My concern with the curvature of the stock is two fold, comfort and recoil mitigation. The game i hunt in order of likelihood is deer>squirrel>hog>rabbit>dove. So upward angled shots WOULD be less likely, but still within the realm of possibility.
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Fusile vs Fowler for future Smoothrifle
- Thread starter Jfoster
- Start date
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Comfortably_Numb
The Evil Mike Brooks
Out of all the mentioned guns, this is the one I'd go with, I have built several of these over the years. It handles extremely well.
54ball
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JD Foster,
I feel you need some more education on this. Right now I feel you are going by looks alone. The best case scenario would be for you to handle some guns. This may not be an option for you. If there are living history events in your area, a visit and an explanation of your dilemma,I'm sure those fellows would let you shoulder and handle their guns.
Another option is making a try stock from a paper pattern. While not the same as handling an actual gun, a Plywood silhouette gives you a much better idea than a photo from a web sight. What you can do here is invest in some plans. These plans have the gun drawn full size on paper. Make a tracing, and transfer that onto a suitable piece of Plywood. Now you have something that you can shoulder. Now you can make a more educated guess about basic handling.
Track has many Plans
Log cabin shoppe has plans
Knob Mountain has Plans
Eric von Aschwege has Plans http://www.vonaschwegeflintlocks.com/plans.html
I have a Clay Smith Carolina Gun. I can make a tracing from the lock back and send it to you if you wish. Pm me and I'll trace it out and send it to you.
Is historical accuracy important for you?
Do you just want the gun or do you want to build the gun?
Does this gun have to be left handed?
The parts sets shown in this thread vary in quality.
Chambers is the best of the lot in both quality and ease for the builder. They really go together well compared to the other sets.
Track sets vary in quality some of their more premium sets rival Chambers.
Sitting Fox, Jack Garner TVM, Avance TVM, and others are more generic and frankly the parts work but you have to make them work which makes them a much more challenging build. Another factor with these....They are generic in stock style and are not the best in historical architecture. They can make a good gun....but frankly not the best gun if historical accuracy and handling is important for you.
Another option is historical stock patterns.....
Knob Mountain has a collection of stock blanks taken from originals. What you do here is supply a barrel or purchase one from them. they then fully inlet your barrel into their stock and drill the ramrod hole. Then you inlet all the parts. In a lot of ways this is the closest to building from a blank as the stock is only shaped from the lock panels back.
For a builder or new builder I must mention Kibler's Colonial Rifle. This set is available with a smooth barrel special order. Alas though...it's a right handed gun.
https://kiblerslongrifles.com/products/58-caliber-colonial-american-longrifle-kit-down-payment
I'm left handed and I shoot right handed guns. Since this is such a big purchase, I understand going with a left handed gun.
In the white....
Mike Brooks, Clay Smith...
Will build you a gun in the white or at least they used to. If you do not have the basic tools...work bench, vise, lighting, files, rasps (good ones) good quality chisels and the sharpening supplies, Having your gun built by a builder may honestly be cheaper in the long run.
Mike Brooks makes an excellent Carolina.
http://www.fowlingguns.com/carolinafowler1.html
The Clay Smith Carolina is a little fat with the 42" barrel.( this is mainly due to the thicker barrel) Clay's Bumford Gun is much closer to the real "slim" Carolina. I do believe his Bumford comes with a 46" 24 gauge barrel as did the original. It should be no problem getting these in left hand...(Caywood lock)....
https://www.claysmithguns.com/Bumford_gun.htm
Locks....
RH...
Chambers (all of them)
Big Davis fowling/trade locks
Davis Twigg
LH
Chambers LH Siler
Caywood Fowling/Trade
L&R makes a lot of LH locks but.......
Of the L&Rs the Queen Anne seems to have the best reputation.
Lastly there is Dixie's Pedersoli 2nd Model Brown Bess. It's a right handed gun but it comes in the white...It's a basic assembly...pretty much factory assembled you just have to finish it.
https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index...825+Pedersoli+2nd+Model+Brown+Bess+Musket+Kit
I feel you need some more education on this. Right now I feel you are going by looks alone. The best case scenario would be for you to handle some guns. This may not be an option for you. If there are living history events in your area, a visit and an explanation of your dilemma,I'm sure those fellows would let you shoulder and handle their guns.
Another option is making a try stock from a paper pattern. While not the same as handling an actual gun, a Plywood silhouette gives you a much better idea than a photo from a web sight. What you can do here is invest in some plans. These plans have the gun drawn full size on paper. Make a tracing, and transfer that onto a suitable piece of Plywood. Now you have something that you can shoulder. Now you can make a more educated guess about basic handling.
Track has many Plans
Log cabin shoppe has plans
Knob Mountain has Plans
Eric von Aschwege has Plans http://www.vonaschwegeflintlocks.com/plans.html
I have a Clay Smith Carolina Gun. I can make a tracing from the lock back and send it to you if you wish. Pm me and I'll trace it out and send it to you.
Is historical accuracy important for you?
Do you just want the gun or do you want to build the gun?
Does this gun have to be left handed?
The parts sets shown in this thread vary in quality.
Chambers is the best of the lot in both quality and ease for the builder. They really go together well compared to the other sets.
Track sets vary in quality some of their more premium sets rival Chambers.
Sitting Fox, Jack Garner TVM, Avance TVM, and others are more generic and frankly the parts work but you have to make them work which makes them a much more challenging build. Another factor with these....They are generic in stock style and are not the best in historical architecture. They can make a good gun....but frankly not the best gun if historical accuracy and handling is important for you.
Another option is historical stock patterns.....
Knob Mountain has a collection of stock blanks taken from originals. What you do here is supply a barrel or purchase one from them. they then fully inlet your barrel into their stock and drill the ramrod hole. Then you inlet all the parts. In a lot of ways this is the closest to building from a blank as the stock is only shaped from the lock panels back.
For a builder or new builder I must mention Kibler's Colonial Rifle. This set is available with a smooth barrel special order. Alas though...it's a right handed gun.
https://kiblerslongrifles.com/products/58-caliber-colonial-american-longrifle-kit-down-payment
I'm left handed and I shoot right handed guns. Since this is such a big purchase, I understand going with a left handed gun.
In the white....
Mike Brooks, Clay Smith...
Will build you a gun in the white or at least they used to. If you do not have the basic tools...work bench, vise, lighting, files, rasps (good ones) good quality chisels and the sharpening supplies, Having your gun built by a builder may honestly be cheaper in the long run.
Mike Brooks makes an excellent Carolina.
http://www.fowlingguns.com/carolinafowler1.html
The Clay Smith Carolina is a little fat with the 42" barrel.( this is mainly due to the thicker barrel) Clay's Bumford Gun is much closer to the real "slim" Carolina. I do believe his Bumford comes with a 46" 24 gauge barrel as did the original. It should be no problem getting these in left hand...(Caywood lock)....
https://www.claysmithguns.com/Bumford_gun.htm
Locks....
RH...
Chambers (all of them)
Big Davis fowling/trade locks
Davis Twigg
LH
Chambers LH Siler
Caywood Fowling/Trade
L&R makes a lot of LH locks but.......
Of the L&Rs the Queen Anne seems to have the best reputation.
Lastly there is Dixie's Pedersoli 2nd Model Brown Bess. It's a right handed gun but it comes in the white...It's a basic assembly...pretty much factory assembled you just have to finish it.
https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index...825+Pedersoli+2nd+Model+Brown+Bess+Musket+Kit
Last edited:
JD Foster,
I feel you need some more education on this. Right now I feel you are going by looks alone. The best case scenario would be for you to handle some guns. This may not be an option for you. If there are living history events in your area, a visit and an explanation of your dilemma,I'm sure those fellows would let you shoulder and handle their guns.
Another option is making a try stock from a paper pattern. While not the same as handling an actual gun, a Plywood silhouette gives you a much better idea than a photo from a web sight. What you can do here is invest in some plans. These plans have the gun drawn full size on paper. Make a tracing, and transfer that onto a suitable piece of Plywood. Now you have something that you can shoulder. Now you can make a more educated guess about basic handling.
Track has many Plans
Log cabin shoppe has plans
Knob Mountain has Plans
Eric von Aschwege has Plans http://www.vonaschwegeflintlocks.com/plans.html
I have a Clay Smith Carolina Gun. I can make a tracing from the lock back and send it to you if you wish. Pm me and I'll trace it out and send it to you.
Is historical accuracy important for you?
Do you just want the gun or do you want to build the gun?
Does this gun have to be left handed?
The parts sets shown in this thread vary in quality.
Chambers is the best of the lot in both quality and ease for the builder. They really go together well compared to the other sets.
Track sets vary in quality some of their more premium sets rival Chambers.
Sitting Fox, Jack Garner TVM, Avance TVM, and others are more generic and frankly the parts work but you have to make them work which makes them a much more challenging build. Another factor with these....They are generic in stock style and are not the best in historical architecture. They can make a good gun....but frankly not the best gun if historical accuracy and handling is important for you.
Another option is historical stock patterns.....
Knob Mountain has a collection of stock blanks taken from originals. What you do here is supply a barrel or purchase one from them. they then fully inlet your barrel into their stock and drill the ramrod hole. Then you inlet all the parts. In a lot of ways this is the closest to building from a blank as the stock is only shaped from the lock panels back.
For a builder or new builder I must mention Kibler's Colonial Rifle. This set is available with a smooth barrel special order. Alas though...it's a right handed gun.
https://kiblerslongrifles.com/products/58-caliber-colonial-american-longrifle-kit-down-payment
I'm left handed and I shoot right handed guns. Since this is such a big purchase, I understand going with a left handed gun.
In the white....
Mike Brooks, Clay Smith...
Will build you a gun in the white or at least they used to. If you do not have the basic tools...work bench, vise, lighting, files, rasps (good ones) good quality chisels and the sharpening supplies, Having your gun built by a builder may honestly be cheaper in the long run.
Mike Brooks makes an excellent Carolina.
http://www.fowlingguns.com/carolinafowler1.html
The Clay Smith Carolina is a little fat with the 42" barrel.( this is mainly due to the thicker barrel) Clay's Bumford Gun is much closer to the real "slim" Carolina. I do believe his Bumford comes with a 46" 24 gauge barrel as did the original. It should be no problem getting these in left hand...(Caywood lock)....
https://www.claysmithguns.com/Bumford_gun.htm
Locks....
RH...
Chambers (all of them)
Big Davis fowling/trade locks
Davis Twigg
LH
Chambers LH Siler
Caywood Fowling/Trade
L&R makes a lot of LH locks but.......
Of the L&Rs the Queen Anne seems to have the best reputation.
Lastly there is Dixie's Pedersoli 2nd Model Brown Bess. It's a right handed gun but it comes in the white...It's a basic assembly...pretty much factory assembled you just have to finish it.
https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index...825+Pedersoli+2nd+Model+Brown+Bess+Musket+Kit
Thank you for all of that info. I had not considered plans and doing a try stock. My wants are really based off percieved needs and performance as opposed to looks. They all look good IMO. Historical accuracy is important to me but not everything. While i want to be as accurate as possible, i know i will end up having to give up some things due to price point and choices alone. I want to build, but not from blank. Id like something a little more personal than in the white. I have some tools and can source/buy others. Ive dabbled in wood work and machining and have a solid “try anything” attitude.
JD Foster,
I feel you need some more education on this. Right now I feel you are going by looks alone. The best case scenario would be for you to handle some guns. This may not be an option for you. If there are living history events in your area, a visit and an explanation of your dilemma,I'm sure those fellows would let you shoulder and handle their guns.
Another option is making a try stock from a paper pattern. While not the same as handling an actual gun, a Plywood silhouette gives you a much better idea than a photo from a web sight. What you can do here is invest in some plans. These plans have the gun drawn full size on paper. Make a tracing, and transfer that onto a suitable piece of Plywood. Now you have something that you can shoulder. Now you can make a more educated guess about basic handling.
Track has many Plans
Log cabin shoppe has plans
Knob Mountain has Plans
Eric von Aschwege has Plans http://www.vonaschwegeflintlocks.com/plans.html
I have a Clay Smith Carolina Gun. I can make a tracing from the lock back and send it to you if you wish. Pm me and I'll trace it out and send it to you.
Is historical accuracy important for you?
Do you just want the gun or do you want to build the gun?
Does this gun have to be left handed?
The parts sets shown in this thread vary in quality.
Chambers is the best of the lot in both quality and ease for the builder. They really go together well compared to the other sets.
Track sets vary in quality some of their more premium sets rival Chambers.
Sitting Fox, Jack Garner TVM, Avance TVM, and others are more generic and frankly the parts work but you have to make them work which makes them a much more challenging build. Another factor with these....They are generic in stock style and are not the best in historical architecture. They can make a good gun....but frankly not the best gun if historical accuracy and handling is important for you.
Another option is historical stock patterns.....
Knob Mountain has a collection of stock blanks taken from originals. What you do here is supply a barrel or purchase one from them. they then fully inlet your barrel into their stock and drill the ramrod hole. Then you inlet all the parts. In a lot of ways this is the closest to building from a blank as the stock is only shaped from the lock panels back.
For a builder or new builder I must mention Kibler's Colonial Rifle. This set is available with a smooth barrel special order. Alas though...it's a right handed gun.
https://kiblerslongrifles.com/products/58-caliber-colonial-american-longrifle-kit-down-payment
I'm left handed and I shoot right handed guns. Since this is such a big purchase, I understand going with a left handed gun.
In the white....
Mike Brooks, Clay Smith...
Will build you a gun in the white or at least they used to. If you do not have the basic tools...work bench, vise, lighting, files, rasps (good ones) good quality chisels and the sharpening supplies, Having your gun built by a builder may honestly be cheaper in the long run.
Mike Brooks makes an excellent Carolina.
http://www.fowlingguns.com/carolinafowler1.html
The Clay Smith Carolina is a little fat with the 42" barrel.( this is mainly due to the thicker barrel) Clay's Bumford Gun is much closer to the real "slim" Carolina. I do believe his Bumford comes with a 46" 24 gauge barrel as did the original. It should be no problem getting these in left hand...(Caywood lock)....
https://www.claysmithguns.com/Bumford_gun.htm
Locks....
RH...
Chambers (all of them)
Big Davis fowling/trade locks
Davis Twigg
LH
Chambers LH Siler
Caywood Fowling/Trade
L&R makes a lot of LH locks but.......
Of the L&Rs the Queen Anne seems to have the best reputation.
Lastly there is Dixie's Pedersoli 2nd Model Brown Bess. It's a right handed gun but it comes in the white...It's a basic assembly...pretty much factory assembled you just have to finish it.
https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index...825+Pedersoli+2nd+Model+Brown+Bess+Musket+Kit
There is a living history group a couple hours from me. They meet monthly. Every time i try to go to an event i end up working though.
Left hand is important to me. Im cross dominant (right handed/left eye dom), but have been shooting long guns left handed for the past 14 years. Shooting right handed, while doable, is not what i have come to prefer.
54ball
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I shoot my right handed guns, left handed. I shoot off the lock side. It's no problem for me....it's the same as shooting a double. The only problem I have ever had shooting off the lock side is from a CVA Pecussion with a worn out nipple (The old rifle tested fired fine...the test did not show it's tendency to spit back) and a 1795 Musket with a flashguard.(vent gas blew back just a little when it hit the flashguard) Both were single incidents from about 30 years of shooting.
I understand that its possible and doable. I used to shoot a CVA percussion that was right handed. Its just that if im going through the process of building id want it to be a lefty. -shrugs-
Definitely give it a lot of thought. Don't know where you are in the country, but if you could shoulder a few examples would be great. I ended up with four flint smoothbores, the most natural pointer is actually a club butt Dutch trade gun. My Mike Brooks Carolina gun though has such a nice light barrel that is the one I usually go for.
54ball
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Perfectly understandable. Get what you need and want.
I bought the kit from Sitting Fox and then realized I had no idea how to assemble it, so he did the assembly for me. In recent years there have been some complaints concerning built products from him, however there are many other builders. The kit originally came from Larry Zorn Mold and lock.
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Great beginner kits are the TOW Northwest Trade Gun kits. The finished product also is a very nice piece for war of 1812 reinactors. You can even modify them to make them slightly bettter by adding a rear entry pipe. The toughest part of that kit is the tang screw, its on a 45 degree angle, many folks would think its a mistake but its how the originals were designed, so the tang screw against teh trigger guard looks off center.
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I contacted him for a heavy Jaeger with a 36 inch barrel, he offered me 8-10 months wait for the Kit, the Kit shouldhn’t take long. He’s really backed up with projects. Great Gunsmith !
Comfortably_Numb
The Evil Mike Brooks
From what I understand all that work is farmed out.
