Keeping Walker cylinder turning freely

[M. De Land]

You have it pretty well nailed. Arbor is corrected and the lower frame makes good solid contact at the lower pins then you have a good setup. You can set the barrel/cylinder gap after the arbor is corrected several ways just depends on preference. I've done it by removing material from the forcing cone area, and in some cases a light skim cut on the cylinder face especially when there was excessive runout between the cylinder and the breech area.

Well your gradually beginning to wake up and smell the roses as to what's going on. The wedge depth , arbor end fit and lower lug fit need to be adjusted to one another to establish and maintain a level barrel cylinder gap width around the clock which few people even pay any attention to. The two faces (cylinder and barrel breech) need to be as parallel and co-axially aligned to each other in both axis as is possible to maintain chamber/bore alignment which dictates overall accuracy as well as shot register vertically and horizontally (x-y axis).
If the arbor is short then the wedge can draw up the barrel gap at the top but not at the bottom as the lower lug blocks it's level/uniform draw up.
This is why any gap reduction must be addressed at all three points ( wedge depth, arbor end fit and lower lug trim).
Maintaining parallel at 3 and 9 o' clock is addressed by arbor thread square just as it is by the threaded barrel frame hole in solid frame guns.
Revolver chamber/bore alignment square is not only important to accuracy but also to shot registry in relation to the sights. Same deal with chamber to bore alignment in rifle barrel accuracy.
The establishment and maintance of barrel cylinder gap parallel is another advantage of solid frame gun design over open frame.
Some lug reduction photos.

 

[bpd303]

Yes, I've set it in the past, last time I used it 40gr of 3fg Goex is the setting. I even found the tiny allen wrench to set it in one of the boxes.

I also remember one of the drawbacks to the flask while locating the stuff to shoot the Walker. It can't be used to charge the cylinder while it is in the gun as the flask will be at an angle and it drops inconsistent charges. The flask only throws consistent charges while being held straight in relation to the chamber.

Since I don't like removing the cylinder each time reloading, I found a couple of work around's that allows to charge each chamber while still in the gun. The first one works on a clean bore and that is to drop the charge from the barrels muzzle. Charge the chamber, rotate the cylinder and charge the next chamber & so on till all six are charged. That works until the bore has some fouling so I had to wipe the bore clean.
The other and the one I like is to use a "drop tube" in each chamber which lets the flask drop the powder straight. I made a drop tube from a rifle case that fits the chamber and is long enough to clear the frame. A 30-06 case with the head cut off works. I found it and wondered what is that for and it dawned on me oh ya a drop tube.

 

[M. De Land]

I also remember one of the drawbacks to the flask while locating the stuff to shoot the Walker. It can't be used to charge the cylinder while it is in the gun as the flask will be at an angle and it drops inconsistent charges. The flask only throws consistent charges while being held straight in relation to the chamber.

Since I don't like removing the cylinder each time reloading, I found a couple of work around's that allows to charge each chamber while still in the gun. The first one works on a clean bore and that is to drop the charge from the barrels muzzle. Charge the chamber, rotate the cylinder and charge the next chamber & so on till all six are charged. That works until the bore has some fouling so I had to wipe the bore clean.
The other and the one I like is to use a "drop tube" in each chamber which lets the flask drop the powder straight. I made a drop tube from a rifle case that fits the chamber and is long enough to clear the frame. A 30-06 case with the head cut off works. I found it and wondered what is that for and it dawned on me oh ya a drop tube.

We drop tube load our match black powder cartridges for mid and long range shooting. It compacts powder into smaller volume by removing air space. It reduces extreme spread and standard deviation.

 

[45D]

I also remember one of the drawbacks to the flask while locating the stuff to shoot the Walker. It can't be used to charge the cylinder while it is in the gun as the flask will be at an angle and it drops inconsistent charges. The flask only throws consistent charges while being held straight in relation to the chamber.

Since I don't like removing the cylinder each time reloading, I found a couple of work around's that allows to charge each chamber while still in the gun. The first one works on a clean bore and that is to drop the charge from the barrels muzzle. Charge the chamber, rotate the cylinder and charge the next chamber & so on till all six are charged. That works until the bore has some fouling so I had to wipe the bore clean.
The other and the one I like is to use a "drop tube" in each chamber which lets the flask drop the powder straight. I made a drop tube from a rifle case that fits the chamber and is long enough to clear the frame. A 30-06 case with the head cut off works. I found it and wondered what is that for and it dawned on me oh ya a drop tube.

Hmmmmm . . . I never had any problem using mine. I used it with my Dragoons and Walker with no problems at all.
(Cylinders in frame)
Mike

 

[Smokerr]

Our range has some rules that do not allow you to powder charge on the bench.

Issue is, do you try to charge in frame on the reloading bench (behind the shooting bench) and have a gun waving around? Now we all know it needs caps to be lethal but people are not used to seeing guns waved around (well they are but we call the range officer and those people quit or go home)

So in my case I take the cylinder out of the gun because on a cease fire, the guns need to be cased or the BP need to have the cylinder out to prove its safe (and no I have not asked what they do about SA Colt type!)

So yea, by default or definition, the cylinder needs to come out and you put powder in them on the back bench and do not cap until you get to the front bench (separation of powder and caps).

Its one reason for the winter months I shoot more unmentionable. I also have a spare cylinder for each of the BP guns I am shooting now, so I pre load at home. Cylinders in a snap box and open the box, cap and put in and away we go.

 

[D Yager]

Well your gradually beginning to wake up and smell the roses as to what's going on. The wedge depth , arbor end fit and lower lug fit need to be adjusted to one another to establish and maintain a level barrel cylinder gap width around the clock which few people even pay any attention to. The two faces (cylinder and barrel breech) need to be as parallel and co-axially aligned to each other in both axis as is possible to maintain chamber/bore alignment which dictates overall accuracy as well as shot register vertically and horizontally (x-y axis).
If the arbor is short then the wedge can draw up the barrel gap at the top but not at the bottom as the lower lug blocks it's level/uniform draw up.
This is why any gap reduction must be addressed at all three points ( wedge depth, arbor end fit and lower lug trim).
Maintaining parallel at 3 and 9 o' clock is addressed by arbor thread square just as it is by the threaded barrel frame hole in solid frame guns.
Revolver chamber/bore alignment square is not only important to accuracy but also to shot registry in relation to the sights. Same deal with chamber to bore alignment in rifle barrel accuracy.
The establishment and maintance of barrel cylinder gap parallel is another advantage of solid frame gun design over open frame.
Some lug reduction photos.

Holy smokes!!! You are now preaching at the choir.. haven't Mike and I been saying the same thing all around here? Wow, I am just totally blown away here at this sudden pearl of wisdom. Glad to see you are really good at taking others words and ideas and turning them into your own. I am really beginning to think the lack of sunlight up there in Alaska has addled your wits...no offense Smokerr... and again the same lack of knowledge on the platform is once again confirmed.

 

[Smokerr]

D Yager: None taken! Some are more affected than others!

 

[45D]

The wedge depth ,

means absolutely nothing . . .

arbor end fit and lower lug fit need to be adjusted to one another . . .

Not necessarily

The two faces (cylinder and barrel breech) need to be as parallel and co-axially aligned to each other in both axis as is possible to maintain chamber/bore alignment which dictates overall accuracy as well as shot register vertically and horizontally (x-y axis).

So you're saying the Howell 6 shot cylinder installed in a Remington revolver can't deliver accurate performance? Each chamber is "off axis" by at least 1/2 a degree ( so 6 can be loaded) but most will comment on how "accurate" their revolvers are!!

Maintaining parallel at 3 and 9 o' clock is addressed by

careful filing because the forcing cone is "inboard" from the bearing surface . . . (Breech end).

The establishment and maintance of barrel cylinder gap parallel is another advantage of solid frame gun design over open frame.

if the arbor is correct, the "barrel cylinder gap" being "parallel can be established" and is a NON issue and IS maintained!!!

 

[D Yager]

Atta boy Mike! Couldn't have said it better.

 

[M. De Land]

means absolutely nothing . . .

Not necessarily

So you're saying the Howell 6 shot cylinder installed in a Remington revolver can't deliver accurate performance? Each chamber is "off axis" by at least 1/2 a degree ( so 6 can be loaded) but most will comment on how "accurate" their revolvers are!!

careful filing because the forcing cone is "inboard" from the bearing surface . . . (Breech end).

if the arbor is correct, the "barrel cylinder gap" being "parallel can be established" and is a NON issue and IS maintained!!!

Like I said, apparently you wish to remain ignorant ! Filing the barrel breech face to make it parallel to the cylinder face is dumbest thinking to adjust chamber/bore co-axis I have ever heard as the angular misalignment between them remains. That's right up there with filing the muzzle on an angle to regulate sights.
You have so many wrong ,cockeyed theories it's hard to know where to begin.

 

[45D]

Like I said, apparently you wish to remain ignorant ! Filing the barrel breech face to make it parallel to the cylinder face is dumbest thinking to adjust chamber/bore co-axis I have ever heard as the angular misalignment between them remains. That's right up there with filing the muzzle on an angle to regulate sights.
You have so many wrong ,cockeyed theories it's hard to know where to begin.

Maybe in all your glorious intellect you could explain how "wedge depth" changes anything with a correct arbor length?

And just maybe you can explain how Uberti and Pietta maintain closer tolerances than Ruger ( that has cyl bore as well as barrel bore problems that show up) when the "run of the mill" (just random customer revolvers around my work bench) have "off center" bores like these pictures I took just now -

'58 Rem

O.T.

Thin at 4 o'clock

Thin at 4 o'clock

Thin at 5 o'clock

Best of the bunch, Thin at 9 o'clock


This is typical Italian Quality. So you can use these as centers to square the frame fitting . . . you might get lucky and make a few better but more likely make the setup worse.
Mix that with unknown alignment of the chambers and no telling where you are!! I get to remove the Italian chamber alignment since I use Kirst cylinders so that is a definite plus for me personally.

I'm sorry, I'd rather leave them as close as they may be, maintain my ignorance and shoot groups like this

but hey, I'm willing to learn!!

Mike

 

[D Yager]

Like I said, apparently you wish to remain ignorant ! Filing the barrel breech face to make it parallel to the cylinder face is dumbest thinking to adjust chamber/bore co-axis I have ever heard as the angular misalignment between them remains. That's right up there with filing the muzzle on an angle to regulate sights.
You have so many wrong ,cockeyed theories it's hard to know where to begin.

Well bless your heart, you've managed to be even more silly than the last few postings. First off what difference does all that make as long as the chambers and bore are in alignment, the pistol goes bang the bullet goes down the barrel and heads off to where you aimed it. There's always gonna be manufacturing tolerance errors that need to be dealt with on these replicas such as short arbors, late timing and chamber misalignment. So just for the sake of argument( you seem to live for argument) what is your solution for dealing with slight chamber to barrel misalignment? Do you install a bolt guide before you attempt to set timing? Do you install an action stop? Just askin on account of the tremendous amount of knowledge that you seem to have on a platform you don't understand.

 

[deerstalkert]

fascinated by this exchange because i have 3 walkers. 2 that i shoot. and my knowledge of bp handguns is nil.

Been a while since I used this.

 

[D Yager]

They can certainly be made into fun accurate and reliable pistols....just fix the short arbor if it hasn't been done already. With a cap post, action shield, action stop and a bolt guide they are even better.