Can you guys school me on grades of Hawkens? Quality, value, etc.

[LME]

@LME, you and I are arguing about how much we agree with each other. Pyrodex fouling is easily cleaned with the same cleaning practices we use with black powder. Fouling, properly cleaned and followed by a good lubricant keeps the bore protected as you have demonstrated. It's the improper cleaning that is of concern and that's what any buyer of a used muzzleloader must be aware of. And that is applicable to all sources of powder fouling.

Kudos to you for taking care of your rifle and using the powder you have to get good accuracy and long term care. Thank you for sharing your experiences.

I agree we both agree more than we disagree! No foul no harm!

 

[vintovka]

I have had/built/bought/sold several hundred factory "hawken" type rifles over the last 6 (six, count em) decades. The best and most common "factory" ones were standard tc and gprs based on affordability, reliable quality, fit and finish. Factory CVA mountain rifles are next. The Browning Mountain, Ithacas and others are very nice as well but can be expensive. All in all buyers need to really get hands on experience before deciding. At 75 weight and handling are foremost qualities in my mind. The GPRs and similar are now just too heavy for me. If i had to chose my lifetime favorite rifle it would be the TC Seneca with both .45 and .36 barrel. Certainly the .45 for most game.

 

[SPQR70AD]

If you already have BP experience, and are wanting to dabble with half stock cap guns, try this: I go to pawn shops and small gun shops pretty frequently to see what they have. To date, I've bought many muzzleloaders in these ships for $125 or less. That includes two New Englanders and a Renegade. Bought a Traditions buckskinner, which was a fantastic little rifle, for $75 out the door. And this wasn't years ago. It's been just in the last five years or so.

The thing is this: most of the guys running these shops don't know or care about old used muzzleloaders, so they practically give them away. Back in 2014 I bought a nice Italian made .45 flintlock canoe gun in one of these shops for $100 out the door. Didn't look like it had been fired or handled much. Still have it. If you go this route just make sure they are unloaded first and give them a good cleaning. Then fire a couple blank loads, then light loads, and work your way up. And if you're broke like me, at the moment, most of these guys, at least around here, offer layaway plans. By the way, one of those little bore lights in your pocket wouldn't be a bad idea.

I have been in pawn shops in many different states and saw mostly high priced junk and used guns going for 20-30% more then the same new gun

 

[Hermit Tim]

I have been in pawn shops in many different states and saw mostly high priced junk and used guns going for 20-30% more then the same new gun

I'm going to shops in southern Tennessee down to south Alabama and find great deals in this area. One thing I've noticed is if young guys are running the shop and it is chock full of Glocks and AR type rifles BP guns are usually cheap. At least in my area.

 

[ETipp]

I'm going to shops in southern Tennessee down to south Alabama and find great deals in this area. One thing I've noticed is if young guys are running the shop and it is chock full of Glocks and AR type rifles BP guns are usually cheap. At least in my area.

You are lucky. Pawn shops here will not deal with traditional ML’s.

 

[Longrangehunter]

A Pinto with Cadillac style.

That’s what we called a Pontiac back in the day…… 50 years ago.

 

[vintovka]

You are lucky. Pawn shops here will not deal with traditional ML’s.

Funny most here won't touch inlines.

 

[reddogge]

In MD a muzzleloader is an inline with a scope. That's all you see in muzzleloader season.

 

[RobertIN]

A nightmare from armslist. Shop wants $450... I shudder to think what that bore looks like if the outside looks that horrendous.

 

[Dale Lilly]

I guess it reflects what is popular where you live. Here in Eastern Oklahoma, I have purchased three, hardly used, Investarm Hawken style [plains rifles] marked with different importers] for $200 or less. In South Texas, I bought a Lyman GPR kit for $135 [Lock disassembled]. All were found in Pawn shops. Polecat

 

[RobertIN]

Found this CVA .54 on Armslist for $100, but I'll say I paid $50 due to an unexpected $50 tip I got this week for designing and printing some cupholders for a family friend's boat.

Bore had some surface rust but looks clean now and it had probably been leaned in a closet for a long time. I even managed to put the lock back together after cleaning/greasing (first percussion!). I don't see a K stamp anywhere on the barrel so I think it might not be a kit? I'll have to do some reading on the markings and serial I'd love to find out more about it.

I'll cut my teeth shooting this guy and look for something nicer later on, for the money I couldn't be happier though! I appreciate y'all's discussion in this thread I hope it helps others in the future.

 

[Rebel bull]

You are now the proud owner of one of the best guns ever. There are many more expensive ones out there but none that are better shooters. If you’re ever in need of help with it let me know

 

[RobertIN]

You are now the proud owner of one of the best guns ever. There are many more expensive ones out there but none that are better shooters. If you’re ever in need of help with it let me know

Thanks Bull, I appreciate your input earlier on in the thread!

 

[Grenadier1758]

Only T/C kits will have a K prefix. @RobertIN has found a decent rifle and an entry into traditional muzzleloading.

 

[Hermit Tim]

Deleted double post..

 

[Hermit Tim]

Found this CVA .54 on Armslist for $100, but I'll say I paid $50 due to an unexpected $50 tip I got this week for designing and printing some cupholders for a family friend's boat.

Bore had some surface rust but looks clean now and it had probably been leaned in a closet for a long time. I even managed to put the lock back together after cleaning/greasing (first percussion!). I don't see a K stamp anywhere on the barrel so I think it might not be a kit? I'll have to do some reading on the markings and serial I'd love to find out more about it.

I'll cut my teeth shooting this guy and look for something nicer later on, for the money I couldn't be happier though! I appreciate y'all's discussion in this thread I hope it helps others in the future.
View attachment 342709View attachment 342712View attachment 342713

You did good on this one. I wouldn't have batted an eye if I ran across it for that price. I hope you enjoy it.

 

[RobertIN]

Only T/C kits will have a K prefix. @RobertIN has found a decent rifle and an entry into traditional muzzleloading.

Good info, must have crossed some wires in my brain lol.

 

[bpd303]

I really wish it would be historically accurate if the half stock Hawken was a Flinter. My Oh My how cool would that be…

I converted one to flintlock back in 2015 a CVA 50 cal the barrel was a percussion that had the bolster destroyed by someone that drilled out the nipple and "clean out screw" bought the stock off of eBay and lock from Deer Creek. All told I have $220 U.S. in it and a little sweat equity. I think I did a post about it, if I can find it I'll edit with a link.
Edit: well I found both threads and the pictures are gone so I'll take some more tomorrow and post them.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/cva-54-hawken-for-the-record-books.95771/
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/cva-50-hawken-nipple-blow-out.96611/page-2

 

[bpd303]

Found this CVA .54 on Armslist for $100,

As others have said, you did very, very well on that gun. The T/C's are over rated in my opinion. The CVA's I have have been as good or better than the T/Cs that I have or had. It's hard to beat a 54 cal.

 

[RobertIN]

As others have said, you did very, very well on that gun. The T/C's are over rated in my opinion. The CVA's I have have been as good or better than the T/Cs that I have or had. It's hard to beat a 54 cal.

I have high hopes for it! Feels a hell of a lot more solid than I thought it would, I guess they just don't make em like they used to! I'm reading through the Walks Alone threads on them now to figure out when it was made and such.