Burned by USPS

[Columbus]

Back in October I responded to an ad on this site and worked out a straight across trade deal. His 1861 Navy for my 1862 Pocket Police. He sent his gun USPS priority, paid the fee for insurance and I did the same. My gun got to him without issue. The gun he sent me got all the way here, got scanned out for delivery and disappeared. I had to wait 15 days to file a lost item claim, then I waited 60 days for a response and they told me I had to have an FFL to ship a firearm and they wanted to see my receipt. I replied with quotes from their own regulation telling them it was a black powder muzzle loader and sent them page cuts from three different companies showing what the gun was worth. Here's what they sent me today. Denied - now they say it's a C&R relic and I have to have a license for that and my ads weren't good enough, I have to show that I paid someone, something for it. What is wrong with these people. Even when you show them their own regulation they ignore it and come up with something else. I have a vintage WWII watch that is worth about $1k and was just in the process of packing it up to send it to a jeweler for cleaning and adjustment, what if it gets lost, how can I prove it's worth when it's something my father had in his pocket coming back from war? You can't call anyone, everything done on by mail or online. I have one more appeal but this was a straight across trade and even if I can convince them to actually read the regulations on muzzle loaders I've nothing to show that I paid for it. Their feigned (or deliberate) ignorance pisses me off. Wonder if I can file a small claims case against my local postmaster - it got scanned out of his building, put in the mail carriers vehicle and somehow between there and my house went missing. I'm out $300.

 

[leadhoarder]

Are they implying that the only packages that they will reimburse are packages that are being sent from a seller to a buyer? Plenty of people ship packages everyday that are not part of a transaction for money.

 

[FishDFly]

Contact your local Congressman's Office and send him/her what you have here and get him involved.

I had problems with a mail carrier and the local Postmaster would not address the issue. My Congressman got involved, the issue was resolved and I received an apology from the Regional USPS Director. I had a a new mail carrier and we had a new Post Master.

 

[Greg Blackburn]

Try speaking with the postmaster and if needed, try your state's attorney general.

When people without much IQ get into positions of power, this is the usual result.

 

[Columbus]

Well, after spending time researching this I find I was wrong, they are right. I've always been under the impression that the ATF regs applied. That's an error on my part. While they allow us to send bp handguns to each other individual carrier requirements differ and USPS is one of them. You can pack them up and they will never know the difference but if it gets lost you won't get a dime. You must have an FFL or a C&R license to ship through USPS, dealer to dealer only.

Zonie, if you see this it might be information that would be of benefit to members. There's a thread a few months ago where people were vehement about the legality of shipping USPS. They are wrong.

 

[appalichian hunter]

Get A RECIEPT from the other fellow as to cost, file a claim and get a lawyer involved, expensive yes but things need to be done to prove a point, I have received BP weapons through the USPS as well as major parts for unmentionable weapons never had a problem. Strang how it made it to the final carrier destination then all of a sudden disappeared.The post office lost the gun at its final destination sounds to me like someone figured out what was in the box and stole it. It is only going to get worse as time goes on with the current regime in power.

 

[mushka]

Yes, but I'd still like to know where the revolver is. Are they holding it? Did they steal it? I wouldn't be surprised if they stole it. Go to the congressman & senator. Cause them trouble for their un-attentiveness.

 

[FishDFly]

They are Federal employees and should be held accountable.

 

[Columbus]

Held accountable yes, we had a worthless substitute carrier that day, the whole time consuming rigmarole is ridiculous but the end decision is one I can't beat. USPS regulations say we cannot ship muzzleloading handguns unless we are licensed. I filed a claim on a damaged flintlock pistol a few years ago and received prompt payment. Don't know when they changed policy but it's definitely on the books and I found out the expensive way. I might be able to address this as a small claims issue but they'd still fall back on it being an illegal shipment. So, if you have a pistol to send, better use another carrier than USPS.

 

[FishDFly]

For me that would have to be Fedex.

 

[user 34300]

I recently had the FedEx delivery guy put a small package with valuable merchandise on top of my rural security mailbox. The post box is only 15 yards to my front door. All other package delivery guy put it in a designated spot next to my front door. IF I had not been watching for him the package would have been stolen. I filed a complaint and to their credit they did call me to follow up.

It is a good idea to require a delivery signature and tracking.

 

[Flint.]

My niece and her husband lived in a small town in Arizona. Their fedex packages are actually sent to the local post office. They were expecting a valuable package and she went to pick it up we she received the email that it had been delivered. The folks at the post office told her it had not been received.

She was on the phone with sheriff Joe when they “found” it UNDER one of the P.O. employees desk!

 

[Notchy Bob]

Well, after spending time researching this I find I was wrong, they are right. I've always been under the impression that the ATF regs applied. That's an error on my part. While they allow us to send bp handguns to each other individual carrier requirements differ and USPS is one of them. You can pack them up and they will never know the difference but if it gets lost you won't get a dime. You must have an FFL or a C&R license to ship through USPS, dealer to dealer only.

Zonie, if you see this it might be information that would be of benefit to members. There's a thread a few months ago where people were vehement about the legality of shipping USPS. They are wrong.

Columbus,

Thank you for sharing all of this. I did not know that exception regarding USPS. It is very frustrating when you think you are doing everything right and you get screwed in the end, but you have used the opportunity to educate the rest of us.

One other thought is that you might want to contact your local pawnshops, if you know the serial number or other details that might aid in identification. When Mr. Substitute Carrier realizes he pilfered a cap & ball revolver instead of a .357, he might try to sell it.

The local UPS administration, in the area where I live, will not ship firearms or ammunition of any kind. Even muzzleloaders, or empty brass. Seriously. They will deliver to you, if the shipment comes from elsewhere, but they won't accept any type of firearm or ammo for shipping from their facility. I confronted them once, with UPS rules from the website, but was informed this was a policy prescribed by the local manager, and they weren't going to budge.

I haven't tried shipping a blackpowder gun by USPS, and probably won't, now. FedEx broke one longrifle I shipped a couple of years ago. Packaging was adequate, but not gorilla-proof. The gun was insured, but filing a claim was laborious and they low-balled me on reimbursement, but at least I got something.

The only thing I can really add to this discussion is to suggest that if anyone ships a gun, take some pictures of it before you pack it up. The photos I had of my longrifle made the difference between getting something and getting nothing.

Anyway, I am very sorry Columbus suffered this loss, but I appreciate his telling the story. It may prevent a similar problem in the future.

Notchy Bob

 

[nkbj]

I had a .31 revolver show up at the house with a strutting postal inspector and two county mounties.
Someone had opened a corner of the box to show the end of the barrel.
So use your imagination on how it was known which corner to open.

Yes, the imagery would have undoubtedly shown it to be a percussion revolver.
We held a group opening of the offending package and the postal inspector said okie fine and they all left, leaving me to scratch my head.

 

[FishDFly]

This should become a "sticky' for all to know and be aware of.

 

[jonathan butcher]

I think it’s safe to say that most if not all of us have used USPS to ship our ML guns at one time or another. If things go well it’s a relatively inexpensive and reliable way to ship a ML. But as Columbus has pointed out if things don’t go well USPS wont be behind you. Whatever one thinks of the other carriers, USPS should be on our DO NOT SHIP list from here forward. It will be for me.

 

[Brokennock]

but the end decision is one I can't beat

I respectfully disagree.
Get your state attorney general involved. Make them prove where the gun is. If they are being honest about things, the gun should stored somewhere controlled.
But, it sounds more like the final carrier stole it and they are covering up the fact that their employee is a thief.
If the package was insured and didn't reach you, they owe you the insured amount,,, within reason.

 

[rdane]

My local post office will not ship ANY guns period. I use UPS. I’m in Lancaster, Ohio. The UPS store will not ship them either. I go to the UPS hub.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Held accountable yes, we had a worthless substitute carrier that day, the whole time consuming rigmarole is ridiculous but the end decision is one I can't beat. USPS regulations say we cannot ship muzzleloading handguns unless we are licensed. I filed a claim on a damaged flintlock pistol a few years ago and received prompt payment. Don't know when they changed policy but it's definitely on the books and I found out the expensive way. I might be able to address this as a small claims issue but they'd still fall back on it being an illegal shipment. So, if you have a pistol to send, better use another carrier than USPS.

OK, your property is missing, right?
It was likely stolen, right?
You dealt with consumer complaints, and part of their job is to mitigate what the USPS pays out in liability claims, OK?

So what you still need to do is to contact the office of The United States Postal Inspection Service.

Report the theft. It's likely a Federal Felony, if the worth of the object is high enough. Let the Postal Inspectors crawl around the local post office and question letter carriers for you. That may get you some sort of result, other than their blanket "go take a hike" response. If you can't get the item back (and you might), and you can't get reimbursed (after the postal inspectors finish..., make another claim), you still might get somebody fired for it. Again the people that so far been speaking with you, have a job to reduce or deny results, while the USPIS have a job to lock people up..., very different objectives.

LD

 

[Rifleman1776]

people without much IQ get into positions of power

You have defined 'bureaucrat'.