Pecatonica swamped barrel tang installation problem

[Eric Krewson]

I bought the kit 3rd hand, still in the box, it was a TOW Haines kit. I bought the kit for $650 shipped, I ran the numbers on the TOW order form and came up with $1100, not counting the grade 5 wood plus TOW cutting all of the dovetails and installing the butt plate.

I did send the "P" place a picture of their lousy inletting, they didn't respond. Being 3rd hand, I didn't feel they bore any responsibility for a replacement but hoped they would be more careful in the future. There were at least a dozen other MAJOR flaws in the pre-carve as well.

 

[Mina]

I had to move the plate forward and up a tad. Have not drilled the lock plate hole through the bolster. Just now have penciled the approx position. Also I have not pinned the barrel, but the spots for those pins are marked on both sides the stock. After Monday when appliance/utilities servicemen finish repairs and updates I will, at last, set up to drill with press and hand drill. It is like walking to the end of a high dive and back.

Friday night 15 Mar 2024 Have put in 2 of the three barrel to stock pins (1/16"). Broke two bits in doing that and have only one bit left. Expect a pack of them Monday. Tedious work.

 

[bpd303]

And what's with all these screen blocking popups? I can barely see the screen to type.

One way to eliminate them is to become a supporting member.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/index.php?account/upgrades

 

[Mina]

One way to eliminate them is to become a supporting member.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/index.php?account/upgrades

I'm going to become a member today. Meaning I will contribute some money. Follow-up...just now I figured out how to cancel the automatic yearly renewal feature I "accidently" (ahem) signed up for. It took some time and patience searching. I did not appreciate not being given a chance to see that I was acquiescing to that convenient feature of having my bank account yearly debited. In fact it pissed me off big time. So beware of that kink in the smooth supporting membership sign up and payment process. Finally, I notice there is a popup ad that keeps appearing at the bottom of this page. So, that is still a nuisance.

 

[mikesto44]

Not sure why your breaking your drill bits. But when I drill for barrel pins. I drill till it touches the barrel lug enough to mark it. This I do on both sides of the stock and for each lug. Then I remove the barrel an finish drilling through all barrel lugs. Then insert the barrel and push the pins in. I do this with a hand drill also. Works for me anyway. Others may disagree.

 

[Mina]

The first breakage was because I hooked the bit as I was removing the stock with barrel off the spike on the drill press. The second was when using a hand drill vertically. I had left the barrel in the stock. Bit had just gone through the lug (middle one of the three). I did not manage to keep the old fashioned twist drill steady. Today I'll just skip using the drill press, because it would be unwieldy to use it that far down the barrel/stock and because the distance between the marked spots on either side the stock is far less than even at the middle. I can eye ball this one. The packet of 1/16" bits arrived yesterday.

 

[ronaldrothb49]

Friday night 15 Mar 2024 Have put in 2 of the three barrel to stock pins (1/16"). Broke two bits in doing that and have only one bit left. Expect a pack of them Monday. Tedious work.

I have broken drill bits using a drill and using a drill press. With a drill I couldn't keep the drill straight. with the drill press if I put too much pressure on it or the stock moved just slightly the bit would pop. I now use a jig I made that I can set up where I want the holes then lock the rifle in place so it can't move. I can then drill the hole using a light even pressure letting the drill do it's work, if you have to put a lot of pressure on it then your bit is probably dull and needs to be replaced. Then I slide the jig down to the next hole without taking the rifle out. Works great that way.

 

[Mina]

I have broken drill bits using a drill and using a drill press. With a drill I couldn't keep the drill straight. with the drill press if I put too much pressure on it or the stock moved just slightly the bit would pop. I now use a jig I made that I can set up where I want the holes then lock the rifle in place so it can't move. I can then drill the hole using a light even pressure letting the drill do it's work, if you have to put a lot of pressure on it then your bit is probably dull and needs to be replaced. Then I slide the jig down to the next hole without taking the rifle out. Works great that way.

Considering my age, this will be the first and last long rifle I will start and finish. If I were younger and were ambitious I'd make my own jig like you did. I am a mind to later do a flintlock pistol.

 

[deerstalkert]

if you do a pistol, and do it from a blank, you will find it is just as much work as a long gun. at least for me it is!

 

[ronaldrothb49]

Considering my age, this will be the first and last long rifle I will start and finish. If I were younger and were ambitious I'd make my own jig like you did. I am a mind to later do a flintlock pistol.

I am 74 don't do much shooting any more due to injuries to my back and my right hand, only have about 60% use of my hand. Still building trying to use all the parts I have sitting around sometimes have to stop working on them and give my hand a rest so I don't have to be popping pain pills. Still have parts to build 4 more rifles and 3 pistols. Currently finishing a pistol and have a rifle in the works. I have a Douglas Barrel that I have had probably over 30 years. Pistols aren't any easier and they have unique pain in the ass features all there own. Good luck.

 

[Mina]

I am 74 don't do much shooting any more due to injuries to my back and my right hand, only have about 60% use of my hand. Still building trying to use all the parts I have sitting around sometimes have to stop working on them and give my hand a rest so I don't have to be popping pain pills. Still have parts to build 4 more rifles and 3 pistols. Currently finishing a pistol and have a rifle in the works. I have a Douglas Barrel that I have had probably over 30 years. Pistols aren't any easier and they have unique pain in the ass features all there own. Good luck.

In early mid July I'll be 82 with limited use of my L index finger and have to use a stick to keep myself upright. This morning I hand drilled the last 1/16" pin hole for stock to bbl lug from both directions and finally through the lug. Much to my disgust, when I tied to insert the (cut off and beveled) nail provided by "P" it did not hit the hole and went askew, creating a new hole. Maple tooth picks are plugging the old distant hole. Gap between stripped lock plate and barrel is tight--cannot pass a 0.0015 feeler gage-- fore and aft---but will do so at and below the pan. Obviously I must drop back five yards and punt.

 

[Hatman/2nd line]

Tongue and cheek about the inlet being off a bit.

It took this to fix it.

View attachment 302766

View attachment 302767

View attachment 302768

That's a good job! I plan on ordering a kit from Pec. and now I know I will not get it precarved, just the barrel channel and the ramrod, thanks for showing this! Rich

 

[ronaldrothb49]

That's a good job! I plan on ordering a kit from Pec. and now I know I will not get it precarved, just the barrel channel and the ramrod, thanks for showing this! Rich

There is nothing wrong with the Pecatonica precarves they can save you a lot of time. Just don't get it with the lock inlet which is an option.

 

[Hatman/2nd line]

There is nothing wrong with the Pecatonica precarves they can save you a lot of time. Just don't get it with the lock inlet which is an option.

Yeah, I agree, I've built some of Chambers' guns , some with it and some without and they were pretty good but I've read of people having problems with Pecatonica, than again maybe it was the person building it?
So, I agree with you , I'll order it with just the barrel and ramrod done.
Thanks, Rich

 

[Mina]

Finally I have relocated this build thread. Having lost it, I've been periodically posting progress reports anywhere but here. I'm in process of tapping and countersinking 1/4-28 stainless steel flash liner (not lightning). Elsewhere I covered adding a grub to the lock plate to relieve some pressure on the hammer. It worked.

 

[rp77469]

Finally I have relocated this build thread. Having lost it, I've been periodically posting progress reports anywhere but here. I'm in process of tapping and countersinking 1/4-28 stainless steel flash liner (not lightning). Elsewhere I covered adding a grub to the lock plate to relieve some pressure on the hammer. It worked.

Just found this thread and will look for the missing posts. Great read with many experts chiming in. I have a Jackie Brown rifle with 0.022" gap between barrel and pan. You have given me things to look for. Thanks to all!

 

[Mina]

Just found this thread and will look for the missing posts. Great read with many experts chiming in. I have a Jackie Brown rifle with 0.022" gap between barrel and pan. You have given me things to look for. Thanks to all!

Well, I've learned some new things this morning. The most important one is that the 1/4-90 degree countersink has an outside diameter on the shank of the THL S4S 1/4-28 flash hole liner. No wonder that, because I pre counterbored (at the 1/16" pre-pilot hole) to what I thought would be the diameter of the head of the flash hole liner, the bevel disappeared after I drilled the actual 1/4-28 pilot hole. Luckily I had a big 90 degree counter sink with a huge diameter to tackle the problem of accommodating the flange. It took a lot of trying to get the head flush. I mill filled the head flush and slicked the barrel flat. Then I fitted things back together to see if the mill filling effected the non-gap I had started with.
Probably it didn't. I've managed to clamp the lock in place and see no gap between barrel and pan. I am having a huge problem (#2 of morning) trying to thread the rear bolt into the lock plate. I can do it out of the stock, but so far no luck with it all in place on the stock. I can easily put in the forward screw. This irritating problem only arose because I had previously sawed the protruding end off the rear bolt so the hammer would clear. I had a nut that fitted it and was fooling with beveling the saw marks when I dropped that nut. I heard it bounce twice, but the big magnet can't find it.

10:25 p.m. 10 Dec '24. Found the nut and located an original length rear lock plate screw. It would screw into the lock plate. With the lock slightly off the mortice I could align that long screw. Why not the short one that had previously fitted--the one I cut a tip off? I had to enlarge that rear screw hole slightly in order for the shorter screw to easily be screwed into the lock plate. The ram rod is not in any way hindered by the forward lock plate screw. And, last but not least, there is no gap at the pan/bolster with the barrel. Next to be done is shortening the butt and installing the butt and toe plates. Shooting for 13.75"

 

[Mina]

Finally I have relocated this build thread. Having lost it, I've been periodically posting progress reports anywhere but here. I'm in process of tapping and countersinking 1/4-28 stainless steel flash liner (not lightning). Elsewhere I covered adding a grub to the lock plate to relieve some pressure on the hammer. It worked.

The grub screw relieved pressure exerted by the big spring of the trigger plate. I can and did fine tune it.

 

[Mina]

13-14 Dec '24 I spent hours removing the sprue from a brass butt plate using files and hack saw cuts. Then it was on to trueing the edges and polishing it. Did the latter "with a hoodiddle to it". Best thing is that I found online a video of someone doing the jobs that I did and intend to do with a brass butt plate. Only I don't have a band saw. He had a fantastic "slick" chisel. Sharp as can be, as Andy Griffin might have said.

 

[Mina]

20 Dec 2024 Realized that I should add to my tool collection a 12 inch bow saw ,so that I can cut down the stock for the intended pull length less the thickness of the plate. They are expensive new. I found a used one really cheap. The vintage Marples and a new blade and tensioning cord have shipping numbers. I need suggestions as to how to properly draw the outline of the lower part of the cast brass butt plate onto both sides of the over long pre-shaped stock. The demonstration I mentioned above was using a flat stock blank. He made the bandsaw cut at the rear and then band sawed the notch for the register. I saw another man do the register's necessary horizontal and then the vertical cuts using a back saw. But his butt curve had already been sawn on his pre-shaped stock. (I hope he likes his predetermined pull.) I want to pencil draw both cut lines and the curve lines with absolute accuracy. How is this done?