Finishing A Fowler Build

[PathfinderNC]

Oct. 6, 2023

Hi folks,

I thought it would be interesting to post what I will be doing with an old, unfinished Fowler build that I just bought yesterday. This gun was started years ago (by someone named Callaghan in New Milford) and will be mine to finish up, though with some challenges!
A little bit about this gun;
~It is long! The Fowler is some 5'8" from the brass, engraved and signed butt-plate to the muzzle.
~It has a smoothbore barrel of .69 caliber and measured 51" in length. The barrel is tapered round with octagonal fluting and turned rings at the muzzle, which is really cool.
~The ramrod has a turned horn tip and a nice steel threaded fitting at the bottom.
~Four ramrod pipes with the front pipe coned shaped; a very nice feature.
~The butt plate is 1- 7/8" wide and 4- 1/2 " high, with a return measuring 5".
~The one-piece stock is highly figured Curly Maple. The barrel, pipes and butt plate are all inlet with a nice tight looking fit (I have not removed any mountings as yet).
~The lock plate mortise (not the internals, though) and side plate are mortised out for a lock plate that measures 5-1/5 x 1”.

Now the first challenge, and it’s a big one; I can find no lock of those dimensions that would ever fit in the carved mortise and have the pan line-up with the touch-hole area (as yet undrilled). The face of the breech plug is 5/8” into the barrel. As such, any lock template that I have photo-imposed onto the lock mortise places the pan almost at the end of the barrel breech!

Because the tapered barrel (and flared tang) is already inlet, moving the barrel rearward isn’t an option I will even consider. Using a smaller lock and setting it forward into the mortise will not work either. What a mess.

As I thought about it more last night I considered one option – how about use a larger lock? If I set it in at the rear of the mortise and enlarge the mortise at the frizzen spring area, the pan and touch-hole may align. So, I made a plate stencil of my large Kibler lock (6” x 1”) and placed it over the fowler mortise. A good fit at the back 2/3rds! Though the touch-hole would be about 1/8” forward of center-of-pan, that is something I can modify slightly by grinding the front of the pan a bit. OK- that is promising.

Now, with using a longer lock than what the gun is carved for, I have to consider the stock around the lock mortise. Mr. Callaghan had already not only cut out the plate mortise, but he also shaped the molding area around the mortise. This means I will need to cut (file) away about 1” of wood at the feather-spring area, deep enough to match the rounded section there, cut a patch of Maple and glue in place. On both sides.

This appears to be my method of approach to the challenge. It seems to be a workable solution, though it’s in such a highly visible area, making and blending a matching patch will take some doing.

So, unless I discover a lock with a really long hammer throw and short feather spring area, I will move on with this plan.

I will try to update as I go along. If this works, I think it will be a terrific and unique New England (?) Fowler. Attached are some photos of what I will be working on.

 

[martin9]

The Chambers gunmakers lock is 5 7/8" X 1 3/16 and could be a good option. Also, the Early Ketland which is 1/4" shorter than the Kibler lock. Of course I've no idea if these would line up just right but they might be worth looking into.

 

[Stumbling Buffalo]

Good to see the Pathfinder on his next adventure! Good luck and fare well, Bob.

 

[dave_person]

Hi Bob,
The gun is an attempt to make a Hill's family fowler, likely John Hills. They were active in Goshen, CT and John later moved to Charlotte, VT. The John Hills signatures are the muzzle decoration, the butt plate and the overall shape of the stock. He also used figured maple. Most of his locks were flat faced much like Chambers early Ketland lock. Below are 2 guns I built greatly inspired by a fowler and rifle by John Hills made in the 1780s and 1790s.

dave

 

[PathfinderNC]

The Chambers gunmakers lock is 5 7/8" X 1 3/16 and could be a good option. Also, the Early Ketland which is 1/4" shorter than the Kibler lock. Of course I've no idea if these would line up just right but they might be worth looking into.

The issue is that there needs to be ample room for the pan to align with the touch-hole. Shorter locks will not work, as the pan area would completely rest over the breech plug area. It needs a longer throw, which calls for a longer lock. That means extending the mortise forward to accommodate the longer lock.

 

[PathfinderNC]

@dave_person
"Hi Bob,
The gun is an attempt to make a Hill's family fowler, likely John Hills. They were active in Goshen, CT and John later moved to Charlotte, VT. The John Hills signatures are the muzzle decoration, the butt plate and the overall shape of the stock. He also used figured maple. Most of his locks were flat faced much like Chambers early Ketland lock. Below are 2 guns I built greatly inspired by a fowler and rifle by John Hills made in the 1780s and 1790s."
Dave I am so glad for your reply and information. I remember your thread on the Hill Fowler.
I am at a loss to know what kind of lock Callaghan was in-letting for. It must have had a very short frizzen-spring area to work in this mortise. Hence why I need a longer (6") lock.

 

[martin9]

There's always a little room to shorten the nose on locks....and reshape the plate completely. Just something to consider before cutting the mortice

 

[PathfinderNC]

There's always a little room to shorten the nose on locks....and reshape the plate completely. Just something to consider before cutting the mortice

Yes- I looked at that possibility with the Kibler lock. I could grind the lock nose back to fit, but it would leave no place for the forward lock screw. Oh, well.... it's never easy!

 

[Thingamajiggy]

Track offers oversized square plated locks that you can custom fit. TOTW says plate is 5.8" by 1.18", maybe something to look into?

 

[dave_person]

Hi Bob,
Three locks to look at, TOW's Tulle, Davis's Tulle, and L&R's Queen Anne. They are all fairly short in the nose and just a little bit larger than your mortise. They also could work for a Hills family gun. Personally, I would wipe out the existing lock moldings and carefully blend in the contours of the stock to outline the panels. The builder cut them in too early in the game before he had correctly shaped the wrist and lock area.

dave

 

[PathfinderNC]

Track offers oversized square plated locks that you can custom fit. TOTW says plate is 5.8" by 1.18", maybe something to look into?

Yes thanks- I looked at MBS also. I'm really not a metal worker to do that kind of work, though it did seem like an option for someone qualified in this stuff. I would need to look at the length of the main spring, to see if it was short enough to would allow for such a short lock-plate nose and still allow enough area to receive the forward lock bolt.

 

[PathfinderNC]

Hi Bob,
Three locks to look at, TOW's Tulle, Davis's Tulle, and L&R's Queen Anne. They are all fairly short in the nose and just a little bit larger than your mortise. They also could work for a Hills family gun. Personally, I would wipe out the existing lock moldings and carefully blend in the contours of the stock to outline the panels. The builder cut them in too early in the game before he had correctly shaped the wrist and lock area.

dave

Thank you for these suggestions. This is super helpful. I was also wondering about the moldings and blending them out. I will definitely look at those lock options today. You're a big big help, Dave.

 

[54ball]

~The lock plate mortise (not the internals, though) and side plate are mortised out for a lock plate that measures 5-1/5 x 1”.

Now the first challenge, and it’s a big one; I can find no lock of those dimensions that would ever fit in the carved mortise and have the pan line-up with the touch-hole area (as yet undrilled). The face of the breech plug is 5/8” into the barrel. As such, any lock template that I have photo-imposed onto the lock mortise places the pan almost at the end of the barrel breech!

OK.....

Let’s look at this more.
Options....
Counter sink and polish a concave face on the breech plug. Notch the edge of plug face at the touch hole.
This should open up lock options.

There’s things you can do in the breech that can overcome touch hole placement issues.

 

[TDM]

@PathfinderNC that is a beautiful Fowler. I agree with @martin9, I’d give Chambers a call and discuss the dimensions needed. They just might have some old stock that would work or a kit you can shape. Don’t let shaping the metal deter you, it’s not that difficult. Talking to Track is a good option too. Best of luck.

 

[2 shots]

maybe cut the breech plug back and have a spacer machined to fill gap????

 

[CuNosecap]

Martin mentioned Jim Chambers gun makers lock. Looking at the picture,

https://www.flintlocks.com/locks.htm#GM,
I wonder if you could get1/8 in mild steel bar and cut/ shape to fit lock mortise. Would this not allow for forward or backward movement of the pan to match your needs?
As to difficulty in metal working, you have a perfectly constructed template, and hacksaw, jewelers saws, files and grinder is all you need.

If you can create such beautiful horns, no doubt you can do this.

Heck, send me by PM or email, I may have some leftover strap and will cut it for you (no charge). What’s to lose?
Rick

 

[CuNosecap]

Thanks for the PM. I completely recognize that we all have different strengths and weaknesses.
I seem to remember some guy starting a ruckus about carving.
There are certainly many ways to downsize the mortise. As you fully recognize, finding a close lock will continue to be the biggest problem. I will follow to see your chosen method.

Rick

 

[CuNosecap]

BTW, The offer stands if needed.

 

[PathfinderNC]

Thanks for the PM. I completely recognize that we all have different strengths and weaknesses.
I seem to remember some guy starting a ruckus about carving.
There are certainly many ways to downsize the mortise. As you fully recognize, finding a close lock will continue to be the biggest problem. I will follow to see your chosen method.

Rick

Thanks Rick. I am actually thinking I need to enlarge (not downsize) the mortise, which is the challenge.
(And about the carving thing... heretofore shall I be known as "Ruckus-man" ?

 

[IanH]

The L&R QA is a worthless piece of junk but is 2" from center of pan to front of lock plate. The front lock screw goes behind the bend in the feather spring. The plate could be filed to shorten the front another 1/8" to be nearly even with the feather spring. The Kibler lock is 2-3/8" from center of pan to the front and doesn't shorten well.