How many Fs?

[longrifle89]

I have always shot FF in the main charge, with FFFF in the priming pan. In reading around, I have found that many people use FFF in both. Is there any noticeable difference in performance/accuracy? Are they better for different things?

Thanks.

 

[saber]

you will need to shoot each to see what works best. I shoot 3f in all my guns up to 54 cal rifled and smoothys and it works best for me

 

[Coot]

You did not say what you are shooting so only a 'general' guide can be offered. Some guns have a distinct preference for one granulation and some shooters have strong feelings about their personal shooting choices. There have been many posts about this and I will attempt a summary:

The finer granulations are faster to burn. Some can tell the difference in ignition between priming with 4f vs 3f but others cannot or feel that the difference is too slight to bother with a second priming powder and second horn and prime with the same powder as the main charge. Since 3f burns faster than 2f, main charges can be slightly reduced to obtain similar muzzle velocities giving a couple more shots per pound of powder. On the other hand, many shooting shot as opposed to round ball prefer the slightly slower 'push' from 2f and feel it gives a tighter pattern. Many consider 3f to be less fouling then 2f and prefer it for that reason; others swab between shots and consider it a non issue. An old guide was/is to use 3f in .50 and below and 2f in larger calibers. This works for me but others are perfectly happy shooting 3f in everything they have. There are no hard & fast rules here - it is a matter of determining what your gun likes (realizing that optimal target loads and hunting loads may be quite different) and how minimal in gear (some might say more period correct) that you prefer to be. Shooting BP is a wonderful thing - handloading with the option of trying many many options and variables.

 

[MikeChapin]

I use 3F in everything from .32 to .58. I have tried 2F in some of my rifles but didn't see much difference. Some rifles will show a preference. You will just have to try it and see if your rifle does.

 

[wy0mn]

I shot 3f for ignition & charge in a .40 Cub for years. The deer & squirrels didn't notice any difference in ignition speed.

 

[Richard Allen]

If you worked up loads using both 2f & 3f and the 2f worked out best for your rifle, why not just prime with 2f?

On the other hand, if you didn't try 3f, give it a try. You may find it results in better accuracy and less fouling left in the barrel.

I shoot a looser ball/patch combination than I used to due to an injury I sustained a few years ago that prevents me from being able to load the tighter combinations. I use Stumpy's Moose Snot lubed patches and find the tightest ball/patch combination I can load comfortably.

Then beginning with 3f (45 gr./45 cal.,50 gr./50 cal., etc.) , I shoot five shot groups at fifty yards increasing the charge by five grains until I get the tightest groups. Then changing only the powder, I repeat the above using 2f. So far I haven't found a 2f load that works better than 3f.

I load from the pouch, whether shooting line matches, woodswalks, or hunting, load and prime from the same horn, and use the hickory rammer in the pipes under the barrel to seat the ball/patch.

My shooting box and range rod stay at camp until I need them.

 

[roundball]

I always use 4F for priming because it faster than 3F, which is faster than 2F, and so on...doesn't matter to me if everyone can tell the difference in speed or not...for me I want all the speed I can get from every component in the ignition activity.

I also use 3F main whenever possible as its faster and cleaner burning for me than 2F, particularly at the range where I may shoot 40-50 shots in a trip.
I do have a couple of large caliber PRB loads where I use 2F to soften the recoil some as long as I still get good accuracy...

 

[Stumpkiller]

I use FFFg for both. Probably, if I was to sit and bench off 50 of each (4Fg prime vs. 3Fg prime) there would be a noticable cummulative difference as the speed reduces "wobbles". Though with me I may be wobbling back so it helps.

The difference in whether your rifle/bore/ball/powder volume/patch/lube combination prefers 3Fg vs. 2Fg is another matter. IMHO 3Fg leaves less crud, whether through more complete combustion or my own imagination I can't say. I can shoot more between wipes when using FFFg, generally, than I remember being the case when I used FFg. I have a .50 that prefers FFg and a .54 that prefers FFFg, so that is what I feed them.

For the flinter, and my own enjoyment, I find a single horn to be the easiest and most convenient. Less to lose, misplace or forget when heading out. I keep a small priming flask (two, actually) that I refill from the main horn as needed.

 

[Trench]

Try it all! I've had bad luck with 3f in anything but my .36.

 

[longrifle89]

I have a 29" 1:48 twist .50 caliber hawken. I will be getting a 42" .54 with a 1:70 twist. My inclination would be to think that 2F might be better for the longer barrel. I guess I'll have some experimenting to do in 6 months.

As far as priming, FFFFg has always treated me very well, and I think I'll stick with that.

 

[shootemup]

I use 4f because I have it, but have tried 3f and found it to work just fine for me.

:hatsoff:
Spot

 

[hanshi]

3f for the main charge is what I use in all my guns. On rare occasions I'll use 2f in the bigger ones but admittedly haven't tested for accuracy. I prime with 4f but if I give out at the range or in the field I'll use 3f to prime. I'm one of those who can't tell a difference. I know there is one but I'm just not sensitive enough to be aware of it.

 

[henry65]

I use 2f in the pan and charge it keeps things simple :thumbsup:

 

[Tom Compton]

2F in everything from .32 thru 12 ga (including pistols and revolvers) for the main charge - Two different chronograph tests of >100 rounds ea 20+ years ago showed it to be more consistent.

4F to prime only because I haven't run out of 4F yet. When I get low I will get some 7F to prime.

TC

 

[loki04]

Sir,

If 3F burns better/faster/cleaner than 2F, than why stop at 3F? could there be a noticeable difference or an economic reason to shoot 4F in both the priming pan and the main charge? I was of the understanding that 4F and 3F were comparable in price per pound, so unless there either no difference in performance, or a decrease in performance going from 3F to 4F, why not use 4F. I have never tried 4F, but unless the smaller grain size does something I am not expecting (maybe ignition in the main charge is not as even due to less space between the grains?,) why limit ourselves to 3F? Especially as it sounds that the finer the grade, the faster the ignition and the more force for a given charge volume, which to me translates as being able to use less powder per shot for the same velocities as 2F or 3F charges, which means more shots per pound of bp

Loki

 

[roundball]

When using a few grns of 4F in an open pan, its not 'contained', there is no dangerous pressure build-up, etc.

But the burn rate of a fine granulation like 4F is so fast and the pressure spike jumps up so quickly when contained in a closed bore that if a certain amount was used for a main charge it could result in a pipe bomb effect....not so with the slower 3F / 2F granulations.

As a result, 4F is not recommended for use as a main powder charge.

 

[CaptainKirk]

Since I shoot Pyrodex most of the time, I normally use RS (which is the equivalent of 2F), but several times have run out while at the range :grin: and have had to substitute a lesser charge of P (EQ of 3F) and noticed little difference. Shoot whichever your gun prefers.

 

[eod4647]

I have no practical experience with flintlocks (yet) so I can really comment. But I was wondering what was used "back in the day"? Was there a difference between the powder used as a main charge and priming? Was it of a similar granulation as today's 2F/3F/4F? When I had some cap and ball revolvers and a percusiion CVA KY rifle in high school, I think I just used 3F.
But this topic got me wondering about what was used in the Revolutionary war era nd the fur trade era. Bottom line, seems to be whatever works best for your gun, as well as what you happen to have. Hope to have a flintlock later this year, either a kit from TOTW or something from TVM.

Chris

 

[Jason Lewis]

i think something like our 2F was most common in the 18th century. we don't use 4F because it burns too quickly and causes too much of a rapid pressure spike. bad juu juu. just like bat no hit curve ball, gun barrel no burn 4F. feel free to sacrifice a bucket of chicken at your leisure.

 

[Bob J]

A friend of mine who worked at Colonial Williamsburg told me that there were basically two grades of powder; musket powder for large calibers like the Brown Bess and fowlers(roughly equiv. to 2f) and rifle powder (roughly 3f).