India Barrel Failure

[Commodore Swab]

Many forum members propose that our moderators terminate this pointless pooping competition immediately !!

Like most ML gunsmiths, we all can recall numerous component faults & failures that have surfaced with even upper end
firearm manufacturers.
Few firearms are fault free, we just fix & improve em & move on...

Closing the topic typically allows those that claim Indian built guns to be dangerous to have the last say. In this case they have used a failed barrel from a different company in an attempt to describe the quality of unrelated competitors. This only serves to hurt businesses that have been selling guns for decades without problems.

I think it's best to allow their views to be questioned rather than locked.

 

[FlinterNick]

Closing the topic typically allows those that claim Indian built guns to be dangerous to have the last say. In this case they have used a failed barrel from a different company in an attempt to describe the quality of unrelated competitors. This only serves to hurt businesses that have been selling guns for decades without problems.

I think it's best to allow their views to be questioned rather than locked.

Well if you sell guns you actually need sell them when you accept payment, so business’ hurt themselves by doing just bad business. You certainly wouldn’t know anything about that

 

[tenngun]

Well if you sell guns you actually need sell them when you accept payment, so business’ hurt themselves by doing just bad business. You certainly wouldn’t know anything about that

Except when a false statement is spread about guns that are safe and functional and as close to the originals in looks as perdisoli
The locks function, fit and finish is acceptable and refinishing is easy
But the best you can afford, but don’t look down on Chevys from your Rolls

 

[FlinterNick]

Except when a false statement is spread about guns that are safe and functional and as close to the originals in looks as perdisoli
The locks function, fit and finish is acceptable and refinishing is easy
But the best you can afford, but don’t look down on Chevys from your Rolls

Oh I’m not talking about safety I’m talking about grifting people. Kinda hard to worry about safety when your gun is never delivered.

 

[Relic shooter]

Yes this is correct, we don’t have proof laws, not sure what that has to do with an Indian barrel failing a proof test. As I’ve said, it’s just one barrel, and most are probably safe to shoot, I’ve said this over and over add-nauseam. The only take away from this failed proof test is quality control which the write of the article described as a lack of information to rely upon. If an American barrel failed a proof test, it is know where it is made, what steel is used and the process it was made with…. You simply do not know that with this gun that failed a proof test, it’s a dead end.

Now in the USA proof testing isn’t required but there are legal standards which can mean unfounded liabilities. For example, if some hack gunsmith decides to stick weld on under lugs to a colerain barrel and it explodes well, he was the last one to work on that barrel, and could pay a heavy price. Some companies in the USA privately proof test, some gun owners have their guns proof tested.

Proof testing will be here soon enough, with all the crazy laws changing in places like NY and CA, i wouldn’t bet its coming soon.

Unconstitutional aniti-American States like Ca., NY, Cuba & the legal weasel dictators that run them should not be allowed to generate any laws or regulations that are valid beyond their borders.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

Well, I hope they dont build Barrels like they Drive...

 

[Rudyard]

Well, I hope they dont build Barrels like they Drive...

Drivers just run into a mele at Junctions & devil take the hindermost .Road rules ? "We done need no estickin road rules! "(In Hindi) The city roads had bitumin but between the mats of traders the numbers of ricksha s Trooping Bullocks, or Camel carts , plus the then inevitable Austin Prince's It was all on .blow the horn ring the bell & aim for a gap. sort of sums it up .We hired a car to go up to see some 'Ex Rulers"Down by Nagod he got into a prang so we left him & got another Taxi the dealer carried a 36 cal Webley in a Rexine holster in case of rural Dacoit's Bandits they couldn't have 455 or the 38 as these where govt bore but the 36 was deemed' NP bore ' 'Non Prohibited '' See the fun!' is how they put it . Rudyard's ramblings .

 

[DixieTexian]

Oak ?

Old bathtubs, I believe.

 

[Coinneach]

Many forum members propose that our moderators terminate this pointless pooping competition immediately !!

Like most ML gunsmiths, we all can recall numerous component faults & failures that have surfaced with even upper end
firearm manufacturers.
Few firearms are fault free, we just fix & improve em & move on...

"Many forum members".......Many ?

I and many others are following this thread with interest, so obviously its alive and still kicking, some of us own and still use Indian made ML's hence our interest in this thread.

Seriously, if you dont want to read the content why follow it, rather than demand this thread be closed down ?

 

[Coinneach]

Drivers just run into a mele at Junctions & devil take the hindermost .Road rules ? "We done need no estickin road rules! "(In Hindi) The city roads had bitumin but between the mats of traders the numbers of ricksha s Trooping Bullocks, or Camel carts , plus the then inevitable Austin Prince's It was all on .blow the horn ring the bell & aim for a gap. sort of sums it up .We hired a car to go up to see some 'Ex Rulers"Down by Nagod he got into a prang so we left him & got another Taxi the dealer carried a 36 cal Webley in a Rexine holster in case of rural Dacoit's Bandits they couldn't have 455 or the 38 as these where govt bore but the 36 was deemed' NP bore ' 'Non Prohibited '' See the fun!' is how they put it . Rudyard's ramblings .

Some time ago I read that the old Brit Webley revolver is still being reproduced in India in .36 cal, personally I believe that theyre a superb peice particularly in .455/475 Brit calibre, although I'd prefer the .45 Colt ("Long Colt") if I had the choice.

 

[Commodore Swab]

"Many forum members".......Many ?

I and many others are following this thread with interest, so obviously its alive and still kicking, some of us own and still use Indian made ML's hence our interest in this thread.

Seriously, if you dont want to read the content why follow it, rather than demand this thread be closed down ?

The option is to pull it off topic. Here we are pages into it and the discussion is still on topic.

 

[tenngun]

India has a long tradition of high quality metal work. Good bet they invented Damascus steel
I used to build ship models. I can turn out a plain gun in a hundred and fifty hours. And my work is second best for sure. A ship model is more like five hundred hours, for a rather plain working ship.
India supplies premade models. In wood. Perfect detailed rigging.
Mostly made by women in India who work with magic fingers and compleat in a few days what that’s me months
I see videos of the gun shops with boys doing work with an economy of movement that amazing.
If you ever seen a video of Kibler working or Rabby your amazed at what they can do with nonchalant movements that are just perfect. The Indian workers are almost as good. They are amazing craftsmen
Yes they are working with incorrect wood and leave the guns too bulky
Think of there guns as a second rate kit, that you can shoot out of the box or spend a weekend reworking and do a finish on you can have a very good gun
I got mine from loyalist arms. Gun came in one box lock in another.
The lock fit the mortise on a fit I have never got.
And el cheapo lock dropped sparks on the floor when I tested it
Ramrods are crap
There is nothing else I could complain about
Yes I spent an afternoon removing extea wood
I wanted a painted stock and the wood would not accept milk paint
I ended up using an acrylic paint then oil over that
The gun shoots as center as any of my better smoothies
And I can stick it in my rack next to my other and be proud of it

 

[FlinterNick]

India has a long tradition of high quality metal work. Good bet they invented Damascus steel
I used to build ship models. I can turn out a plain gun in a hundred and fifty hours. And my work is second best for sure. A ship model is more like five hundred hours, for a rather plain working ship.
India supplies premade models. In wood. Perfect detailed rigging.
Mostly made by women in India who work with magic fingers and compleat in a few days what that’s me months
I see videos of the gun shops with boys doing work with an economy of movement that amazing.
If you ever seen a video of Kibler working or Rabby your amazed at what they can do with nonchalant movements that are just perfect. The Indian workers are almost as good. They are amazing craftsmen
Yes they are working with incorrect wood and leave the guns too bulky
Think of there guns as a second rate kit, that you can shoot out of the box or spend a weekend reworking and do a finish on you can have a very good gun
I got mine from loyalist arms. Gun came in one box lock in another.
The lock fit the mortise on a fit I have never got.
And el cheapo lock dropped sparks on the floor when I tested it
Ramrods are manure
There is nothing else I could complain about
Yes I spent an afternoon removing extea wood
I wanted a painted stock and the wood would not accept milk paint
I ended up using an acrylic paint then oil over that
The gun shoots as center as any of my better smoothies
And I can stick it in my rack next to my other and be proud of it

Indian made barrels are not Damascus steel, they’re probably made of melted down shipwrecks.

Nobody really knows what they’re made of, while i think they’re 98% ok, having the information on what steels they’re made of and how they’re heated treated if required would be appreciated in this topic.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

Ok..Ok... All joking aside if its what makes you happy then pursue it.
If I were to go down the Road I would just get a Kiber.
Minmal work with a great support base for parts.
Everyone has their nische on what makes them Happy.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

I wonder what kind of barrel steel you would get from melted down RR Rails?
I understand it is basalt steel.

 

[tenngun]

Indian made barrels are not Damascus steel, they’re probably made of melted down shipwrecks.

Nobody really knows what they’re made of, while i think they’re 98% ok, having the information on what steels they’re made of and how they’re heated treated if required would be appreciated in this topic.

No they are not, only pointed out the long history of fine iron and steel work from India
However any safe charge up to a double load with a load set on the charge and no obstruction in the barrel, that’s kept clean they won’t blow.
And there is no reliable evidence any ever did

 

[tenngun]

Ok..Ok... All joking aside if its what makes you happy then pursue it.
If I were to go down the Road I would just get a Kiber.
Minmal work with a great support base for parts.
Everyone has their nische on what makes them Happy.

That’s great, but Kibler doesn’t offer a century worth of bess or Charley options. No match locks, I don’t know of anyone else offering dog lock, or Potsdam or Calvary carbines or see service besses, or early English trade guns
Kibler is the best kit you can get, but choices for all of our best makers are limited

 

[FlinterNick]

No they are not, only pointed out the long history of fine iron and steel work from India
However any safe charge up to a double load with a load set on the charge and no obstruction in the barrel, that’s kept clean they won’t blow.
And there is no reliable evidence any ever did

I’m not sure why the history of Indian steel has anything to do with the quality of steel in Indian made barrels, they’re made of what they’re made of that and that’s that, the history of the country is kinda menusha in this topic.

,

 

[FlinterNick]

I wonder what kind of barrel steel you would get from melted down RR Rails?
I understand it is basalt steel.

Recycled steel qualities is a very interesting topic for another pod. The process of melting down steel from other sources is much more complicated than it seems, that is if your goal is to produce a good product, otherwise pot metal is pot metal, a lot of the best qualities get burned away and impurities can be a problem. All it takes is a small amount of copper and aluminum to get mixed into a batch, to make a brittle alloy. I certainly wouldn’t want a gun barrel made of recycled steel. Melting down say 4140 from scrap or 4130 is ok i guess, but not sure.

 

[FlinterNick]

Ok..Ok... All joking aside if its what makes you happy then pursue it.
If I were to go down the Road I would just get a Kiber.
Minmal work with a great support base for parts.
Everyone has their nische on what makes them Happy.

I’ve always echoed this. For the money and additional costs put into Indian guns, you could get a much better quality muzzle loader from Kibler. I second that. You’ll also get a lot o support from Jim himself.