Lock hammer contact with cap

[bpd303]

Glad you clarified the turpentine. One of my CVA 45 caliber rifles is cantankerous like yours. I found out it was a flash channel problem too. What cured the problem was a mixture of fluid recommended to me by a long time shooter for swabbing between shots. Others use just plain water/spit.

Black Powder Solvent/Cleaner

1 part Murphy’s Oil Soap
2 parts rubbing alcohol
2 parts peroxide

It worked wonders for my rifle and I only have to swab when the fouling starts to make seating the patched ball difficult. Like others have said a slightly loose patch passed down once and back again is what you need.

 

[Zonie]

When you are loading the gun, is the hammer down on the nipple or is it at half cock?

If the hammer is left down on the nipple, it blocks off the vent thru the nipple. This can contribute to mis-fires.

With the hammer at half cock with the nipple uncapped (remove old fired cap if necessary), when you ram the patched ball (or bullet) down the barrel on a fresh powder charge, the trapped air in the bore is blown out thru the nipple hole.

This moving air in turn, blows some of the new powder back to the base of the nipple where it remains, waiting for the next caps fire to ignite it.
This can do a lot to reduce mis-fires.

That said, even under the best conditions and properly loaded, Pyrodex (and other synthetic black powders) will occasionally fail to fire.

The best solution is to try to find some real black powder.
Gun stores often don't carry it and those who do cannot have it sitting out on a shelf with the other powders. They must keep it in a locked powder chest or room.

Because it is locked up, many of the stores employees don't even know it exists so ask the store manager or owner for it.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Glad you clarified the turpentine. One of my CVA 45 caliber rifles is cantankerous like yours. I found out it was a flash channel problem too. What cured the problem was a mixture of fluid recommended to me by a long time shooter for swabbing between shots. Others use just plain water/spit.

Black Powder Solvent/Cleaner

1 part Murphy’s Oil Soap
2 parts rubbing alcohol
2 parts peroxide

It worked wonders for my rifle and I only have to swab when the fouling starts to make seating the patched ball difficult. Like others have said a slightly loose patch passed down once and back again is what you need.

The above cleaning / wiping solution is a very aggressive cleaner. The peroxide provides extra
oxygen and can contribute to rusting in your barrel. I recommend leaving the peroxide out or using two parts of water. This will clean almost as well as the MAP but is easier on the steel in the barrel.

When I used MAP, I took extra care to clean with water, then a water displacing solution such as WD40 or rubbing alcohol. Once dry then a good rust preventing lubrication will adequately protect the bore.

The real process is to use a slightly dampened loose patch to remove fouling in the bore. When you run the dampened patch down the bore, you can fire a cap to drive fouling in the breech into the patch.

 

[bpd303]

I've used that for over ten years without any problem with rust when it is used only to swab between shots. For cleaning and storage I clean with water and oil the bore.

 

[dblubaugh]

Zonie, to answer, after I fire the weapon, I always bring the hammer to half cock, remove the spent cap (which is normally still in the hammer bowl but occasionally on the nipple) before I swab the barrel. I actually have not swabbed most of the time. I think the input from most of you is that I don't need to be doing that most of the time. I do have a question for everyone... when I clean the barrel, I cannot see ANY sign of a patch at the end of the barrel when I look down into the bolster with the bolster scre removed. WHY cant I see anything moving there? Isnt that an open channel to the very end of the barrel? I would think that I could at least see a minute bit of patch movement through there but there is NOTHING I can see there. Is that normal? Thanks again to EVERYONE who has provided info. The Newbie here really appreciates it!

 

[bpd303]

It is normal due to the patent/chambered breech, which has a smaller chamber than the bore. Look at this thread and scroll down to see the breech illustration. http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/302941/

 

[Mean Gene]

Last time I was cleaning my barrel I had the bolster screw removed and could see the patch on the end of my rod, I did however need my flash light to see it.

 

[Zonie]

The drawing in the link bpd303 gave shows a flintlock breech which might be a bit confusing to the percussion shooters.

Here's a similar drawing showing the various breeches with a percussion setup.



Notice that all of these designs could have a "clean out screw" just below the nipple.

Also, notice the small hole I call a "flame channel" that connects the bottom of the nipple to the barrel is sometimes at an angle.
In all cases except with the traditional "side drum" the cleaning patch and jag stop in areas that would be difficult if not impossible to see thru the flame channel.

 

[Okie Hog]

1. Put the rifle at half cock.

2. Lean the rifle lock side down while loading.

3. Give the stock a couple slaps with the heel of your hand. That will get powder into the bolster.

 

[Mr. Troll]

I found a statement by the O.P. interesting. He said he can't detect any type of movement/presence of cleaning patches when looking through the bolster. I just took the bolster clean out screws out of both my new, unfired Kentucky, and my well used Springfield Hawken and shone a very bright light (I have one of those tac-light flashlights...they are quite amazing) and in both cases, I was able to see quite easily into the breech. The Hawken has no issues with misfires, so using it as a benchmark, the size of the fire channel hole seems to be the same on the Kentucky.

 

[jd411111]

I've only been doing this about a year and a half and had the same problem with misfires. I also have a Traditions rifle.All it took to fix my problem was switching from Pyrodex to real black powder,Goex fff. About the only time I have a misfire now is when my swabbing patch is too wet.

 

[hrchotaw]

Do what Okie Hog said,that works for me every time!I have an older Traditions Frontier,
and those steps give me 100% ignition :thumbsup:

 

[dblubaugh]

Thanks to all of you. The diagrams really helped me understand what is going on in the bolster area. After re-examining, I feel pretty sure the breech type on my Traditions Kentucky is a modified Nock's Patent Breech. At least it is the closest illustration to what mine is. Many other great suggestions here, too. I really appreciate it. Hope to go to range again soon and see if the reliability can be improved.

 

[necchi]

This is what your actual breech looks like, scratch out CVA and insert Traditions,, same thing;

Much of the problem is at "D" and the channel that leads to it.
A little trick is to "slap" the side of the rifle near the lock right after pouring down your powder charge. The movement helps powder settle into the channel between the nipple and the main charge at "D".
If you have a Dremel, using a small grinding stone on the inside of the hammer cup to open it a bit helps sometimes for hammers that stubbornly hang onto fired caps,, other wise picking caps out of the hammer is fairly common.

 

[azmntman]

This is what your actual breech looks like, scratch out CVA and insert Traditions,, same thing;

Much of the problem is at "D" and the channel that leads to it.
A little trick is to "slap" the side of the rifle near the lock right after pouring down your powder charge. The movement helps powder settle into the channel between the nipple and the main charge at "D".
If you have a Dremel, using a small grinding stone on the inside of the hammer cup to open it a bit helps sometimes for hammers that stubbornly hang onto fired caps,, other wise picking caps out of the hammer is fairly common.

several of mine grab spent caps. Word of WARNING, I have bleed all over everything a few times picking these out by hand, the edges can be so sharp you don't feel the cut and then suddenly there's blood on all yer stuff. Use a pick er something!

 

[Grimord]

I have found that the Hot Shot nipples, with the small hole cross wise thru the nipple cone, tends to split the caps after firing, so they don't get stuck in the hammer nose as much.

 

[Grenadier1758]

My percussion has had Hot Shot nipples for years. The hammer is recessed with a gap to the front to allow caps to split. Even with all that a cap will often be captured in the hammer recess. Fouling will spread back through the nipple and build up in the hammer recess. So making sure that the cap is cleared from the nipple and the hammer is just one more step in the reloading process. Check to see if the cap is cleared out of the recess in the hammer.

 

[dblubaugh]

Many thanks to all of you who have offered advice. I really appreciate the suggestions, comments, and explanations. I examined/compared the cva breech drawing and my Traditions Kentucky. They are similar but not quite the same. From what I can see with a magnifying glass and bright light looking into the breech in a dark room, the hole in the bolster goes way past the intersecting whole from the barrel. I could tell by putting a bright bore light in the barrel in the dark. One thing for sure, it is all extremely CLEAN now. So any more input on what powder I might try next instead of the Pyrodex RS. My manual says to use FFG equivalent powders.

 

[necchi]

the hole in the bolster goes way past the intersecting whole from the barrel

Oh Yeah.
They bore deep, most are not as picture perfect as the ad depicting that breech.
That's one of the reasons the breech plug on these should not be pulled, they cross drill the threads during the install. Attempts at pulling the plug usually booger the threads pretty bad.
As you've learned (you did good)) you can get'm really clean the way it is.

Powder;
The large concuss on this forum is 3f(FFFG) black powder if you have true BP available. 3f is being used successfully in 32 cal thru 54-58cals and larger by many.

 

[Zonie]

I have a TC Hawken that is notorious for getting fired caps pasted inside the recess on its hammer nose.

If I fire 5 shots in a row, sure enough, there's 5 caps stuck in the hammer.

Oddly, having 5 or so caps stuck in the hammer doesn't seem to have much effect on the next caps firing but I do stop loading about then and pry out the split pieces.

I suppose if the hammer and nipple weren't lined up just right, the stuck cap fragments could cause the hammer to lose enough power as the fragments rub on the new cap, that firing the next cap could be difficult.

In the long run, as long as the gun keeps firing I'm happy and it sure beats having a fired cap not fragment and remain stuck on the nipple after it's fired.
Prying a stuck cap off of the nipple can be a real pain in the butt.