• Friends, our 2nd Amendment rights are always under attack and the NRA has been a constant for decades in helping fight that fight.

    We have partnered with the NRA to offer you a discount on membership and Muzzleloading Forum gets a small percentage too of each membership, so you are supporting both the NRA and us.

    Use this link to sign up please; https://membership.nra.org/recruiters/join/XR045103

Multi ball- large buck shot loads?

Muzzleloading Forum

Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Joined
Feb 28, 2007
Messages
10,843
Reaction score
18,233
Location
England.
Have any of you knowledgable fellers ever tried a load of 3-4 .45 balls in a 12g? I tried it in a cartridge and it is quite effective some (years ago).
I have a number of .45 and .58 balls and was wondering if the powder charge is kept low how many I could shoot- I imagine four .45 or three .58.
Any ideas any body?
 
Some of the conicals for large bores weigh 700+ grains this could be used as a guide to how many balls, or the weight of a heavy shot charge always consider the individual barrel type/strength.
 
There's part of me that is uncomfortable shooting balls that could wedge in the barrel. I'm sure the same thing happens when you load pairs of 36 caliber balls in 4 or 5 layers but worry about that less. I just think that there would be a lot more sideways pressure when one 45 cal ball is pushing at a 45 degree or less angle to the next and so on. Wonder if anyone has shot the loads you suggest in a pressure barrel? GC
 
Guncobbler,
I don't think pressure would be a problem here. After all, they shot buck and ball loads way back.
However, three .45 balls would surely deform in a twelve gauge barrel, severly I should think. .58's would likely just spread too rapidly to be of much use as a load.
volatpluia
 
I have conducted an experiment with my 12g double that I have acquired. Using 1oz equiv of powder, a card and a fiber wad rammed done the bore I then placed an o/s card down an inch- now I cut a strip of heavy canvass at 1"x5" and wrapped two .58 balls in the canvass and sat them on the o/s card and sent them down and then added another o/s card. Both barrels at 40yds would of killed a buck no problem. It,s a long winded load affair but it woks and I am sure it could be improved upon. Apart from load development prewrapping the projectiles would save some time- that is if you are in a rush :hatsoff:
 
I don't think the balls will ride up on each other. A modern 12ga load of 00 buck is loaded similiarly. (The balls are too big to lay in the load flat)
 
One of the most effective loads I had worked up for my fusil de chasse - was a .600 ball and 7 .25 rb - I shot an elk with one of those loads at about 15 yds once - he went down like he had be pole axed - tore up his heart, lungs, broke a shoulder and hit him in the spine too
 
Henrietta Arnow refers several times to the early Tennessee pioneers using a "handfull" of rifle balls in a musket as a weapon. For close range warfare it would be devastating, but how well it work for hunting I don't know.
 
00 buck will lay in layers of 3 in a 12 gauge, a 20 requires you to use smaller balls. The standard 12 gauge 00 buck load is 9 balls.
 
I wonder if corn meal could be used like the plastic powdered buffer which is added to heavily loaded modern shothells to improve patterns?
Someone must have tried it already.
 
arcticap said:
I wonder if corn meal could be used like the plastic powdered buffer which is added to heavily loaded modern shothells to improve patterns?
Someone must have tried it already.
Corn meal compresses so it doesn' work as well but it helps... hope this helps Shel :hmm:
 
Corn meal absorbs moisture from the air easily , and your cases will swell if you use it as a shot buffer, unless you take the added step of sealing the casings with wax. In a ML, where you load the powder, wads, and shot as needed, it would take some considerable time to get the corn meal to filter down through the shot so that it is consistent. There are lighter, synthetic materials like " Puf Lon " that you can buy to do this, that don't absorb moisture, and will not swell, but are so small that they easily filter down between your shot pellets. The only problem using " Puf Lon " ist that the stuff is so light its blows away in the wind, so you want to premeasure the amount of puflon needed for each load, and carry it in a separate tube. Then all you have to do is dump the stuff down the barrel, and run your OS card down on top of it. The air being pushed ahead of the OS card should push the Puflon down in and throughout the pellets, displacing the air that exists between the pellets. If you carry Corn Meal in a metal flask with a good valve closer, it should not take on moisture readily in the field, and you might be able to use it effectively. Don't use the coarse ground corn meal like you get from mills. Buy the corn meal that is sold in the grocery store in mixes, because it is much more finely ground, more like flour. The finer the meal, the better job it will do cushioning the shot pellets.

Personally, I think you will get better patterns using plated shot, and some kind of shot cup. If you keep your velocity down under the speed of sound, and use FFg powder instead of FFFg powder, you should not get pellet distortion in the barrel from firing the load, as the slower burning powder with a light charge will push the pellets without distorting the back (or bottom) row of pellets. Conversely, using heavy loads of faster burning powder slams that back row of pellets and causes them to go out-of-round.By using a shot cup, you protect the sides of the outer pellets from being flattened by rubbing against the barrel as the shot column exits the barrel. That has always been the main cause for patterns losing pellets on the fringes, and how the term " Core Pattern " came to be used to describe the middle part of a shot column that will not be distorted or flattened so that the pellets can continue to fly true. In effect, until the advent of modern plastic shot cups, and plated shot, we were sacrificing (wasting) the outer layers of pellets that we knew were going to have flats rubbed on them, which causes them to quickly slow and fall out of the core pattern. To compensate for this loss, we had to use larger gauge shotguns to get the same amount of shot in a pattern at longer range.

With the modern plastic shotcup, and plated shot, small gauge guns have been able to deliver much higher percentages of their pellets on target at longer ranges. Buffers seem to help the really large shot, Like #3, #2,#1,BB,and T shot. In " non-toxic " pellets, the buffering does not seem to do much good except with Bismuth, which tends to be brittle, and shatters on firing. I am not current on testing done using Bismuth and BP loads, but obviously the gentler shove of BP would iad in keep the Bismuth pellets together. The real problem to date has been that steel shot is so light, it doesn't retain much energy at waterfowl ranges. Some of the newer Non-toxic shot offer promises of better patterns( hevi-shot), or even being able to use them in standard shotgun barrels with standard chokes. We shall all see. To date, only a few of the newer shot manufacturers have offered the shot as a component, so that reloaders can do their own experiments. Unless its sold as a component, its not available to us BP shooters.
 
According to something i read cornmeal isn't as good as corn muffin mix. They said that it must have been the sugars in the mix that helped. Never have tried it, but i did try cream of wheat cereal. It didn't seem to help any.
 
Back
Top