Maybe a Cheaper way out?

[Frontstuffer070]

I was thinking this morning over a cup of Joe. I have 3 Traditions Percussion guns, a Kentucky Pistol, Kentucky Rifle, and Hawken Woodsman. All three shoot amazingly well for the price paid, so the barrels in my opinion are GTG! SO, if one got a Traditions Kentucky Flintlock Kit, and then ordered an L&R Lock for it, or maybe just Hardened the frizzen on the lock that comes with it, . One could also do some things to spiff it up a tad, like inlet a side plate, carvings, etc. I know beech isn't the prettiest wood for a stock, but its tough. I think you could come in ( labor not included) well under the price of any of the higher tier kits and end up with a really nice and reliable rifle. Yeah I guess you would have to deal with a two piece stock which isn't that desirable. But , I blackened the brass union on my Kentucky and it isn't as noticeable. Anyway, just random thoughts over a cup of Joe, Ya'll have a good day.

 

[azmntman]

I may do that very thing (lock) on my CVA hawkin flintlock. I believe I could do whatever "minor" inletting needed to fit it. I got to get it back to the range first and make sure it's the shooter I am thinking. I only shot it once, three shots at 25 yds right after I bought it. Couldn't tell it was three shots other than it looked like a .54 hole. My caplock is 2" at 90 yds all day so if this one is the same and I cannot "tune" the lock a bit I will probably get the replacement. Looks fancy enough without any ad on's for my simple soul. I'm into accuracy first!

 

[54ball]

I was thinking this morning over a cup of Joe. I have 3 Traditions Percussion guns, a Kentucky Pistol, Kentucky Rifle, and Hawken Woodsman. All three shoot amazingly well for the price paid, so the barrels in my opinion are GTG! SO, if one got a Traditions Kentucky Flintlock Kit, and then ordered an L&R Lock for it, or maybe just Hardened the frizzen on the lock that comes with it, . One could also do some things to spiff it up a tad, like inlet a side plate, carvings, etc. I know beech isn't the prettiest wood for a stock, but its tough. I think you could come in ( labor not included) well under the price of any of the higher tier kits and end up with a really nice and reliable rifle. Yeah I guess you would have to deal with a two piece stock which isn't that desirable. But , I blackened the brass union on my Kentucky and it isn't as noticeable. Anyway, just random thoughts over a cup of Joe, Ya'll have a good day.

False economy in my opinion.
How much is a Traditions Kit?
$499 not counting shipping
How much is a RPL lock?
$241 not counting shipping
499
241
740
+shipping.....
So, roughly $840 for a traditions kit with a new L &R RPL lock.

How much is the brass for the side plate?
How stuff do you need to “harden” and or tune this new but needs work lock?

Anyway you slice it, you are nearly into a $1000.
The base Colonial kit from Track is less than that.
For just a little more you can get a Kibler and not.....Go down the rabbit trail trying to make a Traditions kit something it’s not.

Hey I like the Traditions Kentucky. It has it’s place but it’s a waste of time and money to make one more than what it is.

 

[hawkeye2]

Any of the inexpensive imports can be greatly improved without spending a lot on parts. Over the years there have been photos posted here by members who have done just that. Refining the wood areas like the lock panels and forearm can make a big difference. Ad a new side plate and modify the nose cap, possibly ad some simple inlays. Stain the wood and use a soft non shiny finish. Beech is a fine wood for gun stocks but not the best appearing. The best thing about modifying an inexpensive gun is that it gives you a chance to try your ideas and work on your gun building skills and build confidence. The finished project may not be worth any more than what you started with but chances it'll look better and if it doesn't you aren't out much.

 

[Banjoman]

I am not a gun brand snob. I shoot different brands and types of muzzleloaders and all mine work the way they’re supposed to, stock from the factory. Some were bought new and some used. The used ones did need a little work but we’re talking $75 & $100 guns. If I put several hundred dollars into a new gun, I expect it to work without modifications. So if I were buying a new Traditions flintlock, I’d probably just shoot it as is to determine if it’s gonna work right.

Without saying too much, I have some cheap muzzleloaders and some not so cheap muzzleloaders. But, if it were me spending close to a grand, I’d go with something like a Kibler or Chambers even used. I’ve had the pleasure of holding Brooks, Martin and Lambert muzzleloaders. Didn’t have the cash needed at the time to bring them home. Even though Traditions and CVA guns are usually accurate, you can definitely feel the difference in quality between them and custom guns just by holding them.

 

[azmntman]

False economy in my opinion.
How much is a Traditions Kit?
$499 not counting shipping
How much is a RPL lock?
$241 not counting shipping
499
241
740
+shipping.....
So, roughly $840 for a traditions kit with a new L &R RPL lock.

How much is the brass for the side plate?
How stuff do you need to “harden” and or tune this new but needs work lock?

Anyway you slice it, you are nearly into a $1000.
The base Colonial kit from Track is less than that.
For just a little more you can get a Kibler and not.....Go down the rabbit trail trying to make a Traditions kit something it’s not.

Hey I like the Traditions Kentucky. It has it’s place but it’s a waste of time and money to make one more than what it is.

Agree 100% BUT when a gun will allow ME to get 2" groups at near 100 yds I will keep it just for the barrel and set up that allows that to happen. I have more expensive guns that have come and gone that would only do 4-6 Inches at that range and out they went! So if my Traditions Flintlock is as good a shooter as the caplock the R&L upgrade is money well spent just for piece of mind.

 

[longcruise]

@Frontstuffer070 I think if you give careful consideration to what both @54ball and @hawkeye2 say above you can make a good decision. It's your time and money so spend it as you see fit.

 

[Frontstuffer070]

@Frontstuffer070 I think if you give careful consideration to what both @54ball and @hawkeye2 say above you can make a good decision. It's your time and money so spend it as you see fit.

Oh No! Don't get me wrong, I'm not going to go that route. I'm gonna order a Kibler Kit soon. I was just thinking about that this morning. What I didn't realize is I'm a shade behind on the cost of the traditions kits. I didn't pay anywhere near that kit price a while back for my factory built Traditions guns.

 

[Grenadier1758]

@Frontstuffer already has the Traditions Kentucky Rifle. That’s a sunk cost and should not be part of the cost calculations. The cost is limited to the cost of the RPL lock and the labor. The gain is having an improved lock on an already familiar rifle. The other gain is an improved stain and some custom features to get a quality finish on his personal rifle. This will become an even greater benefit as he comfortably takes on the eventual assembly of a Kibler rifle some time in the future. Sure, the Traditions rifle will always be a Traditions rifle, but it will be Frontstuffer's special Traditions rifle. He should go for it.

 

[Frontstuffer070]

@Frontstuffer already has the Traditions Kentucky Rifle. That’s a sunk cost and should not be part of the cost calculations. The cost is limited to the cost of the RPL lock and the labor. The gain is having an improved lock on an already familiar rifle. The other gain is an improved stain and some custom features to get a quality finish on his personal rifle. This will become an even greater benefit as he comfortably takes on the eventual assembly of a Kibler rifle some time in the future. Sure, the Traditions rifle will always be a Traditions rifle, but it will be Frontstuffer's special Traditions rifle. He should go for it.

Unfortunately, all of my guns are cap snappers. If one of them was a rock lock, I would already be tearing it down haha. I was just milling over the costs of higher end kits and thinking of what may be a cheaper way around it. But seems I was wrong. You are right about gaining some experience before tackling the Kibler kit. Truth be told I'm gonna be scared to death to touch the thing when I actually do get that nice wood crate in here.

 

[azmntman]

Had mine 8-9 months, in the white. EXACTLY my fear. It's so "perfect" I am afraid to mess it up just finishing the stock and browning the hardware!

 

[azmntman]

I also bought a new Traditions cap lock kit to practice on! $310.00 clearance so It was worth it and I may try my first inlay when I get around to it!

 

[Frontstuffer070]

I'm probably gonna dunk my Kentucky pistol barrel in some vinegar to remove the factory bluing, then try out this Herman Danglers browning solution that I got for the Kibler kit. I've already been messing with brass black. I seem to have gotten that down pat and I like the look I got from that.

 

[SDSmlf]

then try out this Herman Danglers browning solution that I got for the Kibler kit.

Not familiar with the Herman Danglers product line, but their was guy named Homer Dangler that passed away 5 years ago or so that sold some good stuff.

 

[Frontstuffer070]

You're right my mistake. It is Homer Danglers.

 

[1:66 twisted]

Probably off topic so these are just my ramblings.

Back in the 80's I started off with a used 50 cal poorboy from Dixie Gun Works. (My favorite). Then I just had to have a cva Hawken 1:66 twist. (Wonderful gun). Then I got married had kids. Sold everything.

Now I am a couple months from 60. I have had the desire to get back into muzzleloaders. So I bought a bunch of Ebay parts, bad move! Then I bought a Traditions Kentucky kit, another bad move. Then I decided to go to a WKU class put on by NMLRA. (The right move).

My desire now for my retirement years is to build a more affordable muzzleloader. Both rifle and smoothbore that a blue collar worker can afford and be happy with.

So after building a SMR kit at WKU, I want nothing to do with the CVA , TRADITIONS kits anymore. Just my crazy thoughts this early morning.

And I am not knocking anyone with a CVA or Traditions kit rifle!!!

 

[azmntman]

Get a Kibler kit and an extra barrel and your set.

 

[Frontstuffer070]

Probably off topic so these are just my ramblings.

Back in the 80's I started off with a used 50 cal poorboy from Dixie Gun Works. (My favorite). Then I just had to have a cva Hawken 1:66 twist. (Wonderful gun). Then I got married had kids. Sold everything.

Now I am a couple months from 60. I have had the desire to get back into muzzleloaders. So I bought a bunch of Ebay parts, bad move! Then I bought a Traditions Kentucky kit, another bad move. Then I decided to go to a WKU class put on by NMLRA. (The right move).

My desire now for my retirement years is to build a more affordable muzzleloader. Both rifle and smoothbore that a blue collar worker can afford and be happy with.

So after building a SMR kit at WKU, I want nothing to do with the CVA , TRADITIONS kits anymore. Just my crazy thoughts this early morning.

And I am not knocking anyone with a CVA or Traditions kit rifle!!!

Thank you for your thoughts. That's why we are all here. I don't disagree with you at all. I think the Spanish guns are great for what they are and they do to others exactly what they have done to me, get your foot in the door so to speak. I have taken quite a few deer with my Traditions Kentucky, haven't hunted with the Traditions Hawken Woodsman yet, so we will see. My plan is to get a Woodsrunner and then the Fowler when they get that line up and running. I'm hoping the Fowler will be in 20ga. Will I sell my Spanish guns after that is accomplished? Not sure, time will tell. Actually, I'm hoping my 12 year old will want one of the Spaniard's.

 

[sb 54 cal.]

I built the Traditions Kentucky kit and made it the way I wanted it. Even put an L&R lock on it. Have several muzzleloaders flint and cap. Do what makes you happy no one else will. My 2 cents.

 

[APG]

I have a Traditions Kentucky flintlock rifle that I changed locks to a L&R lock and could not be happier. It seems that some folks on this site feel that if it isn't a Kibler it's not worth anything. Don't get me wrong Kibler puts out quality rifles. But going the Traditions and L&R lock works for me. Just my opinions on the matter.