How far can a ball travel?

[Britsmoothy]

If he hit her shooting at a deer the wound would have been in the side of the head (unless he was shooting at Rudolf or Pranser). If he did shoot in the air it would have been in the top of the skull IMHO.

You're assuming on level ground.

LOOK I'm not saying that he couldn't have launched his projectile that far...,

WHAT SMELLS to me is what you all have proven..., you guys are scholars and have brought forth esoteric information of extremely long shots with a muzzle loader AND a conical bullet.

Would this fellow have known that?
:hmm:

What made me suspicious is WHY does a fellow who was likely to have average knowledge of firearms, and average expectations of how far the bullet may travel (he has to take a hunter safety course as part of his sentence; ergo he hasn't had that training yet) even suspect that his discharging of his rifle to begin cleaning had gone that far and killed that person? So he then comes forward. My conclusion, he was a lot closer to her when he fired, so he had some indication of what he'd done.

Hey I stopped barking squirrels with my .54 years ago since the branches wouldn't stop the ball and I would be shooting upwards. I'm not advocating firing into the sky or ignoring directions of muzzle discharge. When I unload by firing it's into a specific oak stump..., a) I know where the shot has gone, and b) my Scottish genes like that I can recover the ball and recast it later.

LD

:rotf: I knew there was something about you :rotf:

 

[F.G. Ford]

Hello again!
An elongated projectile cannot be included in this calculation, as ballistic drag is not the same, and retained velocity, also is not the same as a round ball.
So taking the educated guesses of;
Necchi at 5-600 yds. 550 yds.
Juice Jaws 521.5 yds.
Spence 980 yds.
Marmotslayer 500 meters=546 yds.
Many Klatch 800 yds
Calculating these precise measurements the overall average equals 566.25 yds.= 1698.75 feet
We all know shooting across water is highly frowned upon, but that is about the best method to get the most accurate measurement.
According to the numbers Marmotslayer is the winner.
As said previously elongated bullets are not in the equasion, but a .22 long rifle, has a maximum reported travel of 1 1/2 miles or 2640 yds.
Pull the bullet and replace it with a round ball and it will not reach 500 yds.
As a side note, I tried hitting a sitting fox at a measured distance of 500 yds. with a .45 cal. long rifle and .70 grs. of 3f.
After five shots not even close, the fox decided to have a nap :shocked2:
Fred

 

[Danny Ross]

I can tell you this, I shot to empty an unmentionable using a 240 gr round and 100grs of 2f Triple 7 powder at the end of deer season here in OH some years ago (actually the last time it was shot). I shot across a glass smooth pond with a high dirt mound as the back stop. I was shooting off of the the dam of this pond, so about 6 feet above water level, plus I am 6ft tall, and took aim approximately half way up the dirt mound so at least level with me or 3-4ft higher. MAX distance for the shot maybe 400yds. Pulled the trigger took the recoil and lowered the rifle in time to see the round hit the water and skip multiple times (like skipping a stone) that what looked to be the last 40-45 yards into the base of the dirt mound. I did it to see if I could hit the mound or see how far the round would go with that powder charge. From that experiance, to get the yardage that I am seeing posted here the angle of the shot has to be I am guessing at least 45 degrees. DANNY

 

[steam1993]

My mortar has a max range of over 1000 yards. 8oz max powder 15 second flight time and that is in the book that came with it, and that ball weights 17 pounds.
Have not fired it yet to max range, but will do so when i have a safe place to do so.

 

[coloradoclyde]

to: everyone in general........

sorry for this OT question, but

WHY would someone NOT trying to poach a deer use their deer load for squirrel ?
(i'm talking about the small game season open before deer season)

Your question doesn't make sense.....

Why would a poacher use a muzzleloader in the first place? there are way better choices. Most poachers in my area use a bow, .22lr comes in second, then high powered rifles.. Killing the deer is the easy part, any gun will do, it's after you shoot the deer that the risk of getting caught begins.

Back to the powder charge for a muzzle loader and squirrels, I shoot the most accurate load not the weakest....I make head shots.

My most accurate load is also my deer load, but it is not the most powerful load I could shoot.

Power, weak or strong means nothing unless it hits the target.

 

[George]

An average of guesses? A unique concept. :grin:

My 980 yards wasn't a guess, educated or otherwise, it was calculated by this program:
http://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmdist-5.1.cgi

Plug in the ballistic coefficient, ball weight and muzzle velocity and it will give you the maximum range, initial and terminal angle, terminal velocity, etc.

Ballistics isn't a guessing game.

Spence

 

[tenngun]

And to Herb also, your post are interesting, I had always read and seen the tables for ranges based on 45 degrees :thumbsup:

 

[apachesx2]

Thank you for the calculator according to it with 70G of FFFg a 45 cal round ball 127 grains and ballistic coefficient of .064 should leave the barrel around 2100 feet per minute which according to the calculator optimal angle is 72 degrees and will travel for 1100 yards which is 3300 feet and is 2/3rd of a mile or just short of 7/10 of a mile or in excess of 1 km

:dead:

 

[apachesx2]

I believe in a perfect world a 45 degree angle is optimal but believe the dynamics of ballistics coefficient, sectional density derive the terminal velocity and add the pull of gravity play into the angle deviation above 45 degree... The higher the ballistic coefficient the closer you get to 45 degrees... What I find mind boggling is how poor the ballistic coefficient is on a lead round ball until this exercise... I use to think 20 cal bullets were bad at BC of .20 and they seem to max out at 338 cal around a BC of .50 but the round ball is in a league of it's own... I think the modern bullet was a bigger advantage than modern powders... But I have killed more deer in PA growing up with a 50 cal flintlock with a PRB than any other weapon in the gun cabinet...

 

[tenngun]

Well I never experimented with it my self, only what I’ve read. I would like to see it in action. One fact is for sure, all the paper work in the world ain’t worth one field experiment.

 

[apachesx2]

True, if you have ever hunted above 6,000 - 8,000 ft your bullet climbs like an 1.5" per thousand in altitude and it pays to shot at a range in your new hunting spot. I like watching some of the Alaskan hunting shows they live at sea level then climb up in altitude and miss game by shooting a foot and a half above their backs, not to mention shooting up and down slope.

 

[Britsmoothy]

True, if you have ever hunted above 6,000 - 8,000 ft your bullet climbs like an 1.5" per thousand in altitude and it pays to shot at a range in your new hunting spot. I like watching some of the Alaskan hunting shows they live at sea level then climb up in altitude and miss game by shooting a foot and a half above their backs, not to mention shooting up and down slope.

:hatsoff:

 

[Zonie]

...

'One of the principal changes in modern gunnery, from the old practice, is in the degree of elevation to effect the greatest range. According to the former parabolic theory, all projectiles were said to range farthest, at an angle of forty-five degrees. This has been found to be a mistake. It is still practiced, however, with large shells, and slow velocities; but with smaller shells, and greater velocities, an angle of about thirty degrees is found to range furthest; and with guns, at a still lower angle, according to the increased specific gravity of the ball, and an increase of velocity, until we come down to the ordinary rifle with leaden balls, when the greatest range is found to be at an angle of about twenty-five degrees. The greater the specific gravity of the ball, and the greater the velocity, the lower must be the elevation to produce the greatest range....

I found several things that agree with this.

While 45° gives the greatest range in a vacuum, that value is only of interest in space where there is no air.

When the effects of air are added, a angle of less than 45° from the horizon gives the greatest range for a projectile.

Although the time to reach the maximum height and the time for the projectile to fall from that height to the ground is the same due to the pull of gravity, the horizontal distance covered during the climb is greater on the way up than it is during the fall on the way down.

That means we want to use an angle less than 45° at the launch so the projectile spends its time and energy covering the maximum horizontal distance before it starts to fall.

Perhaps these links will describe this better than I can.
https://mcanv.com/Answers/qa_mrwar.html
https://www.quora.com/What-angle-must-a-cannon-be-fired-to-achieve-maximum-range

 

[coloradoclyde]

That means we want to use an angle less than 45° at the launch so the projectile spends its time and energy covering the maximum horizontal distance before it starts to fall.

:thumbsup: ......Yep!

 

[apachesx2]

I figured it out I think thanks partially due to your (Zonie) web links, I only partially understood the formulas because my military aviation career I have a lazy understanding of things and I didn't understand why the better the ballistic coefficient the lower the angle the less the higher the angle until I came across "ANALYSIS OF THE 155 MM ERFB/BB PROJECTILE TRAJECTORY"... I didn't realize sphere shaped bullets actually produce lift when pulled down by gravity actually have a slight angle of attack... which explains the poor coefficient of a round ball because it doesn't produce lift... The stuff can get complicated shooting off axis with rifled barrels at 150 mph or faster depending if you shoot to the right or left side of the aircraft...


Link

 

[bud in pa]

This is why I use a load of 6 shot from my smoothie when hunting tree rats. Besides i am not a good enough to head shoot squirrels with a rifle.

 

[longcruise]

Keep trying to tell y'all, it's 43 degrees. :dead:

 

[longcruise]

True, if you have ever hunted above 6,000 - 8,000 ft your bullet climbs like an 1.5" per thousand in altitude

Each year I sight in at 5000' and hunt at 9000 to 11000. So when I shoot at 10000' I'm 7.5" high? It just doesn't work that way.

 

[Britsmoothy]

True, if you have ever hunted above 6,000 - 8,000 ft your bullet climbs like an 1.5" per thousand in altitude

Each year I sight in at 5000' and hunt at 9000 to 11000. So when I shoot at 10000' I'm 7.5" high? It just doesn't work that way.

That is some tree stand. Be careful. :thumbsup:

 

[nkbj]

What's big deal?
Everybody knows that falling shot caint hurt yah!
:rotf: