Kibler Hawken update,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

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My final thought on this. Actually a prediction. I posit that there are far more caplock afficionados than there are flintlock. It might seem here on the MLF that flintlocks are far more favored than caplocks but I don't think that across the country and considering the entire traditional ml demographic that is so. There is an entire layer of ml shooters who came after and aren't much caught up in the Hawken mystique. They are going to see the Kibler Hawken for simply what it is; a high quality rifle at an economical price compared to other comparable options that will be suitable to just about any use one might imagine.

It might become the Kibler top seller.
 
I saw Jim's video on his Hawken, and while some here don't like some of the features, I love everything he is doing with it. He is setting it apart from other "Hawkens" with what he's doing. I like the shape of the finials, possible engraving, etc., as well as the barrel length. I'm a flintlock guy, and after fitting a Green Mountain barrel to my Sile Hawken I bought back in 1981 I never fired it. Jim's Hawken will lead me to take up percussion again. First I still have to get his fowler kit. I didn't notice him mention anything about twist, but I'm guessing anywhere from 1:56 to 1:66. Thanks for working on this great offering Jim!
 
Does anyone know the title of the Hawken book that Jim had in that video?
Books;
1)Great Gunmakers for the Early West…JimGordon 3 volume set volume III has Hawken pictures….this is the book Kibler was flipping through.

2)The Hawken Rifle (it’s evolution from 1822-1870) Bob Woodfill

3) The Hawken Rifle It’s Place in History…Chas. Hanson

Jim Gordon’s book is $350-$500
 
I saw Jim's video on his Hawken, and while some here don't like some of the features, I love everything he is doing with it. He is setting it apart from other "Hawkens" with what he's doing. I like the shape of the finials, possible engraving, etc., as well as the barrel length. I'm a flintlock guy, and after fitting a Green Mountain barrel to my Sile Hawken I bought back in 1981 I never fired it. Jim's Hawken will lead me to take up percussion again. First I still have to get his fowler kit. I didn't notice him mention anything about twist, but I'm guessing anywhere from 1:56 to 1:66. Thanks for working on this great offering Jim!
The finials are a scarcity on the later original Hawkens. I know it sounds crazy, but I'm hoping it'll be possible to get the typical squared off trigger bar, and ramrod pipe as an option. I mean I really hate the finials with a passion. Am I alone in this? 😟🙁
 
ead.. that's one of the things that make's it different from the western arm hawken, that and lop, and barrel width. O and they dont make the western arms hawken anymore
 
ead.. that's one of the things that make's it different from the western arm hawken, that and lop, and barrel width. O and they dont make the western arms hawken anymore
Was the Western Arms Hawken made by Uberti?
 
Was the Western Arms Hawken made by Uberti?
L. Allen owned western arms and the guns were made by Uberti, I think from ? 1978 to 1980 until winchester sued him amd then he sold them under Allen Arms until 1982?
 
Not seen shape of toe plate. Finials on front of trigger bar and entry thimble do dress up the furniture. If motif extended to front of toe plate would lend itself to customer adding an iron patch box with pineapple finial. Inletting for finials means more work, expense. Those not excited about finial could square them off, extend mortise and add inlay with square ended brass, German silver or iron. To make it seem intentional add a wear plate between thimble and trigger guard. Or just choose not to buy it. Not sure if Jim has decided on shape of single lock bolt inlay for single bolt - teardrop with straight or curvilinear sides. The Mariana Modena .58 Hawken has a tapered barrel that is also slightly swamped. Handled it several times.
 
Thanks, bearded horse, good advice. I'm hoping the finials turn out to be optional. If he has to make finials standard, I'm hoping he at least uses a design used on an original to throw a small table scrap to traditionalists, known as kool-aid drinkers to Jim.
 
dont get too excited i didnt read all of this but do you remember waiting and waiting for the fowler to only keep having it kicked back and back and back then to be jumped ahead of by the woodsrunner. finally i got mine [ and i was on the early list]....well worth waiting for . hopefully you hawkins [ :rolleyes: ] guys will not have to wait as long....
 
In fairness and honesty, I did not thoroughly read every comment/post on this thread. I did a cursory scroll through. With that said:

Any new product that generates interest in traditional muzzleloading is a good thing. If this offering takes off and gets some to ditch the unmentionable and join our fold, great. If it causes others to gain even more interest in original Hawken or Plains Rifles, great.

If it brings more traditional muzzleloading hunters to our fold, even better.

A kit is just that. You have a foundation to work with and based on your patience and abilities you can customize that kit somewhat to suit your personal, historical, or authenticity needs. Real, perceived, and imagined.
 
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I don't think you understand. What I aim to produce is the best designed and most finely crafted 1850's Hawken styled rifle kits ever produced. I'm certain we'll achieve this goal. So, since I'm not copying an original this becomes "generic" in a derogatory sense? I'm pretty sure, I can defend the vast majority if not all design choices from a historical correctness perspective.
My bet is that there was similar "steering" on your earlier kits too. You can never please everyone. Especially when it comes to a crowd so steeped in tradition. . In the end, the proof will be in the sales numbers with many of those buyers not currently represented here. I'm confident that sales on this one will blow up as it is well thought out to meet a niche.. Keep doing what you do best, Jim. I'll patiently wait for the launch and guess I won't be in the minority.
 
Regarding spelling;
If they find out you are a spelling Natzi, they will misspell it on purpose.
I find misspelled words rather charming.
If you have read any of Mark Twain’s comments on the subject you might agree.
I propose Hawkenett as the new standard. Perhaps Hawkser?
 
I’d ignore most of the really snarky ones. I watched your video. Looks like it will be nice. Sorry I prob won’t buy one because I have enough guns. When you make a Bedford rifle, THAT I’ll want 😜
I sometimes think I have enough guns, then Mr. Kibler comes up with something I have wanted for a long time. I have production Hawken style rifles but there was something about all the government safety crap stamped on the barrels I never liked. If I can't sell them, the grandson's will get an early birthday present.😀

If the kits show up this fall, that is perfect for a winter project. Getter done Jim.
 
We are going to have a live youtube video on Saturday February 1st. With this style you can type in comments or questions during the video and we'll try to answer them. The upcoming Hawken should be a great topic as well as anything else associated with our business including future gun kits, accessories etc. Should be fun! Hope to see you there. Here is the link:

https://youtube.com/live/ZquSVEcsd_I?feature=share
 
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