loading from the horn

I have been shooting muzzleloaders for almost 30 years and know the danger of loading from the horn. I always use a powder measure. I understand the reason for this but I have never seen or heard of a powder charge igniting from a spark or smoldering ember in the barrel. Have any of you?

It has happened. It is a serious problem in cannon firing--that's why they swab real good between cannon shots. Even then some people have been maimed. Best not to load directly from the horn to be safe. Best not to get your face too close even when loading from a measure. It may be rare, but it is like playing Russian roulette.

 

[tmdreb]

Here's a question: Why is pouring powder from a horn into a separate measure unsafe? I see reenactment guidelines all the time that allow horns, but only if they're empty. Is this just to ensure no one loads directly from the horn?

 

[paulvallandigham]

Loading from the horn into a separate measure IS the safe way to load. When you pour the small charge of black powder down the barrel, should their be a spark that ignites this powder, you only face a small burn of your fingers or hand, rather than have a trail of flame travel up and into your horn and ignite the powder still in the horn. That horn can detonate like a hand grenade. The reason some reinactors require horns to be empty if worn is so there is no chance that any of the blank charges fired in volley, with men standing in close ranks, can send a spark to a quantity of BP and hurt or kill several shooters. The reinactors are standing should to shoulder when they fire, much closer than anyone would stand to another shooter on the firing line of any range. Most shooters will wait for the guy next to them to shoot his rifle before stepping up to the line, just to avoid being hit with bits of flint, or burning powder, caps, etc. It only has to happen once.......

 

:hmm: seems I was at a primtive shoot one time where one of the matches involved shooting from pouch and horn and the last event befor time was called was flint and steel fire starting.
This one gentleman finished his shooting and ran over where the flint and steel event was performed set down his tinder and his first strike of the flint a loud whoosh and flash blew dirt rocks and leaves every where.
His powder horn plug had fallen out, lucky he did not dump much powder!!!!!!!!

 

[PAlongrifle]

As pointed out in an earlier post, what if you use a priming horn for the flashpan? At the range I go to, I have to put the load, patch, and ball in behind the line of fire, and then bring the rifle to the line (with a frizen cover). Only once I'm at the line am I allowed to prime the pan, which means it is with me when I fire. I use a priming horn for this; should I be doing something differant?

 

[paulvallandigham]

NO. Just remember to put the stopper in your priming horn before shooting. If you forget, the range officer will remind you. This is a habit you want to get in on the range so you will do it in the field without thinking about it. I once carried my priming horn around my neck, but didn't like it. I now put the horn in my possible bag, after priming, or into my back pocket, if I am not carrying my possibles bag to the firing line. In the field, I always have my possibles bag, so I keep the priming horn in the bag, on my strong side. If I have to get to stuff in the bag under the horn, I take it out and stick it temporarily in my back pocket, where it is such an uncomfortable lump, I can't forget I put it there, and not remember to take it out when I want to move again. Works for me.

 

[hack]

Many years ago I witnessed a cooker.
The man was firing an 1864 springfield and was loading using paper cartiges, he fired his third shot and was dumping the powder for the fourth when WHOOSH the powder ingnited and burned his face and one hand. He was one lucky person having only first degree burns on his face and a couple of blisters on his hand. so to answer the question, YES, it is possible to have a gun fire prematurely while loading and its not worth the risk to load from the horn.

 

[RedFeather]

I remeber a Muzzle Blasts from the late 80's or so and it had an article about (or by?) a fellow who was shoointg at Friendship and wasn't thinking. He was shooting in some timed event, loading from a flask when he heard a funny sizzling sound. About the time he located the source, it went off in his hand near his head. They took him to a closeby steam and dunked him. Luckily, the flask was near to empty and he only had some burns and ringing in his ears, if I remember rightly. Point of the article was that it can and does happen, even to those who are usually careful. Closest I ever came was in shooting my 1858. I was wearing a heavy leather glove and cocked the gun, which raise the barrel. As I let go of the hammer, the barrel weight made it droop down and it went off. I was shooting over an old picnic table which contained, among other things, my flask. Just missed the table top and left a nice smoking hole about three feet in front of the firing line. :redface:

 

[Zonie]

To know that the problem existed (and still exists) you only have to count the number of Patents which were issued in the 1800s for various designs of powder flask valves.

There are dozens of them, all designed to keep a possible flash from the powder going down the barrel from getting to the powder in the flask.

I'm not saying these devices worked, but I am suggesting that if there was no need for this type of thing, people wouldn't have been Patenting them.
Also, several of the big flask making companies wouldn't have been paying royalities to use some of these designs on their products.

 

He should have blown the ember out before putting another load down. I bet this happens more than we hear about. Missing fingers and ramrods shot through the hands do happen because of the MODERN notion that a empty muzzleloading rifle that YOU just shot is going to blow your head off. I don't mean to be argumentative. The old time shooters did it this way. No reason to re-invent the wheel.
Don

 

[RedFeather]

He should have blown the ember out before putting another load down. I bet this happens more than we hear about. Missing fingers and ramrods shot through the hands do happen because of the MODERN notion that a empty muzzleloading rifle that YOU just shot is going to blow your head off. I don't mean to be argumentative. The old time shooters did it this way. No reason to re-invent the wheel.
Don

Guess you are referring to my post. Well, the guy in the article was certainly no tyro. He figured he just got too excited at the wrong time. Could've happened to Daniel Boone, for that matter. Don't want to get into a blow/don't blow thing here. Only pointing out an actual instance of someone blowing up a powder flask through direct loading.

If you stop and think about it, this admonition against direct loading had to have originated a long time ago by those "old timers". I believe our range doesn't allow it and I'm glad of that policy since the stations aren't 100 yards apart. :grin:

 

Redfeather, I hope there was no misunderstanding. I agree that loading from the horn is a dangerous enterprise to say the least. :thumbsup:
Don

 

The old time shooters did it this way. No reason to re-invent the wheel.

Another member uses this "old timers" phrase as proof of his statements as well.

It would really help if people provided some documentation for these "old timers" to justify their statements. It all sounds like someone's opinion to me.

My 2 cents.

 

If we documented everything we said on here there would be very little discussion. Everything I have read over the years and stuff that many old timers have told me over the years becomes a stored and filed away knowledge that I have used and/or changed over the years as needed. I am not going to go look up some docs every time I post something here. Do you document every word and phrase you say on these forums? If so, I must have missed it. I speak for myself and no one else, including who ever uses a particular phrase the same as I do. I post what I know and no one has to beleive it or agree with it. There are a few who do and they are welcome to use whatever piece of conributed wisdom that I may have written here. If you don't agree with me then forget about it. No problem.
Don

 

[spitfire]

Once met a guy at the local Gunshop who loaded from the Horn.I ask how much powder do you use?His reply was 'nuf to FILL THE BARREL :youcrazy: :shake: !!!!Needless to say this pilgrim got a few undocumented opinions real quick!!! :rotf:

 

Once met a guy at the local Gunshop who loaded from the Horn.I ask how much powder do you use?His reply was 'nuf to FILL THE BARREL :youcrazy: :shake: !!!!Needless to say this pilgrim got a few undocumented opinions real quick!!! :rotf:

Did he leave enuff room for the ball? :rotf:

 

[spitfire]

Yeah,He forced a compressed loading :haha: !!!Yup that will get something going fast in a Magnum kinda way :rotf: :youcrazy: !!!! :shocked2:

 

[crockett]

We had a guy a year or so on this forum with a picture of a mangled hand- a result of loading from a horn. Not pretty. If I was in an Indian fight I'd blow down the barrel and load from the horn- you wouldn't have a choice. Without using a measure how would any sort of an accurate load be obtained? In today's world, never load from a horn.

 

[David Teague]

Hello All,

When I was 13 I got my first muzzleloader and a really cool flask that had a pour spout... needless to say, when one of the local club finally made note that I was loading from the horn, he firmly corrected my mistake... :nono:

Gonners loaded form the horn/flask/gourd in the middle ages and there is writing on the subject of how dangerous it was to be a gonner... Even if they did load from the horn in the "good old days" I do not see the point of doing it today. The military primed the flintlock musket first before loading the main charge from a paper cartridge... yes, it was war, yes, it was how they did it in the "good old days" but I've yet to see the thread where somebody wants to prime his flinter FIRST as that's the way they did it... (I happen to like my face, brain, and hands the way they are... thank you very much).

In review:

Yes they did.

No, we shouldn't (and I'm one of the "blow down" the barrel guys... :winking: ).

 

[bnail]

In today's world, never load from a horn.

Crockett, I gotta disagree, getting loaded from the horn is perfectly acceptable. . . as long as it's a rum horn! :rotf: :rotf: :rotf: