Musket ID and What would you do?

[Tubi2b]

Backstory: My grandfather's uncle used to own an antique shop. Eventually, a bundle of guns made their way to my grandmother, where they sat in her attic for decades. Then they spent some time in my uncle's shed for a while. Now they are rusted to hell and sit around under my bed.

I took them to a gun shop and they guy said they were probably only worth money for scrap parts (they are truly covered in rust). So i decided id grab one and clean it up myself for a nice wall mount. Only problem is i dont know what it is. I know we have a few springfields, an unknown long rifle, a winchester .22, and an 1873 winchester pump (a 410?). Ill get some pics of them up too if i decide to clean them up to.

So here is my unknown muzzleloader, in its previous state and after i cleaned it up. We used electrolysis tanks for the rust, and refinished the stock myself. If you need pics of other parts i can take some, the barrel extends probably about another foot and a half.

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Any ideas on what it might be?.. cant find any markings, save a few unreadable symbols inside the trigger mech. I know it looks like a generic muzzleloader. Heres a couple that i dug up that look close...
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/252157/ http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?fid/16/tid/202174/

What do you think of it? Would it be worth it for me to clean up the rest of them or am i only decreasing the value by cleaning it? I know antiques are worth more in original condition.. but the condition is just horrific.

 

[Tumblernotch]

Looks like a M1854 Austrian Lorenz rifle that's been cut back to a half stock to me. If the lockplate is not too pitted you should be able to see a 3 digit number located under the bolster starting with an 8. This would be the date of manufacture. (Such as 860 for 1860). If the original front sight is still there, the base should appear to be a diamond shape. This is because the groove in the bayonet socket was cut in a spiral and the bayonet turned as it was fixed. Since it's been cut down, there's a good chance the barrel was shortened. There should be matching part numbers all over the place including the screw heads. The barrel should be about 37 inches long. If shorter, it's been cut down. There may be Belgian proofmarks on the barrel as well as any Austrian proofs. Many of these were made in Liege, Belgium under contract. One that I used to have was marked this way. (In fact, it had even been converted to flint for some reason, possibly for use in a movie).

This weapon was imported in large numbers in the ACW by both sides, especially the Confederate Army. Quite a few were used in the Army of Northern Virginia, but it appears that more were sent to the Trans-Missippi. I have seen several photos of northern soldiers equipped with them

As for whether you did the right thing, in this case probably yes. It was in relic condition besides being cut down which greatly reduced its value. It looks pretty good now and it looks like a possible shooter if the bore is good. I'd have it checked out by a gunsmith. While not on a par with the Springfield or Enfield, the Lorenz was a sturdy rifle and well made.

But be careful when restoring any of the other guns you have. Usually, all you want to do is clean them up a little. Get the grime off but don't do anything harsh. If you shine up an old gun you've probably ruined its re-sale value. On the other hand, if you want to shoot them and get them back in their original shape as much as possible, well, have at it. Just be gentle.

 

[Tubi2b]

Thanks a lot, really! thats incredible the picture you found looks exactly like it, perfect color - cant believe how bad it was before. I didnt include the barrel in the picture but it isn't cut off, but its bare with no sight. Im definately talking to a gunsmith about the other ones, and post pics of that long rifle that weve had some problems IDing.

 

[Tubi2b]

 

[dyemaker]

I read somewhere that Austrian muskets were stocked with Beech wood if this helps any. I don't know if it includes this time frame.

 

[Va.Manuf.06]

As KanawhaRanger said, it is a M1854 Austrian Lorenz Rifle Musket, heavily used by both sides in the ACW. And the stock appears to be beech as dyemaker said, this is correct. Since the barrel appears to be uncut (37.25 inches long?) it could be restored so the value is probably around $150 to someone wanting to do the work.

 

[Tumblernotch]

Mine was stocked in beech.