed in the muzzle and his foot slipped of the cock and discharged the Gun and killed him instantly. He was one of our pilots and a Respectable Citizen."

:v

 

[hobbles]

So what was the final decision on this Runner? Was the discharge of the cannon from hot embers or was it due to ramming too hard on the class A explosive?

Mornin Voyageur
I seen that on the tube bout 5 or 6 times after it happened, It was a 15 or 16 y/o that didn't swab the barrel of the cannon, They were doin a reenactment, It blew him away's from the cannon, It did not look good, I >think< he went into a coma, I didn't know he lived, I thought he died, But I remember seain it on tv,,

 

I would not recommend pushing the hammer back with your foot while blowing down a primed barrel either. :youcrazy:

 

[sniper68]

:hmm: Anything 100% safe can be made A 100% dangerous, iffin ya do do somthin stupid!! :nono: Like wallkin in front of a moving car instead of a parked one, makin sure the gernade works before ya throw it, etc, ect... :nono: :shake: