hunting bullets

[LRB]

Cody, as far as I'm concerned you can park anywhere you want, just don't bring Harv with you, one of us might be tempted to run over him with one of our iron wheeled tractors or draw and quarter him with a team of our plow horses.

 

[LRB]

Acually I'm starting to like ol Harv. He's fun to poke at and may not be too bad a sort in his own twisted way. He does have the grit to bite back.

 

I think I am almost done here. Its fun stirring up the pile but I think some of you don't like it. My hunting/shooting stile doesn't fit with most of you and thats fine with me. I like all the new stuff and am always looking to improve my accuracy and extend my range. My "magnum" rifle is a tuned up 270 win. Shoots 1/2" groups at 100yards, 5 shots into 4" at 500 yards, 6-7" at 700 yards. Plenty good enough for deer at that range. Haven't shot one at that range but am ready if I need to. Won't pull the trigger unless conditions are right. Some muzzle guns make a foot or bigger group at 100 yards. A gun like that wouldn't be good enough for a 100 yard shot at a deer in my books. Most of you would probably agree and keep shots under that range. If thats what you like than do it. I can't remember the last time the deer I shot at didn't make it into the freezer. In the 20+ years I have been hunting big game I can count on one hand the number of aninals I have shot at that I didn't get. When it comes to the record book you will never see my name in one. I hunt to eat and will take a nice doe just as soon as a buck. Its all hunting and we should try to stick together to keep the sport alive.

 

[tg]

Most of my shots are less thgan 50yds ..half the fun of the hunt is getting within that range, there are two worlds of hunting we have been talking about the modern, long range, highly efficient projectile/sight type and the world of the sub 100 yds patched RB with fixed sights type. the in-lines are much closer to the former thus the resistance from the users of the latter to have them in ML seasons, the evolution amd developement, and improvement of the ML gun happened a long tiome ago and the result was the cartridge gun. There are definitly to strongly opposed camps on this one and probably always will be,

 

[Allan]

Hey Harv,
If your shooting a gun that puts holes a foot apart at 100 yrds, something is very wrong.
I'm a new blackpowder shooter. I have put about 300 rounds of .50 cal PRB through my Pedersoli Frontier flinter w/grade 5 maple. Last weekend, the first four rounds out the barrel are touching each other about 1 inch high of dead center at 80 yrds. Stiched right across the top.
Try it Harv, nothing else is like it and you are missing out big time.
I will probably not bother shooting anything else.
Although the wood did not help my aim, it sure looks sweet. People say this rifle does not look like any historic rifles. They have never seen the beautiful work of Albrecht, Reedy, Palm, et.al. from the old pennsyvania days. The Frontier is almost exactly the same shape.

 

[tg]

. "People say this rifle does not look like any historic rifles. They have never seen the beautiful work of Albrecht, Reedy, Palm, et.al. from the old pennsyvania days. The Frontier is almost exactly the same shape." I assume you are speaking of the Pedorsoli gun, which is raher popular and well priced for a production gun but they are in no way a replica of any particular school they do share the lines and some features of some of the late flintlock guns from a couple of schools but are very "generic" (not to be read bad) the Pedorsoli people usually claim their guns are from the "Golden Age" of the longrifle and date this from 1760-1840 a bit of research will shed some educational light on that statement, there is only one surviving example of an Albrecth gun and it is nothing like the Frontier these guns are good entry level longrifles but should in no way be considered "replicas" in the sense that the Chambers, TOW kits, and even the TVM offerings are, they are not much more correct than the TC Hawken is a replica of the guns made famous by the brothers from St. Louis though the Pedorsoli guns are a click above as far as being PC. once again I am not condeming these guns but they should be put in perspective as to their closeness to the originals and there is much more than general shape to consider. If my humble opinion is not worth its weight in powder there are some well read longtime builders who will undoubtedly concur with the above.btw I have a "Hatfiled" type gun that is a great shooter and much like some of the Cabelas/Pedorsoli guns but not quite in the replica class, and I just accept it for what it is, it is eaier in the long run to do so.

 

[musketman]

quote:Originally posted by Harv:
I think I am almost done here.HARV:
You are not thinking of leaving this forum are you?

It sounds like you are.

I have one question for you and your long shots, do Canadians use Kentucky Windage?

 

[tg]

I think those who will not embrace the guns of old are the losers in the long run, there is so much more out there in the world of primitive guns, I hold no personal dislikes for them but have little respect for any liberaly distorted views/interpretations and loophole using...you wouldn't believe some of the e-mail that comes my way from folks who would not share their venom on a forum... like water offen the back of a duck, as I tune up a flinter for a high they will never know.

 

[Allan]

Hey TG,
While rooting around the internet I found out your Hatfield and the Pedersoli Frontier are almost the same rifle. Pedersoli bought the rights to produce the rifle from Hatfield himself. I was lucky enough to shoot with someone who had a Hatfield and we were able to do a side by side comparison. The only differences were his land/groove dimension was much, much greater, don't know how he even gets patches to seal, and the brown finish on the barrels was different. The Hatfield being more like brown paint. I know it's not a replica, as such, but certainly has the same look and feel as many rifles from the "Golden Era".
I was refering to Kauffmans "Penn. and Kentuck. Rifles". as my reference.

 

[tg]

There is no doubt a similarity between the Hatfield/Frontiers and some of the originals mostly some of the Lehighs circa 1800, but when one starts looking closely at the details of the type of sideplates, buttplates, trigger guards, line of axis used to lay out the stock, types/styles of carving and so forth that make a Lehigh a Lehigh and a Lancaster a Lancaster most of the production level guns come up on the generic side of the fence so to speak. which is fine, my post was not meant to insult, infuriate or put down these guns just a note on how close they are to the originals... I feel this is important for those who wish to be as correct as possible, it is always best to study the originals then decide at what level between out in left field and an exact replica of an exact gun one wished to be. I have seen many post that these were "good" for the F&I period most students of 18th century guns would disagree. I certainly liked mine I haven't shot it for a couple of years and a friend stopped by and took it off my hands today, as always it is hard to let go of a gun that has served you well but then it leaves an opening on the wall for something else...

 

[musketman]

I let a few go that I realy didn't feel good about.

Some, I was happy to get rid of.

Each muzzleloader has it's own personality.

 

[LRB]

Seriously Harv, don't leave, we will have to find someone else to pick on. If Canada does not have a ML only season then at least you are on equal terms with everyone else. I just think you are missing out on real muzzleloading. New challanges are good for the body and spirit. What is your load for the .270. Mine will do 3/8" consistantly. I believe it would do 1/4" with a better scope. I have never killed anything with it, but may try it one day, just for the hell of it. I have never killed a deer with a scoped rifle.

 

Started this years muzzle deer season on Sat. Drove down to a hay field when light enough to see about 500 yards. This field has a heavy tree row on the north side so I parked north of the trees and sat in the trees looking south. Than I started counting deer. Over 40 on just under a 1/4 secton field. Good wind out of the west so a long shot was not to happen. Shouldn't be a problem with this many deer. Didn't take long for one to come into range and stop to eat at 83 yards. Hit her with a 300g Hornady SST bullet. She stumbled, took about 10 steps and fell. Dad and I went to clean her up. Bullet just touched the shoulder on the way in, turned the lungs into jelly, and exited leaving a 3 inch hole. Short day but enjoyed it and deer is in the cooler.

 

[weasel]

Harv
so you recomend the 300 gr sst ? I try and turn people that way myself. the hornady xtp 240 gr while a great bullet in a handgun is not meant for the speeds capable in an inline rifle.
congrats on the low cholesterol venison
weasel

 

[Alaska-Bush-Man]

I have two approaches too Muzzleloading, in my safe I two J.B. Mountain Rifle's in 50 and 54 cal and a T/C Big Boar 58 cal. and then I have a Knight MK 85 Predator 54 Cal scoped.

My most enjoyment comes from sidelock's using Maxi-Ball or Ballet's, seems it's more like hunting with a BlackPowder Rifle.

 

[musketman]

quote:Originally posted by Alaska-Bush-Man:
My most enjoyment comes from sidelock's using Maxi-Ball or Ballet's, seems it's more like hunting with a BlackPowder Rifle. If you think that's fun, try it with a patched round ball... (Just think of the patch as a kind of "cloth sabot")

Real black powder and round balls will put you right in the thick of muzzleloading traditions.

 

[Zonie]

Alaska-Bush-Man: Noted this was your first post so welcome to the Forum! Hope to hear more from you.

 

[RJR]

Alaska-bush-man, PRB is all you would need in your sidelocks, they have plenty of power to down anything you have up there. In my younger and dumber days I hunted Grizzly with a .50 and PRB in NWT and scored three. All you have to do is place your shot well (or you're lunch). Take care, Rick.

 

[Gray Beard]

Wow! I just finished ready the whole discussion and it reminded me of the time when Bob Dole was asked if he used boxers or briefs. Bob responded "Depends." I'm going to keep my prefered projectile hidden down my barrel so that no one will see. Then no one can pin a label on me.

 

[musketman]

quote:Originally posted by Gray Beard:
I'm going to keep my prefered projectile hidden down my barrel so that no one will see.Don't do that, we still have the freedom of speach...

Say it loudly, "I USE SABOTS!"

The sabots is not a new concept, cannons of the Civil War used them to hold things like grape shot, chains, nails, ect...

Of course they were not plastic back then, they were made of wood.

Some people get a little hot under the collar reguarding sabots, but let them, high blood pressure keeps everyone warm in the winter...