Patch and Powder

[avid6gnnr]

Well, being new and all I have browsed around and feel somewhat outclassed. I am relatively new to the black arts and last year had alot of problems with accuracy with my Lyman Deerstalker (be easy on me, I gotta start somewhere).

I am so glad to find this forum, as I know I can probably trash alot of the advice I got at the range.

Questions:

Is .020 patch to tight? I was told that the tighter the patch the better. Is this true? I have not really experimented with .015 or .010, but even with .020 the accuracy just is not there.

When I started I was told to prime it up with 4F and use 2F as the main charge. Should I be using 3F for the main charge instead?

Thanks for the help guys. I will have more questions coming. The PA flintlock season is just around the corner.

 

[Rebel]

I assume you have a .50 cal.? If so, what size rd balls are you using? A .490 with a .015-.020 should work. Go to WalMart and get some of their Blue/white or Red/White pillow ticking. You can use a grease type lube but for just target shooting spit patch it. Stick the end of a strip, that you have cut about 1 1/2" wide, in your mouth while you pour the 70 gr load of 3f powder in, the center a .490 rd ball on that wet piece of ticking, start it just below the muzzle with your short starter, and cut it flush with a sharp knife. Ram it home, prime the pan with the same 3f powder, take aim and fire. You can try different powder charges to see about a better group, but normally 70-80 gr of 3f shoots good in a .50 cal.

 

[bart_anastasi]

Welcome.

First of all you might want to remember that every rifle is going to be and do its own thing. But there are some rules. and generaly you have it right.

Working with a single patch material and lube. Try varying the amount of powder you add to find a combination that your gun likes. Also pay attentiion the patch you are using is telling you something. If it is burning thru your lube might be to weak or your powder to much.

There are a lot of discussions in the site on getting the most accuracy from a M/L and you should look there for some basic and advanced information

 

[paulvallandigham]

YOu have to measure both the bore diameter of your rifle, and the groove diameter. Get a caliper( borrow one if you have to) and measure the land to land dimension and write it down, then measure the groove to groove dimension. The land dimension is the Bore Dimension! It should be close to the size or caliber stamped on the barrel. If you have a .50 caliber barrel, the Bore diameter should be very close to .500". measure everything to the thousandth of an inch. The groove diameter, can run from .508-.512" and some will be even greater than that. The deeper the groove, the thicker the patch material you will need to use.

I recommend using an Over powder Wad( OP wad) on top of the powder charge, to seal the gases behind the PRB, and protect the patching from being burned with heavy charges.

If you buy pillow ticking. be sure to wash and dry the fabric in a washer/dryer to remove the sizing put in it to make it lay flat. Sizing is a starch like substance, and it tastes terrible, if you decided to use spit patches! It also makes it harder for oils, and lubes to fully penetrate the fabric, and that causes eratic groups. Measure the thickness of the fabric AFTER it has been washed and dried. You can use either a caliper, or micrometer. Expect the fabric to compress about half its thickness, so that is why a patch between a .490" ball and a .500" bore that measures .015" can do down the barrel fairly easily. Even a .020" patch will go down a cleaned barrel easily. The excess material gathers in the grooves.

Test only one change at a time, and use a bench rest to steady the rifle and your aim to eliminate as many human factors as possible during the testing. 5 shot groups will tell you more than a 3 shot group. When you have tried all your various patch combinations with powder charges, then consider trying a few .495" balls, and even some .500" balls with the patches to see if you can get even better accuracy. Try different lubes, but change only one thing at a time during our testing. ( for example, DO NOT change both the diameter of the Ball, and the lube you use at the same time for testing. You won't know if its the ball diameter, or the lube that causes a change, for better or worse in your groups. )

Yes, it takes a lot of time to find the best load for a particular gun. Some people are lucky enough to find a terrific load in a few minutes of shooting. Most of us spend months testing this and that to find out what works. The recommendations you can get here, once you tell us the caliber, the actual dimensions of the bore and grooves, the powder you are using, the barrel's Rate of Twist, the diameter of the ball you want to use, the patching thickness you have on hand, and the length of your barrel, and what kind of sights you are using on it, and the range you are going to test at, will go a long way to helping you reduce the time it takes to work up your load. The time taken is not wasted, because it allows you to become totally familiar with your rifle.

 

[Many Klatch]

I like a fairly loose patch ball combination. I don't like to use a hammer and a short starter to load. It's all in what you like and the degree of accuracy that suits you. If you are looking for 1 inch holes at 75 yards while shooting off a benc, then you will need a really tight patch and ball combination. If you are going to do all your shooting offhand and feel that minute of beer can shooting is OK then a looser combination will suit your needs.

Most of my shooting is offhand at gongs and targets at 25 to 50 yards. I use a spit patched .015 patch with a .526 ball in my 54 caliber rifle. It loads easy whether clean or dirty and shoots well enough to make me happy.

Many Klatch

 

[playfarmers]

I used a percussion Deerstalker for about 15 or so years, and found the .495 ball worked best. It was very fussy about too much lube, and also needed a felt wad under the patched ball. A 80g charge of Pyrodex worked best for me, but because yours is a flinter, stick with 3f black powder. I got excellant accuracy from that rifle, enabling me to take many whitetails 3 of them at around 100 yards. As sayed, change one thing at a time. Good luck.

 

[tg]

"Stick the end of a strip, that you have cut about 1 1/2" wide, in your mouth while you pour the 70 gr load of 3f powder in,"

would that powder be poured into the mouth???

 

[Rebel]

Only if yer braver than me. :grin:

 

[avid6gnnr]

Rebel, I switched to the pillow tick and the 3f this weekend, and my group has never been better. I also bought a tube of the T/C Bore Butter for the lube.

Thanks alot to everyone for responding.

 

[Rebel]

Glad to help. Glad you are getting it figured out.