How far will it go?

[PitchyPine]

No problem thanks for the help. :thumbsup:

 

[Walks Alone]

Interesting dilemma, and replies. I see nothing wrong with your question at all, and actually respect your asking it first rather than just banging away.

The answer is really pretty simple to me... Know your target and know your safe backstop. If either is uncertain, don't shoot. It doesn't matter whether the bullet will go 50 feet or 50 miles. Uncertainty with a "known" very real and present danger is obvious behind your property.

When I was 40 years younger I hunted tree rats often in the coastal mountains of California with rimfire rifles and pistols and rarely shotguns. Back then these mountains were mostly uninhabited with hundreds of square miles of land available to hunt. But there was no guarantee I had those mountains to myself on a given hunt. My ethics say sky lined shots are not an option with a rifle or pistol - ever. There was always plenty of opportunities to fill my game bag shooting in canyons and draws in the hardwood forest up north and Ponderosa forest further south with a safe terra firma backstop that I had a clear view of. Sky lined squirrels were simply passed on unless a sneak would put me in a position for a safe shot with a backstop I was certain of.

You might consider your 80 acres safe for sky lined shots, but I wouldn't even with a reduced load FWIW.

Just another opinion - not meant to put anyone down. :wink:

 

[Joel/Calgary]

The short answer, other than to be sure of your impact zone, is to use "Journee's Formula" for determining the approximate maximum ranges for lead spheres (balls or shotgun pellets). This formula states that the maximum range, in yards, is roughly 2200 times the shot diameter, in inches. That'd give 1100yds as the approximate maximum range for a .500 ball, proportionately less for smaller balls, somewhat less for the lower velocity you'd be using, and increasingly less as the angle of launch goes above 45*. Actually, I vaguely recall that the angle for the real-world maximum range is somewhat lower - something like 42*?

You're probably looking at something over a half a mile danger zone whan you roll it all together.

Hope this helps,
Joel

 

[PitchyPine]

Thanks gents, in the sake of safety the only answer is not too take a chance and pick the targets carefully. Would of done that anyway and always have, i was just curious about the loads and distances and what others do.
That`s why accidents are called accidents, we can never be too careful. :thumbsup:

 

[dennis byrd]

Pitchey, you ask a thoughtful question. To be concerned and seek an answer is very responsible, anyone so concerned can share the woods with me and I tip my hat to ya!
Squirreltail, the truth is you did an excellent job defining for us the theoretical potential of our projectiles. We are adults and I would imagine for most of us the information makes an excellent place to start and we can fill in the blanks with our local conditions, great job. Concience and intellect all on this site for free. Awesome!! Jet90

 

[paulvallandigham]

A couple of years back, we had a man hit by a shotgun slug in the butt, as he stood in a thick forest in S. Illinois. He did not hear a gunshot, nor an echo of a gunshot that belonged to the slug that hit him. It did not penetrate far, and the angle of entry suggested it was falling down from the other side of a 200 foot ridgeline above him.

The evidence suggests that someone fired at a sky lined deer, and missed it. Instead his slug traveled several hundred yards, and many feet lower to strike this unfortunate hunter. The Accident would have been prevented if the Shooter simply obeyed basic safety rules to always fire at a safe backstop, or pass on the shot. Avoid sky line shots.

I have hunted that forest on several occasions, and depending on how low clouds are on some days, you can hear shots fire miles away, that sound like they are only a few hundred yards away. But, on certain days, you don't hear much of anything. Its eerie. You know there are other hunters out , but you don't hear their shots.

If you don't have a safe background to fire against, just pass on the shot. Its just not worth the possibility of injuring another party hunting, or working outside. No squirrel is worth that kind of grief.
Oh, the slug was removed and the hunter went home the same day. I am sure he was not very happy about being shot, even by freak accident.

And it didn't have to happen. Years earlier, I had a shot at a deer on the ridge above me, but she was sky lined, and I passed on it. Then she walked up the ridge and decided to come down the side of the ravine within 35 yards of me. She was my first ML deer.

 

[Timothy Gregory]

Ok, it is really only a practical consideration for artillery (which seems a bit excessive for hunting squirrels :rotf: ).

I don't know, I kinda like the idea of using a 105!
:hmm: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: :rotf:

 

[RICKYD]

:shocked2: :surrender:.
..how many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie roll pop?

 

[Robert Egler]

:shocked2: :surrender:.
..how many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie roll pop?

The world will never know! :rotf:

 

[Runner]

As normal practice, in the big woods, I regularly shoot skylined squirrels off limbs with nothing but air behind them. Of course, I do it with a 177 or 22 pellet rifle and scope. I figure that 21 grain 22 pellet might be annoying if it falls on you, but that is it. When I take the 36, I wait for a backstop.

 

[Stumpkiller]

The noble solution is to stalk until you can shoot straight up so you're only endangering yourself.

 

[Slamfire]

Pitchy, I wasn't trying to insult you, when I said I don't shoot unless I know where the ball would stop. I don't know the real answer, and 80 acres, being an area measurement, not a linear one, doesn't give me any idea of how far it is to your neighbor's place.

 

[xxgrampa]

hi ho pitchy,

with the season fast coming upon us, it's a good question. if you look back in the archives you will see posts with people 'barking sq'ls' with 12 ga rnd balls and all sorts of other calibers.

it was good of you to remind us all to not take a questionable shot.. :hatsoff: :hatsoff:

now, if your 80 was parceled as most sections are. it will be 1/4 X 1/2 mi. too short for an unguided shot..

..ttfn..grampa..

PS... if i had to pick a safe distance. think it would be along the lines of squirrel tails. figgure on 8.4 miles and you will never kill any one accidently.

:grin: :grin:

 

[PitchyPine]

Thanks all, things came up and we haven`t got out shootin yet and now the weather has turned bad.
As far as distance it would be the length of a 80 which is a 1/2 mile i believe.
The little critters are spending a lot of time on the ground lately looking for acorns so those should present some good targets. Heck better to fill my out buildings with holes than some bystander. :haha:

 

[fw707]

Well, it looks like this thread is about to die a peaceful death, but I've got one more question.
Just how much damage will a 130-180 grain round ball do when it comes down after being shot into the air at a 45 degree (or more) angle? Looks to me like the energy from the gun is pretty much spent and all that's left is gravity.
I think a big hickory nut falling straight down from 75 feet would hurt worse. :hmm:

 

[roundball]

Well, it looks like this thread is about to die a peaceful death, but I've got one more question.
Just how much damage will a 130-180 grain round ball do when it comes down after being shot into the air at a 45 degree (or more) angle? Looks to me like the energy from the gun is pretty much spent and all that's left is gravity.
I think a big hickory nut falling straight down from 75 feet would hurt worse. :hmm:

I sure don't know, but I bet it would be worse than a hickory nut :wink:

A free falling heavy object like a lead ball should reach terminal velocity from that altitude and if it came down on someone's skull would probably crack or penetrate it...just imagine how much it would hurt if your head was hit by a much relatively lighter hail stone that size which we know can sometimes dent cars

 

[Stumpkiller]

That ball may reach a zero VERTICAL vector at apogee and head down, but it still has a significant HORIZONTAL vector. A projectile fired straight up stops at some point and then falls. Not so one with a horizontal path; and anything not straight up (or down) has some horizontal travel.

I would rather not be the receiver in this experiment. I've fired .38 mid-range wadcutters at about 30º "for the hell of it". 148 gr and with a muzzle velocity of 650 fps and a dismal ballistic shape they still kick up dirt and gravel and tip bowling pins 500 yards away. If you are stubborn enough to keep trying, anyway. Zen pistol firing.

 

[rabjr]

Myth Busters did a program, using modern bullets. They found bullets shot straight up did not have enough energy returning to earth to lethally harm someone. Those shot with any kind of an angle however could hurt someone.

 

[guncobbler]

Not to encourage anyone to shoot in the air but Gen Julian Hatcher did some experiments shooting bullets for long range and also straight up. He investigated why the 30-06 ball ammo at the time seemed to be lacking in range compared to earlier issued ammo. When shooting straight up bullets would land on and around his shooting shed and only leave a little dent in the pine wood. Interestingly the less stabilized boat tailed bullet would tumble and often hit side ways. The flat based bullet would not tumble at it's highest and would come down base first. Air resistance is why with most guns the longest distance is achieve at an elevation of around 30 to 35 degrees. It's only with guns that shoot large slow moving projectiles with less relative air resistance like mortars that the 45 degree angle gets the longest distance. Hatcher's Notebook is full of little gems like this. GC

 

[roundball]

OK... :grin: ...let's do it this way:

"All those who believe a lead ball fired into the air would not hurt their head if it fell back and hit them, please step forward and be counted to participate in the experiment"