"Flash" rust, again

[Jay Gardner]

Use rust remover to get rid of it. They use Ballistol to keep it from ever coming back. If you use water to clean. Then put a little Ballistol in the water to prevent rust from starting. Then when dry use straight Ballistol to keep rust from ever coming back.

Simple.

Thanks! This is what I was looking for.

 

[Tumblernotch]

Getting no match when I use that link. Anyhoo, doesn't matter anyway. Lots of opinions on here and you know what they say about opinions. What I say about using 3 in 1 is not an opinion. Just fact based on many years of experience. It works and I like it. Others do too, just as others like Ballistol and bore butter. I've never used Ballistol, but from testimonials I read on here it may be alright. Bore Butter on the other hand I do not like. It's messy, gums everything up and sets up like concrete in cold weather. But, a lot of people on here swear by it.

Sooo, I think I'll continue to use that nasty old 3 in 1 in my bores and my locks and hey! I even rub it into my stocks from time to time! Just like it says on the can. You know how a lot of guys on here get off on smelling Hoppe's Number 9? 3 in 1 has just about the same effect on me.
:rotf:

 

[Pete Gaimari]

I like the smell of Hoppe's. Actually, I like the smell of BP, Ballistol, and other things that get people upset over.


Speaking of your stock. No bull, i'm being serious. Ballistol will bring a stock to life. Rub it on fairly heavy and let it soak in overnight. The next day rub it good with a towel for a nice deep sheen that doesn't go away.


It will even whiten your teeth.


Ok, kidding about the teeth.

 

[pargent]

what i do is clean with soapy water, run patches soaked with soapy water, then dry clean patches until they come out clean .then i use a couple of patches soaked with olive oil.12 to 24 hours later run a dry patch then an oiled patch.there realy is no magic bullet for gun cleaning ,no mater what products you choose to use it will take alittle time & effort & follow up. :hatsoff:

 

[Tumblernotch]

To be honest I like the smell of Hoppe's myself. If I ever run across some of that Ballistol I might get some and try it out. I ain't agin trying something different now and again though I usually stick with my old tried and trues. Heck, I even found that I like Stumpy's Moosemilk and keep a batch made up for soaking patches in. Even got to where I don't mind the smell of it either!

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Here's a test that might interest you. I wish Ballistol was in it. It would have been at the top from other similar tests i've seen

However, pay attention to how 3in1 did.
http://www.thegunzone.com/rust.html

 

[Zonie]

I used Ballistol in a few of my custom muzzleloaders to protect the bores from rust after cleaning them.

It didn't.

I now use Birchwood Casey "Barricade" to protect the bores in my muzzleloaders.

It does.

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Doesn't make sense that you would be the only one. :idunno:

 

[Tumblernotch]

That's all well and good if a feller stores his gun in or around salt water. I don't and regardless of what that lawyer says, 3 in 1 does just fine, especially for an oil that is really a lubricant. If I was to decide to try something new it would be the Eezox or the Break Free. Like I said, I'm generally willing to try something new if it doesn't cost too much if I feel a need.

I can definitely agree with him about WD-40. It's only good for a few hours in holding back rust.

 

[Vaino]

I've used only one type of "lubricant" on my MLers for the last 30 yrs, have had no rust even w/ long storage and its Oxyoke 1000 or its predecessor. I use it on the entire gun, stock included and also as a patch lube. For cleaning, plain, softened hot water is used, then wire brushing followed by a couple of patches and lastly a very hot water rinse. Two patches to dry and then a liberal amount of Oxyoke 1000 and she's good to go for a long time. I'm wondering if the softened water makes a difference? Anyways...I just like to keep it simple and besides, Oxyoke 1000 is also good for dry or chapped hands.....Fred

 

[ffnh243]

Now theres 2 of us, does it make sense now :haha:
seriously though, Ive had nothin but bad luck with any thing but bore butter. I use it for a patch lube, field cleaner and bore protector. I will however, use balistol and only balstol on my locks and triggers but never gain on a barrel or stock. maybe Im just doing something wrong :idunno: :idunno:

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Sorry, but I have to call :bull: to anyone saying Ballistol doesn't work.

Go look at my thread "Ballistol", and tell me bore butter is better. You've been brain washed.

 

[ffnh243]

Not saying it doesnt work, I just havent had any luck with it inside the bore. after a week I cand run a dry patch and it comes out all reddish brown and nasty and that goes for any "spray" type oils Ive tried. again :idunno: :idunno: :idunno: maybe Im doing something wrong :idunno:

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Maybe you have rust in the barrel that needs to be removed first.

Ballistol is a rust preventative. Not a rust remover.

 

[Dphar]

Yes, I know this has been discussed recently but I'm still perplexed. I have a .54 plains style rifle made in 1977 with a Douglas XX barrel. I've only owned the rifle for about 6 months and I have not shot it a lot.

After I clean the rifle I continue to get brown streaking on my patches, even days after I have cleaned the rifle with warm soapy water and patches with Cleanbore Oil and dry patches. I presume this is what is referred to as "flash" rust. I'm not so concerned with what starts it but I would like to know how to kill it, once and for all. Let's keep it simple. I have some Ballistol on the way.

Many thanks,

DG

First. Black powder or substitutes?
Do you finish with a lightly oiled patch?, do you make sure the powder channels in the breech are oiled? Do you actually flush the bore or just wet it?
Soap is corrosive. It must be flushed out with clean water that is no more than tepid.
The bore once cleaned is completely unprotected and will oxidize even as you dry it.
Black iron oxide on the dying patches is very common. If you allow these black patches to air dry they often revert to red iron oxide and turn the patch tan or brown in an hour or two. Powder fouling turns black or in low humidity grey.
A tan patch at followup is not world shaking.
Red ugly rust on a follow up patch is.
The slight amount of rust on a tan colored patch could be left over oxide from cleaning.

Not using water to clean.
This is possible. But risky.
BP fouling dissolves rapidly in water and the water carries away the elements that promote corrosion.
Water and oil mixes.
Water and water soluble oil has been used and I first heard of it in the 1970s. "Moose Milk" or some such. I also heard the reports of significant after rust so I never used it.
The old Sharps Rifle Company recommended nothing but Sperm Whale Oil. But these were breech loaders and cleaned up far easier than a ML with a plug at the breech. A lot of the fouling was in the cartridge case. But the oil did not address the chlorate primer issue either. This requires water to remove.

If you use corrosive substitutes all bets are off.


From the Ballistol MSDS
*******
TECHNICAL DATA SHEETS FOR BALLISTOL
Contents Ballistol contains medicinal grade mineral oil, alkaline salts of oleic acid, several alcohols, Benzyl Acetate and an oil from vegetal seeds. The mineral oil is unchlorinated and conforms to the specifications of US Pharmacopeia XX.
*******

Note. If this stuff is used over perchlorate fouling expect serious rust if the fouling is not removed in minutes.
All Alcohols have some water in them. Original Hoppes #9 for example simply activates perchlorate fouling. It also contains alcohol.
In any case I do not consider any "oil" with alcohol in it a preservative no matter what the label says. And its not trustworthy as a cleaner IMO either. Not for BP or perchlorate fouling.

In any case 0w30 motor oil will probably work as well or probably better since motor oils have additive package that among other things is designed to fight corrosion.

Dan

 

[sepiatone]

I used Ballistol in a few of my custom muzzleloaders to protect the bores from rust after cleaning them.

It didn't.

I now use Birchwood Casey "Barricade" to protect the bores in my muzzleloaders.

It does.

I have had this same experience. I started using ballistol as a protectant and would always get rust. After advice from members on this forum, I switched to Barricade and have never had a problem since.

 

[Dphar]

One more thing using a petroleum oil as a preservative will not cause hard fouling in the bore. It never has for me in almost 45 years of BP firearms. I suppose if there was a pool of oil in the breech and powder put in and somehow fired of it might cause grief.
Now petroleum as shooting PATCH lube can be something else since now we are mixing fouling and the petroleum.


And a CLEAN, oiled bore does not rust except as noted in my earlier post. Even pure neetsfoot oil will prevent rust. But putting alcohol in the bore can CAUSE rust.
So getting it clean in the key. Bores that have been damaged by corrosion can be VERY difficult to get clean and take much longer.
Dan

 

[Birddog6]

If it was the Ballistol aerosol, it is not adequate for bore protection. IMHO. Use the Non-aerosol Ballistol & apply it liberally & must have enough patch thickness to force the lube into the very edges of the rifling grooves.

I have been using it for ? 9-10 years & love the stuff.

But whatever you use, it is MOST important to get ALL the moisture out before applying any rust inhibitor or gun oil. If you don't, you just sealed in the moisture trapped in the pores & edges & it is going to rust UNDER the gun oil.

Keith Lisle

 

[curator]

After-rust is a real issue when shooting Pyrodex. Less of an issue when using real black powder. Balistol is particularly good at reducing to eliminating flash rust and after rust but not perfect. I make a habit of wiping out any of my muzzle loaders a week or two after cleaning, just in case. When shooting Pyrodex, I have found nothing to work better at preventing after rust than automatic transmission fluid. I often do my follow-up cleaning with "Ed's Red" a mixture of mineral spirits, acetone, kerosene, and ATF. I do wipe out the bores with alcohol before shooting to eliminate any traces of ATF in the bore.

 

[Zonie]

Thanks for the, "Sorry, but I have to call :bull: to anyone saying Ballistol doesn't work."

You seem to have a way with words.

It seems that three of us admit to having poor results with using Ballistol.

BD6: No, I did not use the aerosol version. I used the bottled type and it's currently busy gathering dust on my shelf. It does do that pretty well.

When I had the 'after cleaning rust' form my first thought was, "Maybe an oil that mixes easily with water isn't such a good idea for something that is supposed to keep water away?"

Anyway, there are several other oils that have been developed specifically for prevent moisture from getting to gun bores and none of them stink like Ballistol.