Lead shot in a .62 smoothie?

[JimG]

How practical is it to shoot lead shot out of a .62 smoothbore? Or are they really just for single patched round balls? I guess my question is can you lob 'big balls' AND use it as a cylinder bored 20 gauge shotgun too??????

 

[Russianblood]

Shot from a smoothbore is like bread and butter, peanut butter and jelly, frys and ketchup. They are made for each other.

Just put in the powder, an overpowder card, a lubed cushion wad, shot and then an overshot card to keep the shot in place. Make sure you pattern your smoothbore before hunting with it so you'll know what pattern to expect at what distance.

 

[Black Hand]

I use it with shot or patched roundball. Shoot better that I do. It's what they were made for......

 

[Rebel]

That is what they are made for. I took a nice tom turkey with mine this spring using shot. In fact, that is where i just came back from, trying out different shot loads for the fall turkey season.

 

[JimG]

How do you manage to keep a tight pattern beyond say 15-20 yards. For example my Win 1300 20 gauge or my Rem 870 12 guage with the cylinder chokes installed literally 'spray' the shot in an umbrella sized pattern much beyond 20ish yards. Am I not comparing apples to apples? :hmm:

 

[No Deer]

How do you manage to keep a tight pattern beyond say 15-20 yards. For example my Win 1300 20 gauge or my Rem 870 12 guage with the cylinder chokes installed literally 'spray' the shot in an umbrella sized pattern much beyond 20ish yards. Am I not comparing apples to apples? :hmm:

That is why you have to experiment with it. You have to adjust each of the components individually until you find the best combination. You can get smoothbores with chokes built in, or you can get screw in chokes. Cylinder bored smoothbores can get a decent pattern, but it takes more work. Check out this site, it will give you a lot of information:[url] http://home.insightbb.com/~bspen[/url]/

 

[Rebel]

I figure i have a 20 yd gun and keep my shots in that range with shot. With rd balls i figure i am ok out to 50-60 yds. Some people can go further with theirs but that is the limit of my Comfort zone. And that is with a good rest. About half that off hand.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Jim: Usually you will get better patterns out of an open choke gun by reducing the powder charge. The loads sold in modern shells are too fast, and they blow the patterns. Buy light 2 3/4 dram loads, with 1 1/8 oz. of shot, and you should see tighter patterns. If you reload, and there is no reason not to with today's ammo prices, You can load below even these light commercial loads. You can also put paper inserts in the shotcups to help keep the shot together after it leaves the barrel, and the shotcup begins to fall away. In effect, a ring of heavy paper in the cup neutralizes that quick opening cup with those cuts in the sides. It is labor intensive, to be sure, but how many shots are you going to shoot in a hunting season? If you don't want to reload, the most cost effective decision is to get screw in chokes for the barrel, and change the constriction to tighten your patterns that way. i have screw in chokes for a short barrel I have on my Rem. 870, that I use when hunting with steel shot for Canda Geese. I also used it once hunting dove, where more open patterns can be an aid.

 

[Capt. Jas.]

Using harder lead shot will produce a tighter pattern than the soft promo type.

 

[JimG]

Thanks for the link and the info!

 

[paulvallandigham]

Capt. True, and so does using a plastic wad improve patterns out of an open bore gun. You get better improvement with a choked barrel, but for hunting, where you are limited in the number of shots you are going to take by your ability to hit moving targets, and by the bag limits imposed, taking the time to do these little extra, albeit more expensive steps is worth the effort. I found my open cylinder 12 ga. double is all the gun I need for pheasants and chukkar taken over dogs. If one busts out way out of range, they are also out of range for another hunter using a modern gun with full choke. We note where the birds go, and hunt them up when we get to that spot. Sometimes we find them, sometimes they land and run somewhere else. The more they are hunted, the more they learn to survive. I know a hunting preserve with a regular population of over 300 birds that never let you get in shotgun range. The only way that bunch is going to be trimmed is if we catch one of the cocks chasing the ladies, or if we formed a huge blocking party and a large group of drivers to push together, and catch them in a pinch. It would be difficult to organize, and far more difficult to control, but if you could get 50 hunters to do it, the shooting would be fast and furious for a couple of minutes.

 

[CrackStock]

Paul,

using a plastic wad improve patterns out of an open bore gun.

By this, do you mean a plastic wad or shot cup? I am curious because my results with plastic shot cups were fiar, but I got better with double wrapped paper shot containers.

CS

 

[roundball]

Don't know why anybody would want to use modern plastic shotgun wads in a smoothbore muzzleloader

 

[paulvallandigham]

Normally, plastic shot cups will tighten the pattern in an open cylinder gun by as much as 5%. But not all plastic shot cups are the same. I have gotten worse patterns using one shot cup of memory! Gave the rest away to a friend, who liked them. I think the idea of putting a ring of paper, or cardboard inside a plastic shot cup to retard the outward movement of the shot when it separates from the shotcup is worth testing. In effect, the slits in the plastic cup to make wings or vanes, allows the shotcup to brake away from the shot when it leaves the barrel, dropping off and behind the shot as it travels. The circle of paper or cardboard that was inside the cup retards the outward movement of the shot, keeping it together, and flying towards the target until the light weight ring falls behind. That would let the shot get away from the muzzle and all the compressed air currents caused by the pushing of an air column in the barrel in front of the shot charge out into the air in front of the muzzle, causing air waves and a partial vacuum that has air rushing back in just in time to be struck by the shot separating from the plastic shotcup, or wad. That can't be good for keeping shot together, even for the short time we are talking about.

Pardon my use of the term plastic wad. That is what the darn things are called in reloading manuals. I knew exactly what you were asking about as soon as I read your question, and smiled at my lapse in being precise. I ate something that didn't like me last night, and have been feeling it all night and day.

 

[CrackStock]

Pardon my use of the term plastic wad. That is what the darn things are called in reloading manuals. I knew exactly what you were asking about as soon as I read your question, and smiled at my lapse in being precise. I ate something that didn't like me last night, and have been feeling it all night and day.

Paul,

You might be right. My experience with shotguns is limited to 870s and factory loads and to the components that I purchased. There are plastic disks which my armorer called wads in my LE light loads. We pick up arms loads of them at the range. (They work great when placed over a percussion gun nipple for dry firing caplocks)

I also ordered plastic sleeves which contain shot. These were packaged in a bag which was labeled shot cups.

You can also put paper inserts in the shotcups to help keep the shot together after it leaves the barrel, and the shotcup begins to fall away.

Are these words yours? You also refered to these items as shot cups in your previous post and then discussed wads in the next post, so I wanted to understand which you were discussing.

Pardon me if I have not read your reloading manuals and could not read your mind as I could only see your words.

RB,

The man who built the gun for me suggested it as the best method of cleanly taking a turkey, so I gave it a shot. Many shots actually. I found that paper wrapped almost double worked so well that I have most of the bag of plastic shotgun wads remaining unused. I am still not averse to trying them under special circumstances if they improve my ability to cleanly take a turkey.

CS

 

[Capt. Jas.]

For those of us nuts who shoot 500-1000 rounds a week of modern sporting clays, these are considered wads :grin:
[url] http://www.recobstargetshop.com/browse.cfm/2,195.html[/url]

 

[paulvallandigham]

Yes, those were my words. I am talking about altering the release timing of a load of shot from a plastic shot " cup " by putting a paper ring, or cardboard( think of index card stock) Inside the cup, so that it holds the shot together after it leaves the barrel, while the petals, or " wings" of the shotcup open up and air brakd the wall into separating from the shot. The light paper or cardboard insert would itself separate next, but it will have done its job.

This is a pita when reloading large quantity of shells, because you would have to make the stips or rings up beforehand, and insert them one at a time into the plastic shot cups. I would not do it if I was loading modern shells for several reasons, but the PITA factor would be first!

However, if you are shooting an open choke gun, particularly a ML, where everything is done carefully and deliberatedly, and therefore slowly by reloader standards, putting paper rings inside a few shot cups before taking the fied would be nothing much more to do. Muzzle velocities are going to be less using BP loads if you are smart, and the plastic shotcup with the paper ring in it to make a " 2-stage " release of the shot might must make for more uniform, and maybe tighter patterns, without turning the load into a " solid ". If that ring stays with the shot while it travels through that air turbulance at the muzzle, before releasing the shot, we should see some improvement in patterns.

 

[CrackStock]

I shoot government issued LE light loads when I shoot shotguns which leaves me with lots of discs that are called wads by the manufacturer. Then there are these sleeves used by wing shooters to contain shot and act as wads which are also called wads.

All I wanted to know was which wads were being discussed at a given moment.

CS

 

[CrackStock]

Paul,

I see several benefits to your sleeve and wad method. It would keep plastic from fouling the bore, would close up the shot pattern and still not keep everything together in a single projectile.

I also agree that it would likely be a pain to load in a series of shots, but would be worth the extra effort for hunting turkeys.

:hatsoff:

I will give this a try and I thank you for the idea.

CS