Middle Eastern muzzleloaders??

Muzzleloading Forum

Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Joined
Aug 10, 2007
Messages
4,096
Reaction score
8,353
Location
Nor Cal
First thought, Arabian, Iranian, Egyptian ???, In the the movie "Hidalgo", a well decorated/embellished longer than most muzzleloader was fired to start the race.
Anybody ever see or own one? Thinking a killer wall hanger. šŸ˜ :cool:
 
Big region many varience's Photo would help Rick would know , I might but if I do'nt Ile weave some incomprehensable waffle ! . More seriously I do have a few clues . Regards Rudyard
 
I watched the movie Hidalgo when it was first released to the movie theaters back then. Watched it 2-3 more times later on. Was a good movie.
The gun that was fired (or pretended to fire - Hollywood you know) is an original Algerian musket. This style of long gun was unique to this Region. They can be found plain to highly decorated, and all points in between., in a variety of different ways. Even though the guns were decorated depending on the customer's requirements and what he could afford, the guns were built following a long used general pattern.
The forearm of the stock looks like they were shortened. But they were actually built this way. A sort of 3/4 length stock. Every one I've seen is built this way. They used a ball-style trigger, and no trigger guard.
The barrels on almost all are tapered octagon with no swell at the muzzle. The barrels were high quality imports from Europe with thick breeches and a dramatic taper to the muzzle. They are all smooth bore and usually run about 60-65 caliber.
The locks are a strange looking hybrid of sorts. Many of the general characteristics of the lock copy the very earliest Spanish miquelet locks. Post wheellock period. They all have a dog-style safety latch at the rear of the lock plate. Historically, the Spanish locks operated from the heel of the hammer, pushing DOWN on the mainspring. But these Algerian locks operate from the toe of the hammer, similar to Italian (Roman) style locks, pushing UP on the mainspring. Interestingly, these locks are both signed and dated on the bottom of the mainspring area. The mainsprings are very strong and chew up flints quickly. LOL

I own two of these Algerian muskets. Here's some pics of the first. It's decorated with lots of ivory/bone inlays and 5 silver barrel bands. It's .60 caliber smooth bore. An inspection of the bore shows no more than a possible test fire. It's likely fully safe to shoot today. But I have another shooter I'll post after, as well as a close up of the lock details.

Rick
DSC00384 (Medium).JPG
DSC00385 (Medium).JPG
DSC00386 (Medium).JPG
DSC00391 (Medium).JPG
DSC00396 (Medium).JPG
DSC00399 (Medium).JPG
DSC00413 (Medium).JPG
 
Pictured? šŸ˜ :cool: Just what I had in mind. Lots of silver and ivory inlays is what caught my eye. Hard to remember but they seemed to be much longer. Still an eye catcher. Thanks for posting the pictures. :thumb:
 
Here is a more plain gun for shooting. It sports a Hoyt barrel liner and is now a .58 caliber smooth bore. Notice the pronounced lock plate in relation to the stock. While miquelet style locks require less wood removal due to their mainspring being on the outside of the lock plate, these Algerian lock plates sit proud from the wood, requiring a minimal of wood removal. Every one I've seen is built this way.

Rick
Algerian Rifle-2 001 (Medium).jpg
Algerian Rifle-2 005 (Medium).jpg
Algerian Rifle-2 006 (Medium).jpg
Algerian Rifle-2 004 (Medium).jpg
Algerian Rifle-2 011 (Medium).jpg
Algerian Rifle-2 013 (Medium).jpg
 
Wonderfull responce & guns .I have just one Mookahla very similar but a complete ' bitzer' ie made from correct but un related original parts and parts I had to make to suit like a new battery & bridle plate , pics later .
Regards Rudyard
PS the correct name for these gun is assurabley NOT' Jezzail 'anything your miles away your are confusing Algeria with Afghanistan there's a lot of dusty miles between them and Iv'e crossed both of them and the bit in between. I am being unkind sorry but it is a common error many make. R
 
Last edited:
Something I saw took me by surprise, unfortunately Iā€™ve not researched it so canā€™t back this up with evidence that Iā€™ve at-least confirmed for my self.
It seems that the Afghans made extensive use of rifles in eighteenth century built in general Arabic gun style
 
The Turks and Persians had rifled guns Afghanistan borders Persia . .Not quite sure where a sternam is but new one on me . But Iv'e struggled with Petronels they don't make much sense either but they had them. .I think until you have an original or good copy you cant really suss how practical or not the gun is.. We do have a good start point they had arms & legs same as we do today if maybe we are a bit bigger but same basic frame or could I say 'Platform'.

General Arabic ? their mostly Muslim but hardly Arabic It reminds me of an outhouse in Persia it had their script and underneath it had CW. their language is like ours it varies greatly .If I make one of their guns I sign it with what looks like 2525 it means or did to the Moroccan who told me ' La Bess' ie 'No Evil' translate that to ' its OK' I probably write it backwards but it the same script visually
Regards Rudyard
 
Last edited:
In the early 1970s I was in Afghanistan, in Jalalabad. There were gunmakers making
muzzle loaders for domestic use by the tribes. I also saw repairing going on.
I was told more gunmakers were at the Pakistan Border making a wide variety of
guns in these small shops. I saw most tribal men bearing muzzle loading arms.
At the time ,Russia was occupying some areas. These were highly decorated pieces.
They had leather straps.
 
I have wondered why all of the frizzens on these guns have many groves cut in them?
 

Latest posts

Back
Top