Early Rustic Arms German short rifle

[Blivetmaker]

The Pranger St

 

[dyemaker]

I found this old this old thread in google image search as I often do. It was not related but I do know that the triggerguard pictured above from TOTW is from a Swiss federal rifle. They have the matching buttplate as well. These caught my eye as nice offhand rifles but are a different animal entirely with a longer barrel. I had wondered how far off I would be using a stock pattern I found with the furniture. Obviously the federal rifle has more drop but.. anyway here are the links for referrence. Just pondering as I often do without real knowledge other than what little I can gleen here and there on my computer. The pranger thing is a pyrotechnic or grenade launcher and not a hunting rifle.

http://www.littlegun.info/arme%20suisse/a%20fusil%20cantonaux%20tireur%20elite%20gb.htm
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/imgPart/bp-ma-80-b_0.jpg
http://knobmountainmuzzleloading.com/images/jaeger_1.JPG

 

[dyemaker]

It would be interesting to see to two stocks side by side in person to compare them. The prangler thing appears to be Swiss to me by the way. I am no expert. Probably to launch confetti or something at public events. The Swiss have a rich history in firearms and know their stuff. The other carbine pictured was made in 1685 still in the time of wheellocks and the guard is typical of classic German wheellock rifles. Here is another similar rifle to the one I gave a link to. It was converted from flintlock.

http://www.littlegun.info/arme%20suisse/ancien%20artisan/a%20bindschedler%20maenedorf%20gb.htm

I think that the pr4ecarved stock would probably be better without the fancy furniture but These Swiss rifles sure are sweet. Sorry for rambling and going somewhat off topic. I just had to reply.

 

[Supercracker]

Boar hunting with dogs was very popular in Germany. Anyone who's ever waded into the melee of 2 or 3 dogs trying to catch a big pig will understand why, for someone who didn't want to use a knife or spear, the super short barrel would be handy.

 

[dyemaker]

An explaination I read (somewhere) for the longer Swiss barrels is that they were used for hunting mountain goats. I dont know about all that but they look like nice target rifles to me.

 

[asbrown]

:bow: LSU, I agree. Let me indulge in some learned conjecture. Most hunting in europe was done by those who held property and had money. They tended to purchase/commission highly figured, heavily engraved and richly carved guns. We have examples of the very short Jaeger and the 24-30" we'll call medium length. I believe both types of guns were owned by the same people and put to different uses. I believe we can agree the super short guns were likely used in heavy cover on boars. I'm also aware that Stag, Roe deer, bear, and wolves were hunted in the woods and fields and I propose that the medium length guns were put to use on these types of game. Neither is intended to be an example of what a "Jaeger Rifle" is, just an example of what one "can be". :idunno: :v

 

[asbrown]

If you check "The Rifle Shoppe" catalogue you'll find exactly what your looking for in the heading 1851 swiss rifle.

 

[dyemaker]

Jaeger rifles are as short as you want them up to 35" or 36". the Spanish style ones tend to be longer. I've seen a Kuchenreuter pistol with a detachable rifle stock too. I do not consider the Swiss rifle a jaeger rifle I was comparing different things when I came across this old post. It seems that Germans had similar target rifles. Also compare the triggerguard of this wheellock by Caspar Zellner to the one pictured above. It's all in the fine details I guess... Sorry for straying further.
https://plus.google.com/photos/117...441199716926/albums/posts/5767726101534241474

 

[ken.clements]

Does anyone know the historical background on the "Pranger Stutzen"? This looks like those 18th cent. short rifles.

Chris I.?

Scroll down to the bottom of the page -

http://www.jagen-waffen.de/Hege/Gewehre.html[/quote


They are not Rifle's or Smoothbore's in what you are thinking....I would not even attempt to load them with anything other than a blank.
They / It is made for parade's to shoot blanks of blackpowder.
They are tested for pressure by the German Authority's before they are sold, but only with blanks.
If you attempt to load them with a projectile, they will probably blow up.

 

[ken.clements]

The auction write-up doesn't say.

RARE GERMAN FLINTLOCK HUNTING CARBINE by HANS KEINER, ERGER, ca. 1685: Molded hardwood full butt-stock with raised comb. Deeply chiseled steel mounts in a baroque scroll pattern with black lead background. Swamped octagonal rifled 10 3/4" barrel deeply chiseled throughout en suite, with three-stage rear sight and signed at the tang Hans Keiner, Erger. Steel side plate engraved in same manner with a depiction of a bare-breasted female figure playing kettle drums. Articulated trigger guard also engraved. Steel butt plate engraved with Coat of Arms consisting of a round-shield, bow, arrow and quiver. Lock plate deeply engraved throughout and retains all its black lead background. Hammer of very early form with a long spur atop for cocking. In overall excellent condition retaining nearly all its finish throughout. Original steel ramrod. Length overall 24,"

Hans Keiner of Erger, Prussia, ca. 1677, is best known for his heavily chiseled wheelock arms. Examples of his work are exhibited at the Victoria and Albert Museum and the Castle Osterstein, in Germany. Keiner is considered one of the best German gunsmiths of his time. See J. F. Hayward The Art of the Gunmaker vol. 2 1660-1830.

its a "Boller" shortend from a rifle for parade use, for shooting blanks and no kind of "shooting" weapon.