Need advice on collection of 4 unopened 1970s kits I just purchased

[SDSmlf]

Personally have no interest in these types of unopened kits, but there seems to be plenty of folks out there that do.

Posted this the other day in a different thread, but believe it applies here too. The sad irony in my opinion is that in all likelihood as an unassembled kit sealed in the box it is worth more than an unfired factory assembled gun or an unfired kit you or a ‘professional’ builder finished. Once it is out of the box and assembled it loses value….. interesting market.

 

[Capt. Jas.]

Move them as is for whatever you can get for them and apply the proceeds to the Kibler.

 

[DOUBLEDEUCE 1]

My experience with the Classic Arms kits was unfavorable. I bought their first offering, the pepper box kit. It was supposed to be made in the USA. After paying for it, I received several letters from the company saying the delivery would be in a few weeks, then months. It took over a year to get that thing. The anticipation, all the glossy ads and hype….what a tremendous disappointment.

Friends who purchased some of the other kits, ultimately gave them to me because they were disappointed and frustrated. By then the kits I received were being made in Korea. Broken bits, chips, tool marks and gouges in the barrels. Ill fitting parts, one barrel actually looked as if it had been threaded the length of the bore. It was just a deep gouge probably from a broken tool.

I am no stranger to working on firearms. I had four or five of those kits, each different. After much colorful language, one or two were thrown into the bay. The others went to the scrap yard and are now probably bumpers on Yugos.

 

[Eutycus]

Really? CVA Kentucky rifles used to have 2 piece barrels? I was not aware of that. I'm not doubting your word by any means just that I never heard that before.

 

[Eutycus]

What year did CVA /Jukar stop putting out kits with 2 piece barrels? I think I got mine in '84 or '85 and it was already 1 piece by then.

 

[Boatncamp]

My suggestion is to sell them as kits as this will net you the best return for your investment. Regardless of all the individuals who don`t like the CVA kits there are those interested in learning about traditional black powder guns but are not ready to drop north of $1000 to learn. I have no doubt you can net $1000 out of the 4 guns and you will then have a sizable portion of what you need to get yourself a flintlock kit that you can enjoy. I will keep a lookout for the twister to be listed. I built the New Orleans Ace around 1978 as a teenager and enjoyed it. Had a family friend that took it to work and had the barrel, hammer and trigger nickel plated for me for free. Made a nice little box for it in my father`s wood shop. At the same time I purchased a CVA Colonial Flintlock pistol kit that was a birthday present for my father. I still have both. more sentimental value than monetary but still value both

 

[Hiverano]

First question. What did you pay for them and how much $$$ do you expect to make off of them.

What you think they are worth and what you get for them can be completely different in today's market. With the way things are selling today it's a manure shoot anymore. Good luck ...

 

[Rifleman1776]

Really? CVA Kentucky rifles used to have 2 piece barrels? I was not aware of that. I'm not doubting your word by any means just that I never heard that before.

I doubt they deliberately manufactured them that way. I believe the two piece barrel that some folks got was simply due to lousy quality control standards and an attempt to make the product in the cheapest way possible.

 

[Hiverano]

I wouldn't give 10 bucks for the lot.

I'm with you, sorry when still in the business of selling muzzle loaders, CVA was at the bottom of the list ...

 

[vintovka]

I tend to go with actual realized sales prices on unassembled kits. Right now such kits are in high demand and sell for stupid high prices regardless of maker or quality. It seems being unassembled actually makes them "collectible" for that reason alone. Adding a specific search to bigger online gun auctions will tell. I will say i saw an unassembled 2 shot "twister" pistol sell just short of 4 benjamins!

 

[azmntman]

Well I personally have had excellent luck with all my CVA rifles. They do what I expect. They shoot acceptable (and in a few cases outstanding) groups and have been reliable as I used them. Same with Traditions. I'm ready now, light the fire.

 

[Ohio Rusty]

Hi folks! Hoping for some advice on a collection of kits I just acquired. Each kit is unopened (still in original plastic shrink wrapping & Box) and contains all original literature. Here's what I got:

CVA Kentucky Rifle Kit - .45 Percussion - 1978
CVA Colonial Pistol Kit - .45 Flintlock - 1978
Classic Arms - Snake Eyes Derringer Kit - .36 percussion double barrel - 1978
Classic Arms - Twister Derringer Kit - .36 percussion double barrel - 1978

I paid a decent price for the collection as I didn't want to see these get lost to a bunch of knuckleheads who wouldn't appreciate them. Better to see them go to a bunch of knuckleheads who would appreciate them lol. Anyway ... it was kind of a sight unseen deal but knowing they were all unopened and just the way they were the day they were purchased; I made an offer. They are in perfect condition as far as the kits go, minus some minor scuffing on the outer boxes ... a new traditions on the shelf at Cabela's probably isn't in as good of condition as these appear to be. Being unopened, there's no question as to whether or not all the parts are included.

My question is this ... should I re-sell these as is, finish them myself and resell them as completed pieces, or keep the set together and sell it as a collection. If the Kentucky rifle had been in flintlock, I might have considered keeping it and sell the rest .... but I already have two hawkens (TC and Pedersoli) in percussion and don't really need another percussion gun. Ideally, If I can make a couple bucks on the investment, I'd like to put it towards a Kibler kit.

Any thoughts or advice would be welcomed and appreciated. Thank you!

Build them all and keep all the guns for yourself. You can't replace them if you sell them. Enjoy them as shooting arms and pass them down to your kids and grandkids.
Ohio Rusty ><>

 

[OldRust]

My opinion is to sell the kits as is. There is someone out there who collects them.
Almost everybody collects something even if it’s dust.
I’ve also noticed over the years that a lot of the folks who look down their nose at the CVA’s quiet down when the fella beside them at the range out shoots them with a CVA.

Thanks,
O.R.

 

[DixieTexian]

I think you should do a really shoddy job building them, sign them "Mike Brooks," and then post them up for sale here.

 

[SDSmlf]

If I can make a couple bucks on the investment, I'd like to put it towards a Kibler kit.

Any thoughts or advice would be welcomed and appreciated. Thank you!

Back to your OP. Two options as you come to that old fork in the road. One, treat the collection as an investment and leave them as they are (unopened, unassembled kits) until you cash them out. Or, put them together and shoot them, likely significantly reducing their cash value individually and collectively. How much value reduction, I don’t know. Research what assembled kits are actually selling for compared to what unopened, unassembled kits are actually selling for (this might be more difficult, as unopened kits don’t get sold every day). Then decide what you want. Money towards a new gun or four 1970s lower end assembled kit guns. Not saying assembled they won’t be fine shooters, just a matter of where you want your money. And if you really want to go underwater, pay some top end builder to put the kits together. It would be interesting whether or not they would sign the finished kits.

Your question really isn’t about muzzleloaders, it’s about an investment. In my opinion, you should treat your collection as such.

 

[bpd303]

it's a manure shoot

Actually you can use the term crapshoot here. It has been used since 1880 and is a game involving dice.

Craps is a game in which players make wagers on the outcomes of rolls of dice. Because dice tumble randomly and the outcome is not predictable, craps is a game of chance. From this we can infer the meaning of the metaphorical term crapshoot—that is, a situation whose outcome is not predictable.

 

[pajeepman]

I would love to see pictures of the kits/boxes.

 

[dsotm]

Probably worth more unassembled

 

[senseisugarbear]

Sensisugarbear said: "

Rifleman, Your Opinion is a valid as anyone's here. But my 1st M/l was a CVA .45 Kentucky ,"

My first ml rifle was a finished CVA 'kentucky' flint rifle purchased in 1970. Among many other faults it had: a two piece barrel with twists going in opposite directions for each section; where they joined was a hang up that made loading difficult, mainspring was very soft and weak, frizzen was soft and rarely sparked. I could go on about fit, and etc. I lived near Friendship at the time. During an off weekend a local group gathered at the range for informal matches. I struggled through and at the end was given an award for the shooter having shot all fifteen matches with the lowest score. The award was a Sid Bell powderhorn pin. I still have and wear it proudly to this day. To me, CVA is almost a four letter word. BTW, I later opened a gun shop specializing in muzzle loaders. I quickly gave up selling CVA products because of issues like I described. Customers were not happy with me selling them such low quality guns. Enuf said.

Rifleman, I hope you still have that rifle.I'm interested in buying it...as a factory error. Display only. seems to Me that the guys that have more Money than Me, would pay BIG for an ODDITY such as that...Be Safe>>>>>>Wally

 

[Dale Lilly]

CVAs were all bad? My deceased first wife won a fairly large shoot in Arizona many years ago. She used a CVA Frontier rifle shooting against high end rifles, some custom made. I still have that rifle, and my current sweetie loves it,. Different strokes for different folks. Polecat