GPR as good as they used to be?

[user 43911]

Lyman (Investarms) may have tightened things up some (maybe too little to late for Lyman with regard to QC), I purchased a couple of guns at the start of this month, the GPH is good but the wood finish could have been better but no big deal other details are close to the following gun. Trade Rifle is another story, wood is nicely finished walnut, wood to metal fit is equal to Pedersoli, blue is good, trigger pressure required to break a shot is 2.1 lbs, after following Lyman's recommendation regarding barrel cleaning to remove preservative (soak overnight in Hoppe's #9 and use a bronze brush) I got is clean after many tries, wax plugged the barrel for the last six inches and got a groove depth of 5 thou at the muzzle with a slow increase to 8 thou at 2 1/2 inches point ( both rifles show taper machining of the lands the last 2 through 3").
Lyman has had a good reputation with blackpowder guns over the years along with being sold for a reasonable price, I've had the $1,400/$2,000 and up guns , some I did not want to shoot in case something happened to them, for $424 the .54 Lyman Trade Rifle is hard to best, Lyman Great Plains is likewise (compared to a Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Hawken) .
As shooters I would pit the Lyman's against any other factory gun.

Also something to think on is TOW stopped selling new Pedersoli guns some time ago over warranty/parts support, unless I was miss informed. They still carry Lyman.
Both guns I purchased factory new with manufacture dates 12/19 and 01/20.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Does Pendrosoldi really make these now?

 

[user 43911]

I can't find anything to indicate a change of supplier, if they do I'm sure it will be this model from Pedersoli and that will be a shame for a few reasons. I like some of the Pedersoli guns but not this one.

https://www.davide-pedersoli.com/sc...aditional-hawken-target-rifle-percussion.html

 

[user 43911]

Lyman (Investarms) may have tightened things up some (maybe too little to late for Lyman with regard to QC), I purchased a couple of guns at the start of this month, the GPH is good but the wood finish could have been better but no big deal other details are close to the following gun. Trade Rifle is another story, wood is nicely finished walnut, wood to metal fit is equal to Pedersoli, blue is good, trigger pressure required to break a shot is 2.1 lbs, after following Lyman's recommendation regarding barrel cleaning to remove preservative (soak overnight in Hoppe's #9 and use a bronze brush) I got is clean after many tries, wax plugged the barrel for the last six inches and got a groove depth of 5 thou at the muzzle with a slow increase to 8 thou at 2 1/2 inches point ( both rifles show taper machining of the lands the last 2 through 3").

Both guns I purchased factory new with manufacture dates 12/19 and 01/20.

What I forgot to post the other day was the Trade Rifle has a good amount of cast off with a little toe out, also came with stainless nipple. Again I think this is great for a gun costing just over $400.

 

[Bad Karma]

The Lyman’s Plains... blah blah blah... The greatest factory guns EVER MADE, IMHO.

Well, at least since T/C stopped making side locks...

 

[Loonhaven]

I've never had a Lyman product until recently. I bought two GPR kits(percussion and flintlock) and was generally impressed with the quality. I'm not a fan, however of the design of the flintlock, specifically the shape of the hammer and frizzen spring. I also had never worked using European walnut. That being said, I wanted the opportunity to build these kits with my own twist. I added a CVA capbox in German silver on the percussion rifle and a handmade iron patchbox on the flintlock. The percussion remained mostly stock though I reprofiled the area of the tang down through the wrist. The flintlock I built on the lines of a late flintlock period with a traditional cheekpiece and mouldings fore and aft of the lock panel.
I can't speak to accuracy as neither have been shot. I think if you have moderate woodworking skills you can get a very nice rifle.

 

[Howie1968]

beautiful rifles

 

[jambuster]

I've never had a Lyman product until recently. I bought two GPR kits(percussion and flintlock) and was generally impressed with the quality. I'm not a fan, however of the design of the flintlock, specifically the shape of the hammer and frizzen spring. I also had never worked using European walnut. That being said, I wanted the opportunity to build these kits with my own twist. I added a CVA capbox in German silver on the percussion rifle and a handmade iron patchbox on the flintlock. The percussion remained mostly stock though I reprofiled the area of the tang down through the wrist. The flintlock I built on the lines of a late flintlock period with a traditional cheekpiece and mouldings fore and aft of the lock panel.
I can't speak to accuracy as neither have been shot. I think if you have moderate woodworking skills you can get a very nice rifle.View attachment 27566View attachment 27567View attachment 27568View attachment 27569View attachment 27570View attachment 27571View attachment 27572View attachment 27573View attachment 27574

Great job!!!!

 

[Capnball]

I've never had a Lyman product until recently. I bought two GPR kits(percussion and flintlock) and was generally impressed with the quality. I'm not a fan, however of the design of the flintlock, specifically the shape of the hammer and frizzen spring. I also had never worked using European walnut. That being said, I wanted the opportunity to build these kits with my own twist. I added a CVA capbox in German silver on the percussion rifle and a handmade iron patchbox on the flintlock. The percussion remained mostly stock though I reprofiled the area of the tang down through the wrist. The flintlock I built on the lines of a late flintlock period with a traditional cheekpiece and mouldings fore and aft of the lock panel.
I can't speak to accuracy as neither have been shot. I think if you have moderate woodworking skills you can get a very nice rifle.View attachment 27566View attachment 27567View attachment 27568View attachment 27569View attachment 27570View attachment 27571View attachment 27572View attachment 27573View attachment 27574

Nice finish, love the tang profiling, very nice. Hope they shoot as good as they look!
Neil

 

[Capnball]

I just watched Hickock on YouTube review the percussion Lyman GPR, that gun was tight! I mean, that video was the thing that sold me on Lyman. I don't mind tuning a gun either. There's lots of ways to finesse tighter shot groups, fit and finish and actions. It's half the fun of shooting guns like these. Figuring out what the gun wants to be your "tick licker' or "Ol Betsey" and it's almost the same feeling you get when you connect with that special dog! Once, maybe twice in a lifetime and you wouldn't take your weight gold for it.
Neil

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Another option if you enjoy the Lyman is The Pedersoli Hawken.

Closer to the originals and a much better quality rifle.

 

[Capnball]

Another option if you enjoy the Lyman is The Pedersoli Hawken.

Closer to the originals and a much better quality rifle.

I love Pedersoli guns but that almost doubles the base price. I thought about building the gun (I haven't completely abandoned that idea) but there's always a good used gun on the horizon!

 

[user 43911]

Another option if you enjoy the Lyman is The Pedersoli Hawken.

Closer to the originals and a much better quality rifle.

Two years ago I purchased 2 Pedersoli Hawkens , the Rocky Mountain .54 and the Missouri .45, the .45 was returned to Dixie as the lock was bad, after I got over the fact that the finish (browned) is sprayed on (Dura coat) I shot the Rocky Mountain gun a lot, it's nice but it is heavy with a capital H, as far a close to the originals, kind of but not really, case hardening would not be correct, the stock butt plate/shape is not correct, sights are not correct, rifling twist rate is not correct (1 in 65" not 1 in 48" as it should be) the Missouri is closer in that respect at 1 in 47" all this aside they are a great guns to look at and shoot, I was always concerned with scratching it. I think you can get a Pedersoli on sale now for around $1,300.
I now have Lyman guns shop around and Trade Rifle is $424 and GPR around $575, both shoot on par with any other maker, at a glance the GPR is closer to the original than the Pedersoli, at a glance.

 

[Capnball]

Two years ago I purchased 2 Pedersoli Hawkens , the Rocky Mountain .54 and the Missouri .45, the .45 was returned to Dixie as the lock was bad, after I got over the fact that the finish (browned) is sprayed on (Dura coat) I shot the Rocky Mountain gun a lot, it's nice but it is heavy with a capital H, as far a close to the originals, kind of but not really, case hardening would not be correct, the stock butt plate/shape is not correct, sights are not correct, rifling twist rate is not correct (1 in 65" not 1 in 48" as it should be) the Missouri is closer in that respect at 1 in 47" all this aside they are a great guns to look at and shoot, I was always concerned with scratching it. I think you can get a Pedersoli on sale now for around $1,300.
I now have Lyman guns shop around and Trade Rifle is $424 and GPR around $575, both shoot on par with any other maker, at a glance the GPR is closer to the original than the Pedersoli, at a glance.

I love the quality of Pedersoli weapons but I have one. I also have an original 1861 Bridesberg rifled musket. A modern in line and I really just like the look of that Lyman. If I had $10K to blow on a gun, I'd have something nice made. I don't! I might be able to scrounge together enough to buy the Lymans. I know enough about guns to make it shoot as well as it can. That was all great information, thanks!
Neil

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Two years ago I purchased 2 Pedersoli Hawkens , the Rocky Mountain .54 and the Missouri .45, the .45 was returned to Dixie as the lock was bad, after I got over the fact that the finish (browned) is sprayed on (Dura coat) I shot the Rocky Mountain gun a lot, it's nice but it is heavy with a capital H, as far a close to the originals, kind of but not really, case hardening would not be correct, the stock butt plate/shape is not correct, sights are not correct, rifling twist rate is not correct (1 in 65" not 1 in 48" as it should be) the Missouri is closer in that respect at 1 in 47" all this aside they are a great guns to look at and shoot, I was always concerned with scratching it. I think you can get a Pedersoli on sale now for around $1,300.
I now have Lyman guns shop around and Trade Rifle is $424 and GPR around $575, both shoot on par with any other maker, at a glance the GPR is closer to the original than the Pedersoli, at a glance.

Case hardening on the breech and tang is most certainly correct for an original Hawken rifle.

 

[user 43911]

Case hardening on the breech and tang is most certainly correct for an original Hawken rifle.

O.K. some but not all, I should have replied/commented more correctly and stated color cased on all metal parts is not correct.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Check this out. Scroll down to the “truly traditional Hawken” section.

whitemuzzleloading.com/docs-ramblings/

Pretty interesting read. Don Stith & Brandt Selb also pretty much echo these specs. I have no doubt originals could be found in a number of different configurations. But, the Pedersoli furnishings are mostly correct. The grade of fancy maple seen on the Peder. Rocky Mountain Maples is probably much fancier than what could be found on most Hawken “mountain rifles” (as Sam Hawken called them) but there are a few surviving with figured maple.

In regards to the sights, yes, those are more modern but they are similar to what could be furnished out of the later Gemmer shop.

 

[Capnball]

Lyman (Investarms) may have tightened things up some (maybe too little to late for Lyman with regard to QC), I purchased a couple of guns at the start of this month, the GPH is good but the wood finish could have been better but no big deal other details are close to the following gun. Trade Rifle is another story, wood is nicely finished walnut, wood to metal fit is equal to Pedersoli, blue is good, trigger pressure required to break a shot is 2.1 lbs, after following Lyman's recommendation regarding barrel cleaning to remove preservative (soak overnight in Hoppe's #9 and use a bronze brush) I got is clean after many tries, wax plugged the barrel for the last six inches and got a groove depth of 5 thou at the muzzle with a slow increase to 8 thou at 2 1/2 inches point ( both rifles show taper machining of the lands the last 2 through 3").
Lyman has had a good reputation with blackpowder guns over the years along with being sold for a reasonable price, I've had the $1,400/$2,000 and up guns , some I did not want to shoot in case something happened to them, for $424 the .54 Lyman Trade Rifle is hard to best, Lyman Great Plains is likewise (compared to a Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Hawken) .
As shooters I would pit the Lyman's against any other factory gun.

Also something to think on is TOW stopped selling new Pedersoli guns some time ago over warranty/parts support, unless I was miss informed. They still carry Lyman.
Both guns I purchased factory new with manufacture dates 12/19 and 01/20.

Man, another great review! Seriously, that's information I can use, thank you for that.
Neil