Man Died From Muzzle Loader Accident

[Sidney Smith]

I think a person has got to be stupid if they place a firearm in a vehicle in such a way that theyre are placing themselves in front of the muzzle when retrieving it.

 

[toot]

Same here.
They will ignite because the powder can flow right next to the vent.

.38 Special posted:
"My flintlocks tend to have thinned and enlarged touch holes, and I ensure that powder from the main charge is visible before I prime the pan. On a bet, I once fired my best rifle four times in a row without priming the pan, and I suspect the misfire on the fifth go-round would have been avoided if I'd touched up the flint."

I read an interesting post about there being some antique flintlocks that were known as
"self-priming flintlocks" because they had large vents, large enough for powder to dribble into the pan during the loading process.
After the gun was loaded, it could also be bumped on the ground to help powder grains trickle into the pan.
This was a desirable trait for military guns and for hunting on horseback when accurate shooting and misfires were not as much of a concern.
The military would fire by volleys and Indians would hunt buffalo at point blank range so there wasn't much concern about misfires.
Unless the vent was plugged before loading they knew that the pan was already primed.

original BEOWN BESSE'S were made with an extra large vent to facilitate priming on loading, eliminating priming first, after biting off the end of the paper cartridge.

 

[toot]

I think a person has got to be stupid if they place a firearm in a vehicle in such a way that theyre are placing themselves in front of the muzzle when retrieving it.

common, the guy is dead! accidents happen. that's why they are called accidents.

 

[Sparkitoff]

This is a tragedy. Thankfully, there are lessons to be learned and anyone who reads this should be more cautious.

Interesting to me, I have researched various sources and information varies widely but claims there are anywhere from 30 to 170 times more cartridge firearms "in use" then muzzleloading implements. When the # is in the tens of millions to begin with that's a lot more cartridge shooters. When you research "accidents", where a person was injured or killed by their own firearms non-intentionally, there are as many or more stories involving muzzleloaders. When you look at accidentally killing another person, there again are equal or more muzzleloader stories compared to "modern", almost all in a hunting scenario.

The second one I could take a stab at. Without telescopic sights it is more difficult to identify a target and if you put iron sights on something you block out a lot of it. A person that would do that has got to be irresponsible, untrained or inexperienced. So that may explain a slightly disproportional ratio of accidentally shooting someone else with a muzzleloader.

So why the disproportion? Maybe because a muzzleloader is "different" it gets more attention or sensationalism and is "advertised" more. That would mean the real #'s are skewed. Maybe we need more muzzleloader safety education. Maybe muzzleloaders are misunderstood. After all, there is typically no mechanical safety. A lot of places there would be no opportunity to clear the gun on a hunt due to laws (near a road, no "promiscuous" shooting on public land, discharge after dark, etc.) So we are left with UNCAP it or UNPRIME, it + cover frizzen and lower ****, plug flashhole. How about USE A CASE.

The basic safety rules apply universally but there are specifics to muzzleloaders that need emphasis. I had advocated for a "emptying station" on public land near parking areas during muzzleloader season. With some kind of safe backstop that is lighted, muzzleoaders could be emptied safely before getting to the vehicles. While this would be voluntary compliance, it might encourage some people. I don't advocate more laws, but maybe a rule at least on public land that you have to unload at the unload station each day and you cannot arrive with a loaded muzzleloader with a consequence of losing a day's privilege. Something not detrimental but motivating.

Anyway, I AM and advocate of safety, safety, safety!

 

[sackettboys]

Sorry for the family, but always follow the cardinal rule.

 

[HiDesertHunter]

no "promiscuous" shooting on public land, discharge after dark, etc.)

I have never heard of a no 'promiscuous' or after dark restrictions to shooting on public land but if there please educate me - along with with a definition of what 'promiscuous shooting' is.

I live surrounded by about 1/2 Million acres of public land (National Forest) and have no such restrictions.

 

[Sparkitoff]

When I lived in NYS there was a law on public land that said "No promiscuous shooting". I never had a clear definition but was told it is any shooting other than at legal game. I've lived in 7 States and 1 US Territory and several local laws in different places prohibited discharging a firearm after legal shooting hours, regardless of the purpose (with few exceptions clearly outlined).

 

[arcticap]

I have never heard of a no 'promiscuous' or after dark restrictions to shooting on public land but if there please educate me - along with with a definition of what 'promiscuous shooting' is.

I live surrounded by about 1/2 Million acres of public land (National Forest) and have no such restrictions.

My state land reg's state "no target shooting".
One definition of "promiscuous" is " demonstrating or implying an undiscriminating or unselective approach; indiscriminate or casual. " which could be considered to be an illegal discharge.

If the discharge is after dark then that could be mis-interpreted by a warden as hunting after legal hours.
Raccoon season is exempt from night hunting reg's but may not be concurrent with deer season.

I'm fairly certain that Federal land is covered by state hunting regulations.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Since we don't know the details it's impossible to say exactly what went wrong.

Actually, WE DO....,

"Treat every firearm as if it were loaded...,
Always point a firearm in a safe direction...,"

So, he was shot in the chest while extracting the muzzle loader from the trunk of his car after having gone hunting, then both of the above were violated.

It's a sad thing when an accident such as this happens, and I hope I don't seem too "cold" by pointing out the above information.

LD

 

[HiDesertHunter]

My state land reg's state "no target shooting".

Man that's terrible!

I couldn't live like that!

 

[arcticap]

Actually, WE DO....,

"Treat every firearm as if it were loaded...,
Always point a firearm in a safe direction...,"

So, he was shot in the chest while extracting the muzzle loader from the trunk of his car after having gone hunting, then both of the above were violated.

It's a sad thing when an accident such as this happens, and I hope I don't seem too "cold" by pointing out the above information.

LD

Why did you leave out the relevant part of my quote?
I essentially stated the exact same comment in Post #15 on page 1 of this thread:

"Since we don't know the details it's impossible to say exactly what went wrong.
But there have been cases of powder being set off by static electricity.
No one wants to speculate, but all we really know is that the muzzle wasn't pointed in a safe direction at all times." --->>> Man Died From Muzzle Loader Accident

 

[arcticap]

Man that's terrible!
I couldn't live like that!

If a person is target shooting on state hunting property then that can interfere with the rights of other citizens to hunt on the same property.
Hunting is given a preference because wildlife conservation activities are the primary purpose of state lands.
There's a difference between state land and Federal land, and even Federal land can have target shooting restrictions.
Most states have some shooting ranges located on state land which are exempt from restrictions but they're far and few between.

" Target shooting is allowed on national forest or grassland unless restricted. Check your local ranger district for more information about local restriction." --->>> Shooting | US Forest Service

You may not be aware if any restrictions are in place during a particular hunting season unless you ask. It's clear that they want folks to check.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Why did you leave out the relevant part of my quote?
but all we really know is that the muzzle wasn't pointed in a safe direction at all times."

Because I had somebody talking to me over my shoulder and allowed myself to be distracted, and feel silly now....

LD

 

[HiDesertHunter]

You may not be aware if any restrictions are in place during a particular hunting season unless you asked.

In the National Forest where I live there are no such restrictions although most sport/target/varmint shooters will take a 'break' during the popular hunting seasons or use gravel pits or other areas that relatively close in to avoid interfering with hunters.

Typically my own shooting spots are relatively close to town and not far from the main road and even if I do happen to be shooting during a hunting season I rarely see hunters.

I do however occasionally hear shots near my house during certain seasons as animals are sometime killed fairly close to me.

 

[Fire-Steel]

Walter Cline whos name graces the home range of the NMLRA in Friendship Indiana accidentally shot himself in the chest with his favorite rifle trying to retrieve it. His house keeper heard the shot and found him unconscious with a bullet wound to the chest in the livingroom surrounded by many of his favored long rifles.
A sad end to such a icon. It takes but a second

 

[Okie Hog]

This is not debatable. NEARLY all so called 'accidental discharges' are not accidental but due to negligence.

Yep, i often see the term "accidental discharge". 99 and 44/100 percent are negligent discharges.

 

[Griz44Mag]

If a person is target shooting on state hunting property then that can interfere with the rights of other citizens to hunt on the same property.
Hunting is given a preference because wildlife conservation activities are the primary purpose of state lands.
There's a difference between state land and Federal land, and even Federal land can have target shooting restrictions.
Most states have some shooting ranges located on state land which are exempt from restrictions but they're far and few between.

" Target shooting is allowed on national forest or grassland unless restricted. Check your local ranger district for more information about local restriction." --->>> Shooting | US Forest Service

You may not be aware if any restrictions are in place during a particular hunting season unless you ask. It's clear that they want folks to check.

Another thing you may want to check, even here in the great state of Texas, some ML activity is restricted during county ordered burn bans. Wild grasses, which we have a lot of, can easily be set to burn by a smoldering patch. Therefore we do see burn bans on outdoor fires not contained in approved cooking appliances and muzzleloaders.