Is it uncool to use Pyrodex?

[earlwb]

What's this "4473 for ammo purchase in 2024"? I'm fairly well versed in firearm law and upcoming changes and current litigation. Sometimes proposed changes to law slips by me. That said, I have heard no rumors in reference to this on a Federal level till today. Was this meant as a joke and my sarcasm meter is just broken today?

I am concerned with what they have put in that humongous 1.7 trillion dollar budget bill they just passed. More than 4,000 pages of spending like crazy. It just might be in that thing.

 

[ColonialRifleSmith]

i don't really like Pyrodex. I never have, BUT when it was free, or when it was all I could get, I used it. I've also used Triple 7. Both have idiosyncrasies I had to deal with, so I developed "tricks", like putting seven grains of 3f black powder down the bore ahead of the substitute BP charge, cleaning immediately after using Pyrodex, dealing with the crud ring Triple 7 makes. Some day, somebody will come up with something else that has all the performance characteristics of black powder but none of the drawbacks. i suppose if that is all that is available, I will start using it.

If you are shooting a flintlock, it won't work. If you are shooting a traditional caplock, it might work.... perhaps with some adjustments. If you got an inline, it'll probably work just fine, ditto with an underhammer gun.

Is Pyrodex uncool? Who cares?! If it works for you, go ahead and use it. I have long "sat" at the "uncool" table. The cool kids became yuppies and do not know which way to point a muzzleloader and probably never saw one. None of them would be able to find their way around my smithy or even do simple woodworking to make a functional table.

Jesus, Galileo, Da Vinci, Einstein and Hawking never sat with the cool kids. i figure us uncool ones are in good company.

'nuf said. Dale said everything I was going to say. Saved me some typin'. It's only uncool if you think it's uncool. Who cares what the other guy thinks. Semper Fi.

 

[MSW]

i usually try to avoid being overly introspective about such things, but i would hazard that if you are worried about being "cool" or "uncool," and this works down to the level of what powder you're firing, you might be at the range for the wrong reasons...

use what works best for you: if subs are all that you can reasonably get, or if subs give you some advantage over real black powder, then by all means go with that ... after all you're the one who supposed to having fun here - not the guy standing next to you on the firing line.

 

[Sun City]

Buy BP BY THE CASE from Powder Inc! Delivered to your door!

Problem solved!

 

[Okie Hog]

They then cut the Potassium Nitrate by about half, using Potassium Perchlorate, so that Pyrodex is roughly 35% Potassium Nitrate, 35% Potassium Perchlorate, 20% Sulfur, and 10% charcoal, give or take again, particular formulas. The Potassium Perchlorate (Material Safety Data Sheets won't give the exact formula, as those are trade secrets)

There are other ingredients. According to the original patent Pyrodex contains:

45 potassium nitrate

9 charcoal

6 sulfur

19 potassium perchlorate

11 sodium benzoate

6 dicyandiamide

4 dextrin

1 additional percent of water is mentioned.

The potassium perchlorate boosts the power of the mix. All the black powder substitutes contain potassium perchlorate.

 

[Okie Hog]

Buy BP BY THE CASE from Powder Inc! Delivered to your door!

In some jurisdictions that would get one jailed.

 

[david w]

In some jurisdictions that would get one jailed.

I believe Powder, Inc knows where not to ship.

 

[david w]

This is my opinion, yours may vary. I prefer black powder, but have use Pyrodex once. It did no harm to my gun. Of course, I was shooting percussion at the time.

 

[Okie Hog]

I believe Powder, Inc knows where not to ship.

Yes, no doubt they do. Other black powder suppliers not so much.

 

[Omahkapi'si]

Just shoot and have fun.

 

[Ohio Rusty]

I only had one pound and a half of GOEX 2F. I have been shooting my .48 caliber flintlock longrifle with 35 grains of 2F and 35 grains of Pyrodex Select on top of the blackpowder. It shoots perfectly with this duplex load and really helps extend my real blackpowder. I have been shooting pyrodex for more than 20 years and I have never had any issues or misfires. I'm happy to have both kinds of powder for my shooting pleasure.

 

[Stantheman86]

Before I "knew better" when I got back into BP shooting, I shot a lot of Pyrodex through revolvers and T/C side locks , it was easy to grab a bottle of Pyrodex RS, a box of balls and a tin of caps at a Bass Pro and go shooting. It's still easy to do this

My friend has probably 4 Pietta cap and ballers, he's not a fanatic like most of us or a purist, and he shoots nothing but Pyrodex through them and who am I to tell him differently. It works and he has fun. He cleans the guns thoroughly. It's not like he needs Swiss to blast tree stumps or coffee cans on his property

Pyrodex is more forgiving in cap and ballers because they're basically revolving in-lines , if it works , load up and blast away

My only big gripe with Pyro is if I get the sludge on my hands while cleaning, no amount of Lava soap and brushing will get it off and I'll have black,grimy hands for a week that feel dirty

I just put on work gloves when I clean at the range now, no problem

 

[GrandLakeHunter]

When all I had left was some almost free Pyrodex (dirt cheap when walmart closed a local store) and a few ounces of BP for priming, I would load with Pyro' then trickle a few grains of 4f BP into the bolster directly under the nipple's flash hole. Instant ignition and great accuracy every time.

 

[Col. Batguano]

I only had one pound and a half of GOEX 2F. I have been shooting my .48 caliber flintlock longrifle with 35 grains of 2F and 35 grains of Pyrodex Select on top of the blackpowder. It shoots perfectly and really helps extend my real blackpowder. I have been shooting pyrodex for more than 20 years and I have never had any issues or misfires. I'm happy to have both kinds of powder for my shooting pleasure.

A .48"? really? Is it an original? That's not a caliber that the contemporary barrel makers make as a stock item, though for enough money you can get people to make you pretty much anything you want (except younger).

 

[Stantheman86]

It all depends on your comfort level and what your goals are for that particular outing at a range or on your property are

If your shooting an original musket or rifle, or even if you're shooting a repro and you want that wonderful Boom, that smell , all the things about real Black that make it fun, then hopefully you have that option

It's also 2022 not 1822 and sometimes an afternoon on the rifle range with a bottle of Pyrodex and a bunch of lead bullets for a repro Rifle-Musket is just as much fun as shooting anything else.

How "new" of a concept is Pyrodex and 777 anyway ?

The idea of "semi smokeless " and alternate chemical compounds for propellant began in the 1830s-40s when Breechloaders started being a workable design and cartridges were moving from experimental concepts to actually being used. Inventors, chemists and Ordnance Officers have been experimenting with cleaner powders way before we probably even know about

 

[brazosland]

The new 4473 coming out in Feb. has a section for "kit" guns, this includes BP kits according to the ATF, Firearm retailers must now use the letters PMF when recording the transfer or acceptance of privately made firearms. The new 4473 announcement states, “Any firearm, received by a FFL, that was privately made (not manufactured by another licensee) must now be recorded on the ATF Form 4473. ‘Privately Made Firearm (PMF)’ has been added to item 1, Section A. It now reads: ‘Manufacturer and Importer, if any or Privately made firearm (PMF) (If the manufacturer and importer are both different, include both).’” There are other changes and FFLs should visit the above-linked web page for full details.

Other amendments being considered are the requirment to fill out a form 4473 to take possession of ammunition used in assault style rifles.
( i am sure it will include all ammo), This will be introduced in Oct. 2023 to come into effect in early 2024, says the institute for legislative action. As you saw with obama's proposed ammo ban, all they have to do is propose it, to make it happen.

enjoy.

But muzzleloaders are NOT classified as firearms by the ATF so none of that applies…

They can order an FFL to do whatever they want…but for us it does not matter. They are not Title 1 Firearms. Period.

 

[GrandLakeHunter]

But muzzleloaders are classified as firearms by the ATF so none of that applies…

I think you left out the word "not" in that opening sentence. Just helping a BP brother out. LOL

 

[Billy Boy]

Listening to a podcast yesterday an apparently famous competition shooter in the East somewhere was being interviewed, and at the mention of Pyrodex he and the interviewer both snorted as if using Pyrodex is akin to wearing white after Labor Day. I'm not a Pyrodex enthusiast, but when I got back into muzzleloading it's all I could find locally. I prefer Swiss, and eventually found some.
What propellent do the Kardashians use?

Pyrodex uncool?
Some if us are using Depends, nothing uncool about anything that lets you take care of business..

 

[Col. Batguano]

What part of a ML'er would be the firearm then if this new classification applies? Europe uses the barrel, and the US uses the action (in cartridge guns), or breech block in the case of break-action guns.

 

[Stantheman86]

But muzzleloaders are classified as firearms by the ATF so none of that applies…

They can order an FFL to do whatever they want…but for us it does not matter. They are not Title 1 Firearms. Period.

This probably applies to States like NJ or I think NY that require Muzzleloaders to be transferred by an FFL regardless of whether it's a kit or not