lyman plains pistol advice

[Howie1968]

need a little advice. my lyman .54 plains pistol came in on Monday. I took her shooting that day. starting with 30 gr pyrodex p she shot great! I worked up to 50 gr pyro p. at 25 yards from a rested bench I shot around 1 inch for 3 shots. went to 50 was able to keep all shots into 3 inch group.
I was pleased. so today ive been reading about broken stocks. so I read on the kit gun instructions that I should grind a bit off the bolster. . the gun was solid no wiggle before my filing.when I finished I had a slight gap between lock and bolster. I put my key into stock and it wiggled a lot. so turned key over and put a slight bend it went in and tightened the barrel up. I have really strong hands so I put the stock in my hand and grab the barrel. I twisted and discovered a slight wiggle. I really have to put strength in it to wiggle.
my questions are if I leave it as is will it affect accuracy? or do I add a slight smidge of jb weld on bolster or the lock plate that bolster to take the last bit of slack
I should have just left it the way it was?

 

[Phil Coffins]

JBWeld would not be the way for me, but then I wouldn’t have filed the bolster either. What I believe is the fit of the barrel to the stock is sloppy. The hook on the breech to the tang should be close. First thing to do is to bed the barrel to the stock. Accuglass used as the instructions give will fix the wobble and can be done to make the key fit as well. I’m not saying to use it on the key slot but rather seat the barrel with out the key so it sets higher. I’ve built a few of the Great Plains pistols and never filed the bolster, none have broken the stock.
Shooting it now is the only way to tell if it’s accurate still.

 

[Howie1968]

Thank you Phil until I messed with this morning it was solid. I knew better I just did to much reading forums over the Christmas holiday. I've never bedded anything before so I may have to find a gunsmith in my area

 

[Zonie]

I wish you would have asked before you created clearance between the lock and the bolster. There should be absolutely no gap at that location.

By having the joint between the lock plate and bolster, there is no tendency for the barrel to move when the hammer falls. Think of something resting on the anvil on a vice and then hitting it lightly with a hammer. The vise (lock plate) takes all of the energy from the falling hammer and the thing between the hammer and vise just sits there and gets squeezed.
With a gap there, it's like the thing is resting on a thin piece of wood so, when the hammer falls, the wood (or in your case, the stock) has to absorb all of the energy delivered by the hammer.

I suggest you try to build up the area with something to absorb the impact.

The reason some of the plains pistols get broken stocks is because people put too much powder in their guns.
IMO, your 50 grain powder load is approaching what I would call, "too much". I think 30-40 grains of powder would be a better choice.

 

[Howie1968]

Thank you. Mr. Zonie most of the time I ask I read the Lyman manual and it said to do it. I know better to tinker with things lesson will be learned on this situation just got to figure what to build it up with I considered in weld maybe epoxy heck. I should just have a smith take care of it.

 

[Prairieofthedog]

Thank you. Mr. Zonie most of the time I ask I read the Lyman manual and it said to do it. I know better to tinker with things lesson will be learned on this situation just got to figure what to build it up with I considered in weld maybe epoxy heck. I should just have a smith take care of it.

All 3 of my Lyman guns have a gap between the bolster and the lockplate.In Lyman's instructions for putting a kit gun together they say there should be a gap.Not a big gap but,just a little clearance around the bolster.And if you are going to file,I would file the lockplate not the bolster.Mine shoot fine.

 

[Howie1968]

All 3 of my Lyman guns have a gap between the bolster and the lockplate.In Lyman's instructions for putting a kit gun together they say there should be a gap.Not a big gap but,just a little clearance around the bolster.And if you are going to file,I would file the lockplate not the bolster.Mine shoot fine.

Yes sir I seen that in the instructions that's why I did it.

 

[MSW]

Howie, i'm not trying to jump in your stuff, but, like, wow man … this is a forum with a LOT of guys … guys who take the rules very seriously and who don't really care about anyone's 'safe space,' so here's some free advice:


Don't let on that you read the instructions. If you do feel compelled to read the instructions, do so in your truck, with the windows rolled up, at the far side of the parking lot, so that nobody can see you. Then cover the instructions with empty beer cans incase the police pull you over for broken tail light or somesuch. If you ever refer to the instructions, avoid admitting that you're read them. instead, couch the reference in terms such as "I was told by my girlfriend/wife/boyfriend/significant other that the instructions say …" or "I heard that Lyman says to do thus- and- such …"

directly admitting that you read the instructions to anything is an automatic deduction of fifty points from your man- card, last I heard … i'm not sure because (a) that would imply that I read the instructions to the man- card and (b) that I would let anyone tell me what to do with my man- card … once had someone ask if I ate quiche. I told him that I liked quiche, that I ate quiche all the fXCXIXG time, that I made better quiche than he could even think about, and that telling me what to eat or not to eat was hazardous to his health. "hazardous to my health?" ayup - telling me what to eat could get your a$$ kicked, and that would be hazardous to your health. (don't ever get into a fight with an old man. he has little left to lose, nothing left to prove, and like as not, he'll just kill you.

now as to how much powder to put into a pistol. I completely agree with Zonie, who does a great deal of actual shooting. Not saying anything bad about Lyman - - or about engineers … they know all about the tool that has torque and the angle of the dangle, but i'd go with Zonie's advice, because practical experience beats the theoretical each time and every time. If thirty grains was getting you tight groups, by all means stick with that... cranking up the charge doesn't (in my experience) gain you anything.

Check out Dutch Schoultz' method - he has some good insight on the subject of what he calls "magnumitis." … here's a link:

http://blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

by the way, if you don't already have his method, you should buy it. This is far and away the best non- shooting accessory you can buy. (this doesn't count as "reading the instructions," since it's a 'method' and since it involves guns, and since your purchase of this method helps Dutch and the sport so, if anything, buying this would add points to your man-card.)

OK - that's my tirade... i'll climb back down off of my soap box before I fall and hurt myself.

 

[Howie1968]

Howie, i'm not trying to jump in your stuff, but, like, wow man … this is a forum with a LOT of guys … guys who take the rules very seriously and who don't really care about anyone's 'safe space,' so here's some free advice:


Don't let on that you read the instructions. If you do feel compelled to read the instructions, do so in your truck, with the windows rolled up, at the far side of the parking lot, so that nobody can see you. Then cover the instructions with empty beer cans incase the police pull you over for broken tail light or somesuch. If you ever refer to the instructions, avoid admitting that you're read them. instead, couch the reference in terms such as "I was told by my girlfriend/wife/boyfriend/significant other that the instructions say …" or "I heard that Lyman says to do thus- and- such …"

directly admitting that you read the instructions to anything is an automatic deduction of fifty points from your man- card, last I heard … i'm not sure because (a) that would imply that I read the instructions to the man- card and (b) that I would let anyone tell me what to do with my man- card … once had someone ask if I ate quiche. I told him that I liked quiche, that I ate quiche all the fXCXIXG time, that I made better quiche than he could even think about, and that telling me what to eat or not to eat was hazardous to his health. "hazardous to my health?" ayup - telling me what to eat could get your a$$ kicked, and that would be hazardous to your health. (don't ever get into a fight with an old man. he has little left to lose, nothing left to prove, and like as not, he'll just kill you.

now as to how much powder to put into a pistol. I completely agree with Zonie, who does a great deal of actual shooting. Not saying anything bad about Lyman - - or about engineers … they know all about the tool that has torque and the angle of the dangle, but i'd go with Zonie's advice, because practical experience beats the theoretical each time and every time. If thirty grains was getting you tight groups, by all means stick with that... cranking up the charge doesn't (in my experience) gain you anything.

Check out Dutch Schoultz' method - he has some good insight on the subject of what he calls "magnumitis." … here's a link:

http://blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

by the way, if you don't already have his method, you should buy it. This is far and away the best non- shooting accessory you can buy. (this doesn't count as "reading the instructions," since it's a 'method' and since it involves guns, and since your purchase of this method h

Howie, i'm not trying to jump in your stuff, but, like, wow man … this is a forum with a LOT of guys … guys who take the rules very seriously and who don't really care about anyone's 'safe space,' so here's some free advice:


Don't let on that you read the instructions. If you do feel compelled to read the instructions, do so in your truck, with the windows rolled up, at the far side of the parking lot, so that nobody can see you. Then cover the instructions with empty beer cans incase the police pull you over for broken tail light or somesuch. If you ever refer to the instructions, avoid admitting that you're read them. instead, couch the reference in terms such as "I was told by my girlfriend/wife/boyfriend/significant other that the instructions say …" or "I heard that Lyman says to do thus- and- such …"

directly admitting that you read the instructions to anything is an automatic deduction of fifty points from your man- card, last I heard … i'm not sure because (a) that would imply that I read the instructions to the man- card and (b) that I would let anyone tell me what to do with my man- card … once had someone ask if I ate quiche. I told him that I liked quiche, that I ate quiche all the fXCXIXG time, that I made better quiche than he could even think about, and that telling me what to eat or not to eat was hazardous to his health. "hazardous to my health?" ayup - telling me what to eat could get your a$$ kicked, and that would be hazardous to your health. (don't ever get into a fight with an old man. he has little left to lose, nothing left to prove, and like as not, he'll just kill you.

now as to how much powder to put into a pistol. I completely agree with Zonie, who does a great deal of actual shooting. Not saying anything bad about Lyman - - or about engineers … they know all about the tool that has torque and the angle of the dangle, but i'd go with Zonie's advice, because practical experience beats the theoretical each time and every time. If thirty grains was getting you tight groups, by all means stick with that... cranking up the charge doesn't (in my experience) gain you anything.

Check out Dutch Schoultz' method - he has some good insight on the subject of what he calls "magnumitis." … here's a link:

http://blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

by the way, if you don't already have his method, you should buy it. This is far and away the best non- shooting accessory you can buy. (this doesn't count as "reading the instructions," since it's a 'method' and since it involves guns, and since your purchase of this method helps Dutch and the sport so, if anything, buying this would add points to your man-card.)

OK - that's my tirade... i'll climb back down off of my soap box before I fall and hurt myself.

elps Dutch and the sport so, if anything, buying this would add points to your man-card.)

OK - that's my tirade... i'll climb back down off of my soap box before I fall and hurt myself. That was funny!! I've learned to eat humble pie. The guys are great around here have helped me tons since my adventure back into traditional muzzleloading. As zonie stated I should have asked questions first. I didn't. However I put a thin piece of sand pa per on the cut out for bolster and it tightened it right up. So I may find metal epoxy put a thin coat where the tiny gaps are

 

[Zonie]

For the record, I don't mind seeing that someone has read the Instructions that came with their gun. In fact, I'm happy to see that someone does.

That said, I don't agree with Lyman saying there should be clearance between the lock plate and the bolster on the gun. Just a difference of opinion based on my engineering background and my understanding of what is actually happening when the hammer falls on a cap.

 

[bubba.50]

Thank you Phil until I messed with this morning it was solid. I knew better I just did to much reading forums over the Christmas holiday. I've never bedded anything before so I may have to find a gunsmith in my area

A little knowledge is a terrible thing ain’t it? JK

I’d probanly tighten up the barrel/tang fit in the barrel channel with a thin coat of accraglass or JB & call it good.

 

[Howie1968]

I shimmed her with a thin piece of sand paper she is solid now, ill go forward and become better because of it I took off the thickness of paper to much. im sure all will be fine. thanks for all the input advice well taken

 

[Stantheman86]

Massive powder charges will usually result in half of the charge being blown out unburned.

Remember, 60 grains of 2f is the Service Charge for a .58 Minie ball out of a 39" barrel Rifle-Musket. 30 grains is probably a good, healthy load for a pistol.

Historically even the .54 pistols like the Aston used what would equate to 35 gr of 2f today, and those were meant to reach out so mounted soldiers could join the Infantry in volley fire.

I think I went up to 40 in my .54 Plains Pistol and the gun felt like it was telling me to stop doing that.

 

[Grimord]

35 grains of 3f with a .015 mink oil lubed patch is my go to load for the 54 Lyman Plains pistol. I get decent 2" groups,off hand, at 25 yards with this load. That is about as far as I shoot with this gun. If at a shoot, I might stretch it out to 35 yards if the target is big enough for me to see with the iron sights.

 

[Stantheman86]

I'd like to try these for a .50 or .54 Plains pistol.

My .54 has pretty much been built up into a .54 Target pistol for bullets but I'd gladly buy another one.

 

[Howie1968]

I got her back to normal nice Nd tight like I bought her from Mr. Torpedo. Big lessons learned before I tinker I'll post first. I went with JB quick surprisingly it blended well a light coat and smoothed it out. Back to how she was got some does coming 12 yards from my blind tempting to tie one with the pistol next week during muzzleloading season but may use my flintlock instead

 

[Treestalker]

Hi, Howie, I would pack both your guns on the upcoming hunt; if opportunity arises, use the pistol. By the way, my esteemed brother in law used to live at *******, where that horrible Chupacabra creature was seen. He still lives out that way somewhere but says he's never seen it, in spite of being a woods rambler and known to take a drink or two.

 

[Howie1968]

I live about 2 miles from ******* off 94 in Angelina county. Can step out my door and be into the pigs in 5 minutes. I've got property available to me in Trinity,Angelina,Houston and Nacogdoches county plus all the national Forrest and WMAs it's the hub for everything hunting and fishing except turkey