ges on your frizzen Frizzen Gouges

[bads1buell]

When you get a gouge on your frizzen what is the best procedure for removing?

 

[roundball]

When you get a gouge on your frizzen what is the best procedure for removing?

I periodically chuck one of those cylinder shaped coarse sandpaper accessories in my dremel tool, have a cup of ice water at the ready, hit the frizzen for a few seconds then plunge the frizzen in the ice water for 15 seconds, repeat, repeat, etc...done that many times to several frizzens over the past few years...works great

 

[ameling]

A frizzen is a ... consumable supply. It is designed to wear away over time. When the flint hits it, the sharp edges on the flint chip/dig out little bits of the hardened tool/spring steel. The energy of chipping/digging out those little bits of steel heats them up enough that the carbon in them burns. That's the sparks you see. It's the same thing as when using a flint striker.

So the more sparks you get, the faster your frizzen wears away.

But if you get big "gouges" in it, then that frizzen probably has some areas of it that were not heat-treated hard enough. The harder it is heat-treated, the easier it is for the flint to chip out little bits of the steel, and the smaller those bits will be - making them easier to heat up enough to burn/spark. The softer the heat-treat hardness of your frizzen, the more likely your flint will dig in more and "gouge" out bigger chunks of your frizzen. And those bigger chunks are harder to get hot enough to start burning/sparking. It's the same with flint strikers.

So you can sand/grind them out carefully, and keeping the metal from getting too hot to hold in your fingers. But that wears away your whole frizzen faster. If you end up with a little burr sticking up, a quick couple passes with a sharpening stone should level them back down.

Just my humble thoughts to share. Take them as such.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands

 

[Vaino]

I also sometimes use a sandpaper drum in the Dremel but mostly I grind the frizzen on a 5-1/2" to 6" dia. bench grinding wheel. The radii of both match up quite nicely. With the frizzen right side up, lightly touch the wheel, move the frizzen from side to side and very quickly a smooth, even radius has been ground on the frizzen. Water should be close by for cooling.A round or radiused stone is then moved laterally up and down on the frizzen to give it "tooth". Sometimes just stoning will smooth the surface if the gouges aren't too deep.....Fred

 

[paulvallandigham]

Grind, sand, and polish the face smooth, but then think about preventing that gouging in the future. The gouging occurs because the flint is striking the frizzen at too straight an angle.( There may also be secondary causes for the gouging that also have to be fixed, but that is the main problem for most flintlocks.) If the frizzen is only case hardened, the gouging usually has cut through the case hardening surface, and the frizzen will have to be replaced, or re-case hardened, to get any sparks. However, The neck of the cock can be heated and bent to change that angle of impact( to 60 degrees), so that the flint scrapes, rather than gouges.

See my article on Shooting and Tuning Flintlocks under Member resources, at the top of the Index page to this forum. Scroll down to " Articles, Charts, and Links.", and click on " Articles ". There is a separate index there to the articles listed.

I wrote this with the idea that shooters would be able to fix these problems without hiring a gunsmith to do the work, with a minimum of equipment in a shop at home. If you have specific questions about your lock, send me a PM, and I will try to help you.

 

[Don B]

Why does a gouge need to be repaired? All of the suggestions here return a smooth surface to the frizzen, but at the cost of removed metal and shortened frizzen life. Why not just live with the gouged frizzen, and concentrate on fixing the cause of the gouging?

Don

 

[paulvallandigham]

How much money do you want to spend on flints? How many shots do you want to get out of a flint, before it shatters into large chunks, and falls out of the cock?

Gouges not only tear away large chunks of the edge of your flint, but the sparks are NOT thrown down into the pan. On their best day, sparks from a gouged frizzen FALL into the pan. Mostly, they miss, or burn up before they reach the priming powder.

Other than that, I can't think of any reason to remove the gouges, and prevent them from re-occurring. :shocked2: :surrender: :thumbsup:

 

[roundball]

Why not just live with the gouged frizzen, and concentrate on fixing the cause of the gouging?

Whether or not gouging can ever be 100% eliminated is one discussion.

But you don't want to live with a gouged frizzen as that can affect flint life, amount of sparks, ignition problems, etc...IMO frizzens last a long time...thousands of shots if they're cared for, kept fairly smooth, etc.

 

[J.D.]

When you get a gouge on your frizzen what is the best procedure for removing?

The first question in my mind is what is causing the gouge, and how bad is it? Also, where is the gouge?

A gouge across the face of the frizzen is caused by the fling striking the frizzen head on, rather than with a scraping action. Not good.

Gouges down the length of the face of the frizzen are usually caused by a too soft frizzen, though some light gouging is normal.

So, why do you want to remove those gouges? If the frizzen is hard enough, and the angle of contact between the flint and frizzen correct, you are only causing premature wear on the frizzen by removing them.

IMHO, it would be much better to get to the source of the gouging, and fix that, rather than grind away the frizzen.

Who made the lock on your gun? If the frizzen is case hardened, as are all of the imports, grinding, or otherwise removing material will only grind away the case hardening. That will result in a dead frizzen that will require further case hardening.

J.D.

 

[bads1buell]

The lock is a large siler, and the gouges are small. I just dont want it to get any larger.

 

[Vaino]

Sometimes a larger than normal "gouged" frizzen lies w/ the geometry of the particular lock or improper hardness and rectifying this problem requires a certain amount of expertise that is beyond the capabilities of some who use flintlocks.....Fred

 

[J.D.]

The lock is a large siler, and the gouges are small. I just dont want it to get any larger.

If the lock was assembled by Bud Siler, or Jim Chambers, it's as good as it's gonna get.

IF, however, the lock was assembled by someone, from a kit, it may not be as right as it could be.

If the lock works well, I suggest leaving it alone. Gouges, or more correctly, deep scratches are normal for a well used lock and don't hurt a thing.

The frizzen on the Siler lock is made of 1095 steel and is through hardened. Sanding away some of the scratches won't hurt it, appreciably, but continued grinding or sanding will prematurely wear the frizzen. As stated earlier, they are supposed to look like that, so IMHO, I would leave it alone.

As an afterthought, if you want a pristine frizzen for display, a new one can be ordered from Chambers to swap for the old one, and the old, scratched one installed for use.

IMHO, Jim would be the person to ask about wear on a Siler lock.
http://www.flintlocks.com/

Good luck,
J.D.

 

[Semisane]

.
Just for the heck of it - pictures of what I think is pretty even frizzen wear on my Lyman Great Plains.
.

 

[tg]

Put up a pic of the frizzen if you can you may have normal wear.