Need help identifying this shotgun

[SamPNW]

Hello, My uncle recently passed away and while cleaning out his very full house I found this percussion cap double barrel shotgun. Since I'm the firearm owner of the family its my job to figure out what it is. So I thought this would be the place to look for some help. I took a bunch of pictures, and its in terrible shape so I'm not hoping for anything more just curious about the history.

 

[Sam squanch]

English or Belgian. That would be a nice candidate for restoration.

 

[Rudyard]

There appears to be a name on the rib could be decieved ??It would be good if you let the hammer s down at rest. Not just by pulling the trigger it is in a state but many a wreck has been worthy of restoration. Any makers name on the lock ? the gold looking on the rib looks like 'London Fine Twist' referring to the manufacture of the barrels Ide suggest you don't do any radical refurbishing maybe a rub of linseed oil on the stock rub it in but don't let it go sticky . Looks OK considering .
Rudyard's view

 

[SamPNW]

These were the best picture I could get. Thanks for the tip on looking at the lock, I gently rubbed in some gun grease and found this.

 

[Rudyard]

These were the best picture I could get. Thanks for the tip on looking at the lock, I gently rubbed in some gun grease and found this.

Sorry I cant make it out have you a glass to see it better ? & what proof marks are under the barrel & what dose the trigger guard finial look like ?. Be carefull not to pull the slideing key too hard its pinned in the slot we'le get there yet.
Regards Rudyard

 

[French Colonial]

The rib says "Warranted Fine Twist" the engraving on the lock border is wiggle engraving and the rest of it is pretty poor quality. My guess is it is a cheap Belgian gun but the proof marks will tell the tale.

 

[Sam squanch]

I would get a long dowel rod and see if it’s loaded or not. Many of these old guns are.

 

[SamPNW]

I should have said before I did rod the barrel and its unloaded, always great advice. I was able to gently get the barrels off and after some light rust removal this was what I got

 

[Clark Badgett]

I should have said before I did rod the barrel and its unloaded, always great advice. I was able to gently get the barrels off and after some light rust removal this was what I got

English proofs

 

[Rudyard]

I would get a long dowel rod and see if it’s loaded or not. Many of these old guns are.

Yes sound advise
Rudyard has to agree

I should have said before I did rod the barrel and its unloaded, always great advice. I was able to gently get the barrels off and after some light rust removal this was what I got

Birmingham proofs post 1814 , While that ' Wiggle' engraving is crude not normal but there it is. Will a magnifying glass reveal the maker or retailer then chances are fair I can give you a date & location perhaps Probable date 50s or sixties could be much later not every one wanted a new breech loading affair and exports to places where cartridges where not always available or as cost efficient as to what load the owner though suitable as with India .I had to buy a Navy Arms double ML as part of a purchase of some old machinery in 1980s Australia old chap was brought up on MLs didn't want a BL affair family had been market hunters shooting waterfowl along the Murray river with a big bored punt gun now illegal but I restored it & a big shoulder gun not that he used either but such was his tastes .. Me I don't use central fire shotguns BLs Happy with my old under lever Pin fire if I have to go 'Modern" Like as 'Guest Gun' at a UK Syndicate shoot They didn't like my MLs & the old pinfire was as modern as I owned. bowled more birds than my host with his nitro No time for hammerless guns Uglee .
Rudyard's take on such things

 

[bpd303]

English or Belgian. That would be a nice candidate for restoration.

I have to agree, old English guns are not that common, don't know if it could be brought back to shooting condition without having hands on inspection though.

 

[Sam squanch]

let’s import Rudyard! Give him a place to work and sleep and he may go over it. I don’t know how much he eats, though….

 

[SamPNW]

I don't think I'm the one to try and fully restore this, so I'm not really sure what to do with it. Does anybody think this is worth anything? Or should I maybe just hang it up in my garage

 

[Clark Badgett]

I don't think I'm the one to try and fully restore this, so I'm not really sure what to do with it. Does anybody think this is worth anything? Or should I maybe just hang it up in my garage

Go for it.

 

[Sam squanch]

You don’t need to restore it to perfect shooting condition. Just a cleaning and oil will make it look better. Make a wooden cradle for it to display!

 

[Brian Anderson]

looks like it only wants to be used / spent a good part of my youth using those effectively
the nipples appear to need attention and the lock internals need checking out
Enjoy

 

[TFoley]

English proofs

...from Birmingham. AND calibre, too. 12 bore/gauge.

 

[TFoley]

The rib says "Warranted Fine Twist" the engraving on the lock border is wiggle engraving and the rest of it is pretty poor quality. My guess is it is a cheap Belgian gun but the proof marks will tell the tale.

I agree - that awful attempt at engraving a flower-like feature would have resulted in the engraver getting a flea in his ear and a fine for desecrating a lock-plate.

Tens of thousand of Belgian-made guns came to England, were proofed in either Birmingham [THE centre if the gun trade in England] or London, for sale all over the world. Some would have had spurious 'maker's names, like Hulland & Hulland, Wm Buss, Alex. Mortin et al. Doesn't mean they were bad, just cheaper guns for the average farmer on a growing country like the US of A. Sears, Roebuck catalogue has a dozenpages of them...

 

[Sam squanch]

'maker's names, like Hulland & Hulland, Wm Buss, Alex. Mortin et al

We once saw a knockoff restaurant-“Waffle Hut”, next door to” Burger Queen “…..

 

[TFoley]

We once saw a knockoff restaurant-“Waffle Hut”, next door to” Burger Queen “…..

The handguns of the kind we talk not of were also 'knocked-off'. Large roll-stamps on the top of the barrel reading 'Suitable for SMITH & WESSON cartridges',
'Welby & Scot', and so on.....