Muzzleloading Myths

[2 shots]

you can have just one

 

[Uncle Miltie]

Most did. Ned Robert's fine book on muzzleloading has wonderful pics and descriptions.
The False Muzzle was cut from the existing barrel, then pinned to align the bullet into the bore, IIRC.

Correct, but the cut separating the loading muzzle from the barrel was made before rifling. Afterward both pieces were clamped together and rifling the barrel would commence. If not done in this fashion the kerf from the cut would not allow perfect alignment of the rifling in both pieces.

 

[kyron4]

That's exactly what I'm talking about. If I poured straight black powder down the barrel from the container with no measurer of any kind in a recently fired gun, my viewers would crucify me!
Those guys can get away with that since they have 2 million subscribers.

They may have 2 millions subscribers but you have something they don't have, respect.

 

[david w]

In England there were multiple grades of Black Powder. I have a book on double guns made from 18th through 20th century, and among other interesting info is a sheet of velocities with the different grades of Powder from a Major Gun firm.
It appears to have been a big thing then, to some people, same as today.

Correct me if I'm wrong. If you have a mesh that makes 2f, wont there be some finer grains mixed in? If there were no fine powder, why did some original bags have a priming horn?

Love your avatar! Is that a '33 Model A Ford? I got to ride in one in a Christmas parade when I was a kid. The car ahead of us was a 1926 Packard Twin 6 Roadster. I remember the sound of that engine to this day.

 

[SwanShot]

Correct me if I'm wrong. If you have a mesh that makes 2f, wont there be some finer grains mixed in? If there were no fine powder, why did some original bags have a priming horn?

Yes you would have a mix of sizes. What happens then is it's put through a finer screen, and a finer one untill you have 2,3,and 4f. So, yes there was finer powders, but it wasn't common.

 

[toot]

Ran into this interesting photo some years back…..Just about everything one could imagine…but no short starter…
View attachment 182839

I guess that he used under sized RB'S, in his gun. so didn't need one. I am sure that ha was aware of all of the items that he needed? jmho. BW-that is a beautiful set up, and with provenance!

 

[Mr. Flintlock]

The "Pipe Bomb" theory seems to be a myth. If you don't seat a projectile all the way down tight against the powder the barrel will not suddenly blow apart. Using an inexpensive rifle (Traditions Deer Hunter) I purposely loaded a full charge, but pushed the ball in only as far as the short starter would allow (about 5-inches). Even with 100-grains of 3F Goex, the ball blew out of the barrel with no harm to the rifle (or me!). This has been demonstrated on YouTube and elsewhere by other people may times too.

In an unmentionable, a squib that sticks the projectile in the barrel and then if "fired" again with the second projectile a full load and the squib stuck - can and will blow up the barrel. I've done this too, but not on purpose!

Maybe if you loaded your ML fully and then inadvertently put a second projectile in that was partially seated - maybe that would blow up the barrel. Just having a single projectile in the barrel off the powder ain't gonna blow it up though.

You only need to see a short started barrel blow up once to make you a believer. I've seen barrels bulged and I've seen barrels blow up. To say it doesn't happen is wrong and irresponsible. If you did it with no Ill effects.... Lucky you!

 

[Tom Compton]

Ran into this interesting photo some years back…..Just about everything one could imagine…but no short starter…
View attachment 182839

Just proves THAT SHOOTER Didn’t use a short starter …. Or it was lost.

We often think of ML tools and practices based on our period of interest. IMO the backwoods man hunters and less wealthy probably didn’t use them. Those wealthy enough to shoot for sport may well have. Another category of users, of which I belong, is Thor with arthritic hands making it difficult to properly grip a ram rod for the initial insertion. JMO.

 

[SamTex1949]

watching the U-tube of the 2 guys trying to blow up a barrel, if you slow down the video to 25% speed at moment of ignition it looks like you can see the barrel actually flex upward !

 

[Sparkitoff]

I did not say a barrel can’t blow up or bulge. What I said was that it doesn’t automatically turn into a pipe bomb. Of course you shouldn’t intentionally do this, why would you. If it were accidental, well you wouldn’t realize you did it. The peace of mind is knowing that if you ever do this accidentally no bad is automatic and actually odds are favorable that there will be no ill effect.

 

[Johnny Tremain]

33 Model A Ford

Model a Sedan
Model A ran between 1927-1931
Model B started in 32.

 

[jdw276]

Seen a short started ball bulge a barrel. Shooter said did not happen, took the short stsrter, lined it up on the barrel, bulge end of starter. Normal load, nothing special and I was NOT the shooter but next to them. 45 cal cva long rifle.

 

[Shadowalker164]

watching the U-tube of the 2 guys trying to blow up a barrel, if you slow down the video to 25% speed at moment of ignition it looks like you can see the barrel actually flex upward !

The shrapnel coming off that exploded barrel looked like an old school hand gernade, the old pineapple type.

 

[Eterry]

I guess that he used under sized RB'S, in his gun. so didn't need one. I am sure that ha was aware of all of the items that he needed? jmho. BW-that is a beautiful set up, and with provenance!

I shot my first muzzleloader for YEARS without a short starter. Somehow I survived.

 

[Eterry]

Correct me if I'm wrong. If you have a mesh that makes 2f, wont there be some finer grains mixed in? If there were no fine powder, why did some original bags have a priming horn?

Love your avatar! Is that a '33 Model A Ford? I got to ride in one in a Christmas parade when I was a kid. The car ahead of us was a 1926 Packard Twin 6 Roadster. I remember the sound of that engine to this day.

Thanks.
The last year of production for the Ford Model A is 1931. Mine is a bone stock 1930 Fordor.

 

[Mr. Flintlock]

I did not say a barrel can’t blow up or bulge. What I said was that it doesn’t automatically turn into a pipe bomb. Of course you shouldn’t intentionally do this, why would you. If it were accidental, well you wouldn’t realize you did it. The peace of mind is knowing that if you ever do this accidentally no bad is automatic and actually odds are favorable that there will be no ill effect.

What you said was that it seems to be a myth. It is far from a myth. I believe we've all read hunting stories about hunters inadvertently plugging their barrels with snow or mud with catastrophic results. You are right, it is not a given that it happens 100% of the time but when it does happen. It can be deadly.

 

[Mr. Flintlock]

If you leave an air gap of any size between the top of the powder and the bottom of the bullet, when you pull the trigger it causes the barrel to explode, destroy your eyes and fingers and kill the people either side of you. This is true because I read it on the internet. If mentioned enough times it becomes the truth.
This does not apply to those shooters who load their bullets 1/16” in front of their cartridges.

Cartridge guns use different steel than muzzleloaders. Also the breeches are reinforced and they use slower burning powders.

 

[david w]

Thanks.
The last year of production for the Ford Model A is 1931. Mine is a bone stock 1930 Fordor.

I meant to say '31. It had the slant windscreen.

 

[Felonious]

Don't forget there was one more grade and use for powder a long time ago, and that was "explosives". I put that in quotes because it doesn't actually explode, but it was used in a quarrying, tunneling, and mining up until "real" explosives became more prevalent.

I would be willing to bet that that's where, at least some of, the powder that was too fine to be used in firearms went. I would think fine powder would be more desirable for that use anyway.

 

[ronaldrothb49]

Cartridge guns use different steel than muzzleloaders. Also the breeches are reinforced and they use slower burning powders.

Actually smokeless powder is all over the burn rate from slow to ultra fast. you can get 60,000 PSI with 20 grains of some modern powders.