How Reliable Are Muzzleloaders?

[Dave Rosenthal]

If you've never had a bad primer on factory ammo that necessitated a second hammer strike to determine same, then you've shot a lot less than you say you have. Just last Thursday night at our Youth Small Bore League one of the kids had a bad primer on a well-struck .22LR.

Once a ML plinker cleans up his act, and stops making GOOP at the breech by starting with a truly CLEAN gun, THEN ignition problems are far and few apart! Changing over from #11 caps to musket caps is usually an excuse for POOR CLEANING OR INEPT STORAGE TECHNIQUES!

A CLEAN gun in serviceable condition will always go BANG, provided the ignition sequence starts. Now THAT'S RELIABILITY! Case in point is the gun loaded since the CW can still go BANG!

Dave

 

[David W.]

I think the better Question should be, "How good are YOU at making a muzzleloader reliable?"

I think anyone who says muzzleloaders are reliable needs to admit that they have dry balled, or had a bad cap, or a flash in the pan, loose flint, dull flint, didn't clean the oil in the bore before loading, rain hit the prime, wind blew prime out (plus a few other variables I left out), at least on rare occasion. Reliable for the most part comes to mind. I've been shooting for more years than I care to admit and can't count on all my fingers AND toes, the number of miss fires I've had. Either I'm just bad at it, or some are exagerating a wee bit.

 

[Josh Smith]

If you've never had a bad primer on factory ammo that necessitated a second hammer strike to determine same, then you've shot a lot less than you say you have. Just last Thursday night at our Youth Small Bore League one of the kids had a bad primer on a well-struck .22LR.

Once a ML plinker cleans up his act, and stops making GOOP at the breech by starting with a truly CLEAN gun, THEN ignition problems are far and few apart! Changing over from #11 caps to musket caps is usually an excuse for POOR CLEANING OR INEPT STORAGE TECHNIQUES!

A CLEAN gun in serviceable condition will always go BANG, provided the ignition sequence starts. Now THAT'S RELIABILITY! Case in point is the gun loaded since the CW can still go BANG!

Dave

Dave,

I really should have said "with the stuff I shoot now, I don't have misfires." I've had my share, believe me.

Just didn't want to delve into smokeless aspects on a blackpowder board.

I'll shoot you a private topic if you'd like outlining my ammo screening experiences, though we've likely all done something similar and it would make for boring reading.

Now, as for the caps... I shoot #10, #11, and musket. I have nipples for all of them. I do prefer the musket cap as it's easier to handle in cold weather.

However, I use a crude capper I made from leather for the #10 and #11 caps. I keep it on a piece of leather that is on the trigger guard of my KY rifle. The other end of the leather goes between the hammer and nipple to seal it from the elements.

When I pull it to half-cock, the capper is freed and ready for immediate use on the nipple. Good alternative to carrying capped in the woods.

Josh

 

[Vaino]

Even though some have experienced rare misfires w/ CFs, many more misfires are related to MLers judging from all the posts on this and other forums. To start, there's a lot of "crappy Mlers" and components on the market and some, irregardless of all the precautions that are taken, will never produce reliable shooting. Shooting Mlers, especially flintlocks, is a fairly complicated procedure {vs CFs} and if some "necessary steps" are overlooked, the result is faulty operation. A lot of the problems arise after say, the 5th, 6th or more continuous shots.... because of the nature of BP, the specifics of how well the MLer is designed and the preventive measures used when reloading. There's a lot of variation among BP shooters as to what is req'd for reliabilty, whether it be cleaning after every shot or to those that only clean when loading gets difficult. Shooting one shot from a thoroughly cleaned MLer is not a "test" as to it's reliablity....functioning after many shots is......Fred

 

[luieb45]

Have you shot the Remington 22 thunder bolt ammunition lately? I used this round in my .22 last year because I wanted less meat damage on rabbits and squirrels. I'd say 1 out of 20 won't fire. And it always happened when I had a rabbit spotted at about 25 yards sitting still... click. Then when I use the cheap federal ammo it goes bang every time and is plenty accurate. My muzzleloaders are much more reliable than this.

 

[luieb45]

I've never read any posts from you in the hunting forum, do you deer hunt? From my experience with my Thompson Center Renegade(very close to your New Englander) if I clean it properly each night with soap and water, clean out the oil with rubbing alcohol an hour after, then fire a cap before I go sit in the morning and pick the nipple, load with black powder it's as reliable as ever.(knock on wood :haha

 

[Josh Smith]

Have you shot the Remington 22 thunder bolt ammunition lately? I used this round in my .22 last year because I wanted less meat damage on rabbits and squirrels. I'd say 1 out of 20 won't fire. And it always happened when I had a rabbit spotted at about 25 yards sitting still... click. Then when I use the cheap federal ammo it goes bang every time and is plenty accurate. My muzzleloaders are much more reliable than this.

I no longer use Remington anything. I had two of their "Golden Bullet" rounds where they seemingly left out all priming compound. I literally had the rims smashed up with the firing pin trying to find just a bit of priming... nothing.

Didn't have much luck with Federal either, though it is better than Remington.

For rimfire, CCI products get the nod. While I'm sure I must have had a misfire somewhere along the way with it, I sure don't remember it!

Josh

 

[kelleyjk]

Have you shot the Remington 22 thunder bolt ammunition lately? I used this round in my .22 last year because I wanted less meat damage on rabbits and squirrels. I'd say 1 out of 20 won't fire. And it always happened when I had a rabbit spotted at about 25 yards sitting still... click. Then when I use the cheap federal ammo it goes bang every time and is plenty accurate. My muzzleloaders are much more reliable than this.

Ive stopped using Remington .22RF for this very reason, even their higher grade stuff has been craptacular as of late.

Too much wax, not enough primer, I can run through 500 rds a weekend easy and Ive switched to Winchester and Federal but still, out of 500 I may get 1 or 2 fail to fire, and half of those I'll hit again in a different spot and they'll fire.

I had a Remington #11 cap fail to fire last year, looked like all the primer fell out.

 

[larry wv]

Rim fire .22s have some misfires. CF ammo once in awhile before I learned not to trust one brand. Black powder is only as reliable as the guy behind the butt plate. Kind of a learning curve from some misfires to almost 100 % reliability. BUT I will still take a CF if I know my life is on the line. :redface: Larry

 

[Pete Gaimari]

Rim fire .22s have some misfires. CF ammo once in awhile before I learned not to trust one brand. Black powder is only as reliable as the guy behind the butt plate. Kind of a learning curve from some misfires to almost 100 % reliability. BUT I will still take a CF if I know my life is on the line. :redface: Larry

I agree, but i'll add only with my reloads.

 

[David W.]

I've never read any posts from you in the hunting forum, do you deer hunt? From my experience with my Thompson Center Renegade(very close to your New Englander) if I clean it properly each night with soap and water, clean out the oil with rubbing alcohol an hour after, then fire a cap before I go sit in the morning and pick the nipple, load with black powder it's as reliable as ever.(knock on wood :haha

Listen to Luie, he'll learn ya something!

Way to go Luie, before you know it, you'll be an old, ahem....young pro! :hatsoff:

 

[David W.]

Rim fire .22s have some misfires. CF ammo once in awhile before I learned not to trust one brand. Black powder is only as reliable as the guy behind the butt plate. Kind of a learning curve from some misfires to almost 100 % reliability. BUT I will still take a CF if I know my life is on the line. :redface: Larry

Ditto!

 

[Golfswithwolves]

As to the reliability of muzzleloaders vs. modern guns (suppository shooters?) I can offer a hunting tale. I was hunting pheasants with my good pal, who was using his Remington Model 870 pump-action shotgun. I was using my Northwest Trade smoothbore flintlock. For some reason his reliable Model 870 broke during the hunt and was useless until he got it to a gunsmith for repairs. My flintlock trade gun continued to function reliably with no misfires for the rest of the day.

 

[Pete Gaimari]

It could have gone the other the way too.

I did trap shooting in the 70's and made a pretty good living at it. I don't know how many thousands of rounds I shot, but I never broke, or had a misfire.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Federal is the favorite ammo. Our Youth Small Bore League goes through a CASE (2,000 rounds) every 5 weeks. Always goes BANG in all sorts of guns, and lots of them are older than you (the rifles that is) :haha: . Easy on the clean-up too :wink: .

Keep up the good work! :thumbsup:

Dave

 

[rabjr]

Yep, I prefer Federal .22's myself. I've been trying to remember misfires in my CF's and having trouble doing so. Since the early 80's I've reloaded for most of the guns I shoot the most and never experianced any failure do to any reloading componant. Course I'm very picky too which might be why. I have experianced some misques with old military ammo and it seems to me I had a few problems with PMC ammo a time or two, years ago. :idunno:

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

If you've never had a bad primer on factory ammo that necessitated a second hammer strike to determine same, then you've shot a lot less than you say you have. Just last Thursday night at our Youth Small Bore League one of the kids had a bad primer on a well-struck .22LR.

Once a ML plinker cleans up his act, and stops making GOOP at the breech by starting with a truly CLEAN gun, THEN ignition problems are far and few apart! Changing over from #11 caps to musket caps is usually an excuse for POOR CLEANING OR INEPT STORAGE TECHNIQUES!

A CLEAN gun in serviceable condition will always go BANG, provided the ignition sequence starts. Now THAT'S RELIABILITY! Case in point is the gun loaded since the CW can still go BANG!

Dave

Dave,

I really should have said "with the stuff I shoot now, I don't have misfires." I've had my share, believe me.

Just didn't want to delve into smokeless aspects on a blackpowder board.

I'll shoot you a private topic if you'd like outlining my ammo screening experiences, though we've likely all done something similar and it would make for boring reading.

Now, as for the caps... I shoot #10, #11, and musket. I have nipples for all of them. I do prefer the musket cap as it's easier to handle in cold weather.

However, I use a crude capper I made from leather for the #10 and #11 caps. I keep it on a piece of leather that is on the trigger guard of my KY rifle. The other end of the leather goes between the hammer and nipple to seal it from the elements.

When I pull it to half-cock, the capper is freed and ready for immediate use on the nipple. Good alternative to carrying capped in the woods.

Josh

Since I use the TDC "teardrop" with CCI #11 Magnum caps with a piece of leather for a "necklace", I don't EVER have to handle caps. And when I'm in a hurry at the firing line, I can snap a cap every second & 1/2 if I put my mind to it. Since the teardrop holds almost a whole tin of caps, I only open cap tins on my kitchen table, when reloading the capper :wink: . When reloading the capper, you get to look down inside all of the caps to check to see if priming compound is indeed in each cap, so that's never an issue either. And the capper protects the caps in all sorts of weather :wink: .

Dave

 

[Zonie]

Folks: Please stop discussing modern cartridge brands etc.

I know the subject is how reliable are muzzleloaders and we need something to compare them against but this is a Muzzleloading Forum not a Cartridge Forum.

 

[ebiggs1]

And this proves......what? :hmm:

 

[Josh Smith]

And this proves......what? :hmm:

Nothing... just something I was curious about.

Josh