Pedersoli Brown Bess

[Magungo1066]

How are they? Are they good guns?

 

[Britsmoothy]

They're ok. Just greedy!

 

[3Setters]

So they are female guns?

 

[Musketeer]

I love mine and have no serious complaints after several years of (admittedly somewhat moderate) use. It sparks well, goes off fast (despite having a low vent, as is quite common with them), and shoots well. The trigger is a bit stiff, but not horrible, and mine has a small inletting defect around the side plate (a bit of extra room between plate and wood for about a half inch span near the middle of the plate), but that's it as far as fit and finish. All other inletting and other wood and metal finishing are excellent.

I did notice in Mike Beliveau's videos from back in October on a Pedersoli Bess he'd acquired that the ramrod in his gun was very loose, slipping very easily into and out of the thimbles and rattling around when in the gun. The rod in mine was nice and snug and required a good bit of force to remove or insert into the gun when new and continues to require the same amount of effort these few years later, so it's clear there can be some QC inconsistencies with these from time to time. We had another member recently purchase one, and his had all sorts of cosmetic issues, which leads one to believe that QC troubles may be more pronounced right now due to the current madness going on and the resulting scramble to keep up, though I can't say that with 100% certainty.

 

[dave_person]

Hi,
Depends on what you want. They are generally competently made but often with apparent mass production short cuts like sloppy machine cut mortices and compromises on the historical correctness of the stock and hardware. If you want a historically correct Brown Bess musket of any pattern, you have to have one custom made from correct parts. If you are not concerned about historical details and just want a musket for plinking or reenacting, they are OK. They certainly were the best of the commercially made muskets some years ago but I am not not so sure anymore. Here is a link to a thread showing how to turn one into a better musket:
New Reworking a Pedersoli Brown Bess

dave

 

[Grenadier1758]

Is the Pedersoli (Short Land Pattern) Brown Bess a "good gun"? As many others in the reenacting community have seen, they tend to function well. So, on that note the Pedersoli Brown Bess is a "good gun". So the next question to be answered is, "What is your intended purpose for this good gun?"

Since my representation is set during the French and Indian War, the Short Land Pattern, while accepted by some units, is not correct. I could not afford the custom built Long Land Pattern musket and I did not want to wait the two to three years to gather up the parts from the Rifle Shoppe. They were even slower 10 years ago than now. My choice was to go for a more correct Long Land Pattern from Loyalist Arms. Yes, it is manufactured in India. Yes the wood is heavier than walnut and the metal in the barrel is heavier with the result of a heavier Land Pattern King's Musket. In the F&I War, there was no distinction of Long or Short Land Pattern Musket. My Loyalist Arm's musket is as reliable in firing as the Pedersolis are. Mine is substantial enough for live fire with round ball. Accuracy on target is on par with the Pedersoli Brown Bess and fairly close to being as accurate as the one Rifle Shoppe musket in the unit.

 

[Rock Home Isle]

How are they? Are they good guns?

I have a Pedersoli Brown Bess carbine that I built from a kit many years ago. Not the full sized musket, but the general details should transfer over...I do own several Pedersoli firearms, all of them muzzleloader long guns.

The Brown Bess is very functional, the parts are high quality and everything went together nicely. The lock sparks very well, and with a nice sharp flint, it never fails to go off. The fit of the Frizzen to the pan was my only problem, there was a very noticeable gap. I had to refit the frizzen. After the fit was adjusted, I also re-hardened it.

The gun has been on many hunting trips and has harvested a lot of game since being in my possession. I would highly recommend getting Pedersoli products

 

[103]

I figured I would ask this in this thread rather than start a new one. I have a few pedersoli guns, and I do like them quite a bit. Any mass produced repro is going to need work to look correct.

I just picked up a cut back (about 3 inches) pedersoli Bess. The ramrod has also been cut back (not rethreaded). But the ramrod is very loose—it falls out if you point the muzzle down. Any ideas on how to tighten it up?

 

[Rock Home Isle]

I figured I would ask this in this thread rather than start a new one. I have a few pedersoli guns, and I do like them quite a bit. Any mass produced repro is going to need work to look correct.

I just picked up a cut back (about 3 inches) pedersoli Bess. The ramrod has also been cut back (not rethreaded). But the ramrod is very loose—it falls out if you point the muzzle down. Any ideas on how to tighten it up?

When I built my Bess Carbine...I do recall a narrowed section at the end of the ramrod trough. Carefully remove the barrel and see if that is there or not...if it is present, then thread the end of the ramrod and you should be fine....

 

[smoothshooter]

When I built my Bess Carbine...I do recall a narrowed section at the end of the ramrod trough. Carefully remove the barrel and see if that is there or not...if it is present, then thread the end of the ramrod and you should be fine....

How does the threading help? There would be no dimensional change. I would think carefully laying in a couple of very thin, strategically-located beads of epoxy to tighten uo the interior dimensions of the channel somewhere below the entry thimble would take care of the problem after they have hardened and been carefully sanded down to create the desired resistance.
The end of the ramrod still need to be threaded.

 

[Rock Home Isle]

That pocket was a sung fit for the threaded end. It this rod is cut off and unthreaded, it won't fit into that pocket.

 

[Britsmoothy]

I think there is a flat spring to retain the ram. Sounds like it's been removed in this case. Maybe due to the taper being lost to the rammer.
Should of been shortened from the other end!

 

[FlinterNick]

I think there is a flat spring to retain the ram. Sounds like it's been removed in this case. Maybe due to the taper being lost to the rammer.
Should of been shortened from the other end!

Pedersoli Brown Bess’s don’t have a rammer spring.

i added a rammer spring to a few pedersoli Bess’s. The traditional method is in the rear entry pipe which did work however the fit was a little too tight and put too much pressure on the thimble. The springs have to be somewhat smaller and pear shaped at the tip end.

The 1776 Rifle had a sheet metal rammer guide between the thimbles, while it was odd looking it did work.

Historically most Brown Bess’s didn’t have rammer springs, the India pattern 3rd models sold by IMA do have rear entry pipes with springs riveted to them.

The best way to add a rammer spring to a bess like a pedersoli is 5-6 inches from the breech by cutting a rammer spoon mortise in the barrel channel. You would secure the spring by welding a lug like piece of steel to the barrel and then fastening the spring to the lug with a pin or screw, french and Dutch muskets used this method. This is not typically what was done on British guns, but it works very well.

One thing I’ve seen reinactor s do is slightly bend the ram rod end so its hardly noticible and that usually creates friction enough to hodl in the rod.

 

[FlinterNick]

Pedersoli’s Brown Bess really should be called a second model Brown Bess, its just a modern copy likely a third model that was modified to be worked in Pedersoli’s CNC machine shops.

The Lock is reliable just doesn’t really look authentic, but it works well for most, the springs on a pedersoli are not the strongest, I’ve replaced two on my own because I though the pressure was too weak.

The Stock is smaller in the butt and longer in the wrist, you only see this mostly on third models and contract Bess’s, and its not an exact match. The wood on the lock mortise and fore stock is generally not shapped well and has too many edges. Tear Drop carvings were done away with on Brown Bess muskets after 1742,

If I were to get a pedersoli today, it would be either used or in a kit form which Dixie Gun Works does sell.

 

[Britsmoothy]

Pedersoli Brown Bess’s don’t have a rammer spring.

i added a rammer spring to a few pedersoli Bess’s. The traditional method is in the rear entry pipe which did work however the fit was a little too tight and put too much pressure on the thimble. The springs have to be somewhat smaller and pear shaped at the tip end.

The 1776 Rifle had a sheet metal rammer guide between the thimbles, while it was odd looking it did work.

Historically most Brown Bess’s didn’t have rammer springs, the India pattern 3rd models sold by IMA do have rear entry pipes with springs riveted to them.

The best way to add a rammer spring to a bess like a pedersoli is 5-6 inches from the breech by cutting a rammer spoon mortise in the barrel channel. You would secure the spring by welding a lug like piece of steel to the barrel and then fastening the spring to the lug with a pin or screw, french and Dutch muskets used this method. This is not typically what was done on British guns, but it works very well.

One thing I’ve seen reinactor s do is slightly bend the ram rod end so its hardly noticible and that usually creates friction enough to hodl in the rod.

Ahhr. I must be mixed up with another. That coupled with my carbine model feeling as though it had a spring. The rammer was straight but was somehow securely held.
Thanks.

 

[FlinterNick]

Ahhr. I must be mixed up with another. That coupled with my carbine model feeling as though it had a spring. The rammer was straight but was somehow securely held.
Thanks.

With the Bess I’m currently working on, I made sure the thimbles were stepped down toward the breech, meaning each Was inlet a little deeper toward the breech, while this works for a wood rod, I’m not so sure it would for a steel rod.

I think the pedersoli thimbles are thicker for steel rammers, Miruko’s rammer pipes were very chunky and held down the rod pretty securely.

 

[103]

Anyone know the thread pitch for the ramrod?

 

[griffiga]

My Bess is a TOWER, I think made by Navy Arms. I picked it up off a guy that couldn't make it shoot. Come to find out, it had three balls shoved down the barrel along with the remains of a puller screw that had broken off. Looks like someone loaded it with ball first without realizing it then another powder and ball then another ball. Then tried to remove it will a puller that broke. Ended up removing the breech plug to get it all out. Shoots fine now, but I haven't played around with many loads. Anybody have a good load they would share (paper cartridge, patched ball etc.). Thanks

 

[FlinterNick]

My Bess is a TOWER, I think made by Navy Arms. I picked it up off a guy that couldn't make it shoot. Come to find out, it had three balls shoved down the barrel along with the remains of a puller screw that had broken off. Looks like someone loaded it with ball first without realizing it then another powder and ball then another ball. Then tried to remove it will a puller that broke. Ended up removing the breech plug to get it all out. Shoots fine now, but I haven't played around with many loads. Anybody have a good load they would share (paper cartridge, patched ball etc.). Thanks

Those miruko barrels are very good. I’ve loaded them with up to 100 grains in the past with 1F and 80 of 2F and 60 of 3F.

Just watch the wood on those, most were made of some low grade maple or birch that will chip at the end grains.

 

[Rock Home Isle]

I think there is a flat spring to retain the ram. Sounds like it's been removed in this case. Maybe due to the taper being lost to the rammer.
Should of been shortened from the other end!

My CVA Mountain Rifle has a Retension-Spring for the ramrod...but my Pedersoli Brown Bess does not.