Butt plate gaps

[Codger Craig Wilcox]

First time I put on a buttplate, it was so ugly I re-did it, shortening the trigger pull by 1/2". On the second gun, it went so quick and easy (remember taking off 0.0005" or less at a time) that I danced a little jig around the shop. And for a guy with terrible spine and leg problems, that's saying something!

 

[Eric Krewson]

if worst comes to worst as it did on my first gun, I cut shims with the same grain orientation and pound them in the gap with a little superglue, they don't show on a finished rifle.

Filed off;

I was several guns in before I realized you didn't have to match the whole interior of the buttplate to the wood, DUH!

This one, matching the entire buttplate to the wood took me so long if I stated it it would sound like a lie.

 

[Vaino]

Bplates require patience to achieve an all around fit. When first starting, I use a coarse samd paper wheel on the Dremel and finish w/ a finer grit for finishing. The entire fitting is nearly done w/ a Dremel...except the radius at the junction of the shoe and tang... where a file is used. The wood in the center has to be removed periodically and I do this w/ a cutter in a Dremel. Many are afraid of using a Dremel because a slip could gouge the work....I was a tool and diemaker for many years and often used a hand grinder....sometimes that was the only alternative. Spindle rotation has to be obsrved....climbing cuts will surely grab.

Some use a filler to achieve a fit....I've never done that. Also, leaving too much wood is time consuming and tries one's patience....the saw cuts should be laid out accurately and the saw cut should follow the line......Fred

 

[frankie]

Nope. No filler. Only inletting black, a sharp scraper and a rawhide mallet. It ain't done.... till its done.

View attachment 122405 View attachment 122406

yes to what tomahwk said

 

[frankie]

Was doing my butt plate tonight and for the most part came out ok. I do have a couple of small gaps one on each side. My "OCD" kicked in and basically wanted to see if someone had tried/can recommend a filler. Thanks Cajun.

ok here goes, I hope this helps. Use Jarrows inletting black (you can get on Treebone carving and maybe track of the wolf on the internet, or prussian blue (oil Based) artist paint in the tube. I use a toothbrush to apply it on the metal, USE IT SPARINGLY VERY SPARINGLY!! I put small bolts through the Butt plate screw holes bolted down for handles on handling the Butt plate as seen in the picture. I will brush the inletting black on the metal and use the handles (small bolts) and push it on the wood, pull the BP off and look at the marks that are left. I take the dremmel and remove the blackened part of wood. Then repeat and repeat and repeat. When your done you can take acetone to remove the final black marks. When you are almost done you can use scrapers to do the final touch to get the perfect touch thats another topic. If you use a small rubber mallet to strike the butt plate on to the wood, be careful and only strike the bp lightly, just one time per a try at each fit. Don't double strike because that will give you false impressions.
Im a member of the Gunmakers guild and have been stocking since 1994. The only reason I said this is maybe to give some validity to my post. Inletting a steel butt plate sometimes takes me 3 to 6 or 7 hours. They can be very time consuming. But very rewarding. It just takes time and patience.

 

[cajun]

ok here goes, I hope this helps. Use Jarrows inletting black (you can get on Treebone carving and maybe track of the wolf on the internet, or prussian blue (oil Based) artist paint in the tube. I use a toothbrush to apply it on the metal, USE IT SPARINGLY VERY SPARINGLY!! I put small bolts through the Butt plate screw holes bolted down for handles on handling the Butt plate as seen in the picture. I will brush the inletting black on the metal and use the handles (small bolts) and push it on the wood, pull the BP off and look at the marks that are left. I take the dremmel and remove the blackened part of wood. Then repeat and repeat and repeat. When your done you can take acetone to remove the final black marks. When you are almost done you can use scrapers to do the final touch to get the perfect touch thats another topic. If you use a small rubber mallet to strike the butt plate on to the wood, be careful and only strike the bp lightly, just one time per a try at each fit. Don't double strike because that will give you false impressions.
Im a member of the Gunmakers guild and have been stocking since 1994. The only reason I said this is maybe to give some validity to my post. Inletting a steel butt plate sometimes takes me 3 to 6 or 7 hours. They can be very time consuming. But very rewarding. It just takes time and patience.View attachment 122831View attachment 122832

Thanks, Frankie, for your time and help. If it comes out ok, I will post a picture. Again thanks!!!!!

if worst comes to worst as it did on my first gun, I cut shims with the same grain orientation and pound them in the gap with a little superglue, they don't show on a finished rifle.

View attachment 122792

Filed off;

View attachment 122793

I was several guns in before I realized you didn't have to match the whole interior of the buttplate to the wood, DUH!

This one, matching the entire buttplate to the wood took me so long if I stated it it would sound like a lie.

View attachment 122796

if worst comes to worst as it did on my first gun, I cut shims with the same grain orientation and pound them in the gap with a little superglue, they don't show on a finished rifle.

View attachment 122792

Filed off;

View attachment 122793

I was several guns in before I realized you didn't have to match the whole interior of the buttplate to the wood, DUH!

This one, matching the entire buttplate to the wood took me so long if I stated it it would sound like a lie.

View attachment 122796

Thank Eric!!!!! I will post a picture when I finish my stock. This is my 2nd build, my first was back in 1984 a "Sears and Roebuck Hawkens rifle". It has gaps everywhere but is dead on at 70 yards. Again, thanks for your help.

 

[cajun]

For this I would do the following, Peen the edges of the butt plate where the metal meets the wood until it expands enough for a tighter fit. Then when finishing the gun, keep the butt plate on the stock and use a good sealing oil that will work up a slurry with 150 -180 grit. I use Watco Danish Oil to seal wood, its a thin enough oil to really penetrate maple, cherry or walnut. Its important to let the sanded slurry sit on the wood for a little while (1 hour) before wiping away. This takes care of any gaps I’ve had on butt plates, thimbles and trigger guards and nosecaps. By the time you’re ready to varnish the gun You’ll have minimal noticeable gaps.

The only draw back is you have to treat many of these parts as permanent parts to not be removed. James Turpin works this way with this rifles.

This works well for modest gaps less than 1mm.

Other things you can do, I’d avoid a fill but if you do, go for a very dark stain and matte finish with pure tung oil.

Gap filler I use is called Starbond, and when it dries it blends into a varnish.

A friend of mine is an avid welder and will do small welding spots on parts that have large gaps, then rework the part and stock to fit right. I don’t do this personally because I think it takes away straight edges on the steel parts.

Thanks Flinternick!!!

 

[Coinneach]

the toughest part of fitting a Butt Plate when i started was knowing just where to take off material to achieve the needed effect.
like if the point of the plate angled up from the plane of the comb. the first one i lowered the comb inlet, before it dawned on me the toe had to shorten to drop the angle.
still struggle with the things. and most everything else.

Thats where I am at the moment

 

[Coinneach]

Thought I'd post what I use for my inletting black, this is my Grandmothers Spirit burner (she used it to flame disinfect Needles before digging out Splinters, and anything else that needed a small flame application).

Its a very small container that needs the tiniest funnel (comes with the burner) to fill, unlike what my Nanna used (Methylated spirits) I use Kerosene for the smoke value; to be honest I love those old world things, they work.....and keep on working; always practical and always needed sooner or later.
BTW anyone knows where to get replacement Wicks for Lanterns etc ? I've got Candle lanterns but need Wicks for the Burner and my Kero Lanterns here.

IMHO too many of us have forgotten what our parents and grandparents tried to teach us, only buy and keep the things that you will always need and will last; (ML's, Good knives; Hatchets etc have to be included) and NEVER throw or sell anything thats proven itself useful.......even if it means buying a 20 ft Shipping Container... BTW I've got two of them)
.

 

[GREENSWLDE]

As an engineering apprentice at Cincinatti Milling M/Cs we used a lot of engineer's blue,fitting beds. When you have a new tin,Always leave it with the lid off for some weeks to dry out some of the oil.It's easier to clean up and dosen't run into porous surfaces (like wood) and stain every thing that lovely Blue. I make my own Granny lamps.Smoke comes off easier than oily blue.Any natural fibre like cotton string will make a wick for your old Granny lamp..OLD DOG..

 

[alandsal]

Ok, so if a person makes a mistake and takes off too much wood in an area. Using your logic if this person uses filler, he's doing crappy work and or doesn't care? BS! Nobody's perfect. Not everyone is a world class craftsman! Sometimes filler may just be required to fix imperfections that can't be removed any other way.

Slight gaps in butt plates can be made less noticeable by greasing the plate, adding a little epoxy to the area of the gap, then the plate is screwed in place. The slight gaps will all but disappear.

Take some of the same wood if you have extra make some saw dust mix with wood glue has to be the right amount not too much put in gapped areas let dry sand off excess this has worked for me

 

[bptactical]

What makes a buttplate a challenge is your working in multiple dimensions.
Your inletting inward and downward at the same time while keeping things level front to back and side to side.
I like to file a bit of draft on the contact surfaces of the buttplate, easier to fit in my opinion.

 

[frankie]

I start by concentrating on the top shank off the Butt plate and working it forward aligning with the top of the comb. (I hope that makes sense) Then as the inside back of the butt plate makes contact with the wood, removing that.

 

[frankie]

When carefully working off high spots you're removing maybe 0.0005" at a time. Its slow tedious work but done this way never causes a gap that might need filling. Gaps are most likely the result of rushing and using an inappropriate tool that hogs off wood quickly. Slow and patient does the trick.

View attachment 122670

that is the way they are supposed to look. Great Job!

 

[cajun]

Little update, still working on it, a lot more sanding too do. But I think it's coming along. Looks like a "GAP" on the upper side but it's actually metal that's still a little flat and the wood needs to come down a hair. Same as the toe area the metal and wood need to come down a hair. I'm satisfied with this side, haven't touch the other side yet. Will keep updating.

 

[deerstalkert]

one trick i use semi successfully is to use cloth backed sandpaper and sandwich it between the plate and the stock. this is where relieving the center portion of the stock but helps.
sandwich the cloth in and putting pressure on the butt plate sand vertically. side to side is going to get you breakouts.

 

[Coinneach]

As an engineering apprentice at Cincinatti Milling M/Cs we used a lot of engineer's blue,fitting beds. When you have a new tin,Always leave it with the lid off for some weeks to dry out some of the oil.It's easier to clean up and dosen't run into porous surfaces (like wood) and stain every thing that lovely Blue. I make my own Granny lamps.Smoke comes off easier than oily blue.Any natural fibre like cotton string will make a wick for your old Granny lamp..OLD DOG..

Needs tight braiding though, string on its own doesnt last long at all.

 

[Coinneach]

What makes a buttplate a challenge is your working in multiple dimensions.
Your inletting inward and downward at the same time while keeping things level front to back and side to side.
I like to file a bit of draft on the contact surfaces of the buttplate, easier to fit in my opinion.

That makes sense, its easy to adjust and none of the wood Stock wise is wasted.
We can always replace a Butt plate gone wrong, unlike a Premium grade Maple stock already inletting to Barrel and Lock etc.